Fireplace advice

[ElixirCoder]

4 YEARS later and we are back here again

Took some detours installed solar etc. But we return to the fireplace on the first really cold weekend in Gauteng.

So two years after my OP we stayed in some beautiful accommodation in Stellies just before hard lock down with one of these

On Fire | Fireplaces & Braais | Western Cape

Premium fireplaces, braais, pizza ovens and fire pits.

on-fire.co.za

It worked beautifully easy to clean, started pretty instantly, I have never had a fireplace heat an area as quick as this.

Now just before we continue with the post I do realise that there are other ways to heat the house, aircon, gas etc.

But there is just something that cant beat a fireplace IMO esp when ascetics come into play.

I have some questions now that this is becoming a bit more serious consideration.

1. What is the best source of fuel for the fireplace? wood/anthracite?
2. How much fuel can I expect to use? Any wood better, black wattle/bluegum etc
3. Current floor is tile and wall is brick, plaster and paint. Do I need to do anything to protect these?
4. Any reason I should just stop and do nothing- essentially did you get a fireplace and now regret it?

1. With how messy anthracite is, I prefer wood.
2. Depends on the wood… some hardwoods burn longer than others. We’ve tried black wattle, blue gum, etc but the best for us has been rooikrans: burns longer and hotter and need less of it over a winter:

We used to go through 60 - 80 x 20kg bags a winter of the inferior but cheaper wood. Switching to rooikrans we did 40 bags last winter.

3. No, just don’t have anything that can melt or combust very close to it: especially something electric or furry. These things get properly hot, and if you get one, like ours that is fan assisted, it can pump out even more heat than you think.

4. I would choose this over electric and gas heating options any day of the week.

 

[Mike Hoxbig]

4 YEARS later and we are back here again

Took some detours installed solar etc. But we return to the fireplace on the first really cold weekend in Gauteng.

So two years after my OP we stayed in some beautiful accommodation in Stellies just before hard lock down with one of these

On Fire | Fireplaces & Braais | Western Cape

Premium fireplaces, braais, pizza ovens and fire pits.

on-fire.co.za

It worked beautifully easy to clean, started pretty instantly, I have never had a fireplace heat an area as quick as this.

Now just before we continue with the post I do realise that there are other ways to heat the house, aircon, gas etc.

But there is just something that cant beat a fireplace IMO esp when ascetics come into play.

I have some questions now that this is becoming a bit more serious consideration.

1. What is the best source of fuel for the fireplace? wood/anthracite?
2. How much fuel can I expect to use? Any wood better, black wattle/bluegum etc
3. Current floor is tile and wall is brick, plaster and paint. Do I need to do anything to protect these?
4. Any reason I should just stop and do nothing- essentially did you get a fireplace and now regret it?

Get an aircon. A fireplace is as much effort as a pool. Both look nice and serve a function that can't be matched, but a PITA to maintain...

 

[one poster]

It worked beautifully easy to clean, started pretty instantly, I have never had a fireplace heat an area as quick as this.

Now just before we continue with the post I do realise that there are other ways to heat the house, aircon, gas etc.

But there is just something that cant beat a fireplace IMO esp when ascetics come into play.

I have some questions now that this is becoming a bit more serious consideration.

1. What is the best source of fuel for the fireplace? wood/anthracite?
2. How much fuel can I expect to use? Any wood better, black wattle/bluegum etc
3. Current floor is tile and wall is brick, plaster and paint. Do I need to do anything to protect these?
4. Any reason I should just stop and do nothing- essentially did you get a fireplace and now regret it?

my 2 cords worth

wood is likely cleaner/easier to handle/store + burning wattle etc. helps rid alien vegetation. I am quite partial to bluegum but also happy with wattle. Top tip: the wood needs to be **properly** seasoned/dry - ideally at least a year or two since being cut (so buy your wood now to burn next year). Also size of pieces can play a role in how well things go (size is a goldilocks type thing - not too big/thin/long etc. - stacking logs rather than building pyramids work well - log length should not touch sides of the fire box. Avoid pine (creosote build-up apparently more problematic). It can be a real PITA if you get a funky looking stove but your wood supply is generally a certain length - normally too long (wood supplier tend to cater for the braai/bonfire market), so scout your suppliers as this might influence your final stove choice (or get someone that will cut to your length).

