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Question of the Day: How do you normally pay for purchases in stores?
quovadis
Honorary Master
Sounds like a feasible option to me for telcos!
I'm no financial guru but 400 homes costing R264,000 + R6,400,000 = R6,640,000 = R16660 per home. Bundle that into a 24 month contract (as is the norm it seems these days) and you end up with a base cost of R694.00.
Let's assume that the maintenance cost adds an additional R100 per month per home and add 30% profit on top of this = R1032.20 which I'm sure most of us would be willing to pay for a 100mbit/s or 1gbit/s connection.
I think the main thing here is to assume 1,600 users along the long haul route. So that would equate to:
R264,000 x4
R6,640,000 x1
= R7,696,000
Divide by 1600 users = R4810 initial cost / 24 months = R200.00 per month + Maintenance + Profit could equal less than R400.00.
I realise we still need to add the ISP portion however it's safe to say that the long-haul major cost would add considerable other possibilites for other homes along the route which could reduce this cost further. Just goes to show how much fat the whole DSL network currently has.
I'm no financial guru but 400 homes costing R264,000 + R6,400,000 = R6,640,000 = R16660 per home. Bundle that into a 24 month contract (as is the norm it seems these days) and you end up with a base cost of R694.00.
Let's assume that the maintenance cost adds an additional R100 per month per home and add 30% profit on top of this = R1032.20 which I'm sure most of us would be willing to pay for a 100mbit/s or 1gbit/s connection.
I think the main thing here is to assume 1,600 users along the long haul route. So that would equate to:
R264,000 x4
R6,640,000 x1
= R7,696,000
Divide by 1600 users = R4810 initial cost / 24 months = R200.00 per month + Maintenance + Profit could equal less than R400.00.
I realise we still need to add the ISP portion however it's safe to say that the long-haul major cost would add considerable other possibilites for other homes along the route which could reduce this cost further. Just goes to show how much fat the whole DSL network currently has.
quovadis
Honorary Master
Another thought - I'm sure people wouldn't mind an installation cost of R2,000-R5,000 if it was a 1gbit/s or 1mbit/s connection - so Initial Cost would be recovered even quicker. If the telcos used ethernet as the base it wouldn't even require specialised equipment at each home. Add a couple of wifi links etc and the telcos could benefit from a massive wireless hotspot/zone as well.
Sting
Ghost in the Machine
What about the Core costs? The numbers quoted are for the last mile. To convert all the copper based technologies to fibre will be a significant cost as well, eg. replace all DSLAMS with fibre type switches, massive increase in backhaul links to accommodate increased traffic, etc.
Make no mistake about it, when FTTH arrives I'll be one of the first to sign up!
Make no mistake about it, when FTTH arrives I'll be one of the first to sign up!
iCubed.Saajid
Well-Known Member
Nice analogy, but the flow is in reverse.
I'm not sure what this article is trying to highlight. Are they saying it is too expensive to roll out in RSA? I, and thousands, if not 100's of thousands of South Africans would pay R1000-R1200 per month, locked into a 24 month contract, for a 100mbps or even 50mbps symmetrical uncapped fibre connection. I'd then cancel DSTV, cancel ADSL line rental, cancel my ISP packages, cancel Telkom voice line rental, throw in an extra R400 odd, and get all my media, entertainment and communications needs fulfilled by a single high capacity connection.
Are they saying there is no market for this in RSA? They can recoup R24,000 from each user over a 2 month period. Assuming 100,000 users, that's R2,400,000,000 or R2.4 billion rand. Assuming profit/expenses of 400,000, can R1.4 billion in capex not buy a fibre network with last mile access for at least 100,000 users?
Tick
Senior Member
Great, another article punting the flawed viewpoint that government operation is the only workable answer.
Fallacy of false choice; you forgot the part where one costs more due to a tax of above-market-rate charges for the infrastructure. In other words, yet another facility in SA that only the extremely wealthy can afford, which in other countries with more free markets is cheap.
Of course there's a market, but whenever you're pushing the argument that government has to own and run X, you inevitably have to push the false propaganda that the market can't support X. Meanwhile, there is no free market. Telkom isn't even that interested in rolling out ADSL anymore, since there is no fixed line competition and they're entering the wireless data market where they can charge exorbitant data rates like the others ... I hardly see them jumping on mainstream FTTH. In the US, you can get Verizon FTTH for around R680/mo, that gives you 50Mbit/s broadband, 125 TV channels (HD quality available) AND a normal voice line service. They're also sparsely populated and have much higher labour rates. Most certainly your example is workable in the SA market, but you think we'll see that anytime here soon, I don't think so.