After proper wood, the actual installation might determine levels of happiness. You need a good draw for the closed combustion type fireplaces/stoves to work at their best (you know they work well when burning full tilt you have almost no smoke visible from the chimney/flue and the glass remains relatively clean). Look at things like airflow obstruction at intended install location where the flue will exit the roof/wall (trees from neighbour etc.?). You should find some online guides (and often in the manuals for different stoves) that will indicate distances and height of the flue in relation to the ridge/nok of your own roof for instance. Go for stainless steel double walled/insulated flue - helps the air stay warmer which helps the draw which helps the fireplace. (single skin flue passing near rafter/beam/batten probably looking to burn down a house at some stage).

Full/exclusive cast iron stoves might require greater distance from walls (plaster can crack from heat) and combustible material. Stoves that have enamelled steel facade should allow tighter spacing (again should be in the manual/install info) since they radiate less heat to the sides/back. Almost all stoves will have cast iron somewhere - this will likely show some corrosion/rust after a season - you get fireplace "polish" that will add some oils and will restore the black colour.

Size the stove correctly - there is something like too big. Something big enough to warm up a big, drafty, poorly insulated room might be too warm to sit close to. I find watching the flames more entertaining than television but keep in mind flames next to your 105" 8K wonder screen could be distracting (same if fireplace is behind you and reflecting on the screen after you just added fresh logs and you have a nice rolling flame going). If you want to get really technical about sizing look into heat loss calculations (generally u-values for room materials X surface area X temperature differential + number of air changes for the room) - or just go based on the manufacturer "x kW for x m^2 size room.

The Euorpean sourced stoves tend to have proper testing/install/use info since much of that is legislated for things like air quality standards (nothing against the local made ones but when I was in the market the local guys were lacking in more technical info).

If you like your tech you can also look at the pellet with fan assisted function stoves (probably most effective way to heat) but I will not go for a fuel source that can become difficult to source.

What would I do different? Get a bit bigger stove that allows bigger logs that burn longer otherwise it can feel inconvenient at times to have to get up to add 2 logs but will definitely not swop it for AC. Still have a gas heater for the unexpected chilly evening when it is not yet cold enough to burn the stove.

 

[Snyper564]

my 2 cords worth

wood is likely cleaner/easier to handle/store + burning wattle etc. helps rid alien vegetation. I am quite partial to bluegum but also happy with wattle. Top tip: the wood needs to be **properly** seasoned/dry - ideally at least a year or two since being cut (so buy your wood now to burn next year). Also size of pieces can play a role in how well things go (size is a goldilocks type thing - not too big/thin/long etc. - stacking logs rather than building pyramids work well - log length should not touch sides of the fire box. Avoid pine (creosote build-up apparently more problematic). It can be a real PITA if you get a funky looking stove but your wood supply is generally a certain length - normally too long (wood supplier tend to cater for the braai/bonfire market), so scout your suppliers as this might influence your final stove choice (or get someone that will cut to your length).

After proper wood, the actual installation might determine levels of happiness. You need a good draw for the closed combustion type fireplaces/stoves to work at their best (you know they work well when burning full tilt you have almost no smoke visible from the chimney/flue and the glass remains relatively clean). Look at things like airflow obstruction at intended install location where the flue will exit the roof/wall (trees from neighbour etc.?). You should find some online guides (and often in the manuals for different stoves) that will indicate distances and height of the flue in relation to the ridge/nok of your own roof for instance. Go for stainless steel double walled/insulated flue - helps the air stay warmer which helps the draw which helps the fireplace. (single skin flue passing near rafter/beam/batten probably looking to burn down a house at some stage).

Full/exclusive cast iron stoves might require greater distance from walls (plaster can crack from heat) and combustible material. Stoves that have enamelled steel facade should allow tighter spacing (again should be in the manual/install info) since they radiate less heat to the sides/back. Almost all stoves will have cast iron somewhere - this will likely show some corrosion/rust after a season - you get fireplace "polish" that will add some oils and will restore the black colour.

Size the stove correctly - there is something like too big. Something big enough to warm up a big, drafty, poorly insulated room might be too warm to sit close to. I find watching the flames more entertaining than television but keep in mind flames next to your 105" 8K wonder screen could be distracting (same if fireplace is behind you and reflecting on the screen after you just added fresh logs and you have a nice rolling flame going). If you want to get really technical about sizing look into heat loss calculations (generally u-values for room materials X surface area X temperature differential + number of air changes for the room) - or just go based on the manufacturer "x kW for x m^2 size room.

The Euorpean sourced stoves tend to have proper testing/install/use info since much of that is legislated for things like air quality standards (nothing against the local made ones but when I was in the market the local guys were lacking in more technical info).

If you like your tech you can also look at the pellet with fan assisted function stoves (probably most effective way to heat) but I will not go for a fuel source that can become difficult to source.

What would I do different? Get a bit bigger stove that allows bigger logs that burn longer otherwise it can feel inconvenient at times to have to get up to add 2 logs but will definitely not swop it for AC. Still have a gas heater for the unexpected chilly evening when it is not yet cold enough to burn the stove.

Thank you very much for your detailed insight really appreciate it and much to think about. This is def not something I want to rush thats also the reason I am returning to this thread 4 years later.

I like your views on the wood also happy to eliminate an alien and typically cheaper as well.

Also your advice on the placement is most helpful. We want to place the fireplace somewhere on this wall (behind this wall is my wife's study so it is not an outside wall). Bookshelf and painting will be moved. This area is the living room split into two room the tv room in the furthest part you can see and the library essentially the area we want to place it in. It should not impact any tv being watched and you can curl up with a book/wine and enjoy the fireplace.

The library is 4x4m the area from the entry to the curtain is 12m.

I can protect the wall if needed going with cast iron but based on what you know and your experience what would you recommend?

Plan is not to heat up the house. I can wheel around the gas heat or grab an extra blanket plan is to give this area great ambience and keep it nice and warm in winter.

 

[one poster]

Thank you very much for your detailed insight really appreciate it and much to think about. This is def not something I want to rush thats also the reason I am returning to this thread 4 years later.

I like your views on the wood also happy to eliminate an alien and typically cheaper as well.

Also your advice on the placement is most helpful. We want to place the fireplace somewhere on this wall (behind this wall is my wife's study so it is not an outside wall). Bookshelf and painting will be moved. This area is the living room split into two room the tv room in the furthest part you can see and the library essentially the area we want to place it in. It should not impact any tv being watched and you can curl up with a book/wine and enjoy the fireplace.

The library is 4x4m the area from the entry to the curtain is 12m.

I can protect the wall if needed going with cast iron but based on what you know and your experience what would you recommend?

Plan is not to heat up the house. I can wheel around the gas heat or grab an extra blanket plan is to give this area great ambience and keep it nice and warm in winter.

if it were me I would go with a smallish enamel clad stove and put it probaly where you have in mind. Stove I have specifies 20cm back and side clearance (and I am happy to have combustible material that close knowing that there is an air gap between the cast iron firebox and the outer shell). From the back wall to the front of the stove (including the door handle which is not removeable) my stove takes about 65cm of possible "walkway space" (you still need to keep combustibles away from the front in a 1 meter arc from the centre of the stove but you can walk past it without a problem). My stove is actually about 15cm from the back wall and I do not see any problem after 4 years (plaster and paint wall). Just keep in mind the log size requirement of smaller stoves (the logs need to lie flat on the previous log embers/grate to keep the fire tri-angle most effective). The smaller stoves tend to be square - if you can find something that is more rectangular ("long side" parallel to the wall) that could be ideal.

A bigger stove may not help you much to heat up the TV room since a lot of the heat will get trapped by the arch between the two rooms areas (but a strategically placed fan could help).

 

[Snyper564]

if it were me I would go with a smallish enamel clad stove and put it probaly where you have in mind. Stove I have specifies 20cm back and side clearance (and I am happy to have combustible material that close knowing that there is an air gap between the cast iron firebox and the outer shell). From the back wall to the front of the stove (including the door handle which is not removeable) my stove takes about 65cm of possible "walkway space" (you still need to keep combustibles away from the front in a 1 meter arc from the centre of the stove but you can walk past it without a problem). My stove is actually about 15cm from the back wall and I do not see any problem after 4 years (plaster and paint wall). Just keep in mind the log size requirement of smaller stoves (the logs need to lie flat on the previous log embers/grate to keep the fire tri-angle most effective). The smaller stoves tend to be square - if you can find something that is more rectangular ("long side" parallel to the wall) that could be ideal.