Fallacy of false choice; you forgot the part where one costs more due to a tax of above-market-rate charges for the infrastructure. In other words, yet another facility in SA that only the extremely wealthy can afford, which in other countries with more free markets is cheap.
Of course there's a market, but whenever you're pushing the argument that government has to own and run X, you inevitably have to push the false propaganda that the market can't support X. Meanwhile, there is no free market. Telkom isn't even that interested in rolling out ADSL anymore, since there is no fixed line competition and they're entering the wireless data market where they can charge exorbitant data rates like the others ... I hardly see them jumping on mainstream FTTH. In the US, you can get Verizon FTTH for around R680/mo, that gives you 50Mbit/s broadband, 125 TV channels (HD quality available) AND a normal voice line service. They're also sparsely populated and have much higher labour rates. Most certainly your example is workable in the SA market, but you think we'll see that anytime here soon, I don't think so.
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The_Unbeliever
Honorary Master
Existing copper infrastructure will work out the cheapest, HOWEVER for future proofing FTTH is the way to go.
Expect commercial customers to get first taste of FTTH, then residential customers.
Expect commercial customers to get first taste of FTTH, then residential customers.
Anyone who is planning a new gated estate without a fibre backbone is missing the bus. The civils are already being done for power and water services and if you time it right then the roads can be laid after the fibre so no road cutting.
I hear all the time about gated estates that are providing broadband using wifi technology to residents and I cringe!
I hear all the time about gated estates that are providing broadband using wifi technology to residents and I cringe!
The_Unbeliever
Honorary Master
The time will come when gated estates with FTTH will be higher on the list than those without.
ghostrider64
Active Member
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i cant even get helkom to upgrade my line to 10mbps even though the suburb im in has a brand new exchange, well hopefully fibre to our homes will happen when decent line provider comes along as neo fail have um well ya failed.
Sting
Ghost in the Machine
Already offered by all major telco's.
True. When the developers are still busy with the sewerage and electrical reticulation, they should lay pipes for telecoms as well. This normally happens. I know Telkom provide the pipes and pay the developers to bury them at the same time as they do the other civil work.
But many developers just don't give a damn and either forget or deliberately ignore the telecoms requirements. And then the paw-paw hits the fan once folks move in and want fixed line service... the body corporates refuse to have their new roads dug up and the whole gated complex suffers.
FTTH is most definitely the future. Maybe this should be added to the MyBB Conference agenda, so that we can hear from the network operators regarding their future plans.
gregmcc
Honorary Master
Why bother with fibre when we can't even get uncapped going properly. Imaging running 100Mbs with one of these 'uncapped' accounts - you will be kicked for violating your UAP in 1 min.
Africa is a continent. South Africa is a country. full of South Africans.
k? thank you.
the best way to get fibre going is for it to be rolled out locally by class ECN entities. If co-ops and other creative means of raising mutural capital are applied you'll find ways of ensuring the last mile is easily met. Hooking up for backbone shouldn't be a problem the big boys seem obscessed with it and then Infraco exists. But ja the last time I checked class-ecn licences are stragglers from VANS and many make up WAPA
Surely if Kenya is able to roll out consumber FTTH then we should be able to do it? Is their pricing not ~R500 per month? I do not understand why South Africans seem to always find reasons not to do it instead of reasons for it.
The only way the internet is really going to make an impact in this country is if fibre is layed or something similar. As soon as we realise this we can then get going with infrastructure development.
The only way the internet is really going to make an impact in this country is if fibre is layed or something similar. As soon as we realise this we can then get going with infrastructure development.
bradhall
Banned
For those that are at either end be it the core network side or the last mile...there are a number of very progess stratergies in place. The business model for last mile connectivity is based on a 8-10 year return..not a bankable feasabilty yet with out capitial injection. There are a number of co-op's or JV's working at delivery...keep your eye's on Altech over the next year or two...Super5media and us - Unicentrix!!
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The costs would be more than that a month, add in overhead for maintaining the last mile network, and then add in your data costs. Now you are looking at R3000-R5000 pm.
Might as well just use the Fibre to the Premises business product from Neotel. If they offer it in your area