A bigger stove may not help you much to heat up the TV room since a lot of the heat will get trapped by the arch between the two rooms areas (but a strategically placed fan could help).

Thanks very much this is most useful! If you dont mind could you share an example of the fireplace you are referring to when you say enamel clad just so I know in which direction to look

 

[one poster]

Thanks very much this is most useful! If you dont mind could you share an example of the fireplace you are referring to when you say enamel clad just so I know in which direction to look

The nordica in your on-firecoza link should be an example (the coloured sides are steel panels that go over a cast iron firebox, the door and top is also cast iron (the back panel will likely also be steel but not enamelled).

Stove I have is a version of this -> https://www.superiorstufe.it/en-US/Product/Details/wood-burning-stoves/micaela

If you look at the local megamaster stoves that will be traditional cast iron.

 

[Snyper564]

The nordica in your on-firecoza link should be an example (the coloured sides are steel panels that go over a cast iron firebox, the door and top is also cast iron (the back panel will likely also be steel but not enamelled).

Stove I have is a version of this -> https://www.superiorstufe.it/en-US/Product/Details/wood-burning-stoves/micaela

If you look at the local megamaster stoves that will be traditional cast iron.

Sweet thanks! Will have a look and once again thanks for the insights!

 

[W@P]

Thank you very much for your detailed insight really appreciate it and much to think about. This is def not something I want to rush thats also the reason I am returning to this thread 4 years later.

I like your views on the wood also happy to eliminate an alien and typically cheaper as well.

Also your advice on the placement is most helpful. We want to place the fireplace somewhere on this wall (behind this wall is my wife's study so it is not an outside wall). Bookshelf and painting will be moved. This area is the living room split into two room the tv room in the furthest part you can see and the library essentially the area we want to place it in. It should not impact any tv being watched and you can curl up with a book/wine and enjoy the fireplace.

The library is 4x4m the area from the entry to the curtain is 12m.

I can protect the wall if needed going with cast iron but based on what you know and your experience what would you recommend?

Plan is not to heat up the house. I can wheel around the gas heat or grab an extra blanket plan is to give this area great ambience and keep it nice and warm in winter.

View attachment 1286912

Is that a Vetsak I see over there?

 

[Snyper564]

Is that a Vetsak I see over there?

You are correct

The dogs have their Pupsaks too

 

[Chingha]

The nordica in your on-firecoza link should be an example (the coloured sides are steel panels that go over a cast iron firebox, the door and top is also cast iron (the back panel will likely also be steel but not enamelled).

Stove I have is a version of this -> https://www.superiorstufe.it/en-US/Product/Details/wood-burning-stoves/micaela

If you look at the local megamaster stoves that will be traditional cast iron.

Have one of those too, can recommend. I feel your pain when it comes to cricket bat wood pieces too.

 

[TedLasso]

Get an aircon. A fireplace is as much effort as a pool. Both look nice and serve a function that can't be matched, but a PITA to maintain...

Having both, I disagree. The pool is a PITA. A good fireplace is brilliant though. Wood over anthracite and maintenance is getting someone once a year to service it and chimney - a 1000 spend that can save your house.

To the point about wood length, last year, we used good wood eco logs so that I could fit them in my fireplace and they worked rather well. Easy to break . Placed an order for them this year too.

 

[W@P]

You are correct

The dogs have their Pupsaks too

View attachment 1286958

Very nice. My ex-brother-in-law also got 2 x of those Vetsakke. They are next level.

 

[Snyper564]

Very nice. My ex-brother-in-law also got 2 x of those Vetsakke. They are next level.

100% ultra comfy and their dog beds are the best we ever had too. Very happy with everything from them

 

[Snyper564]

@one poster so we seem to have settled on these two anything popping out on why they would be a bad idea?

Thorma – BOZEN TOP OUTLET CAPPUCCINO Freestanding Fireplace - Braai Culture

NB: This price includes Unit only, flues & accessories are sold separately. Please ask for a quote if required. ON SALE WHILE STOCKS LAST!

braaiculture.com

Thorma – VERONA TOP OUTLET CAPPUCCINO Closed Combustion Fireplace - Braai Culture

NB: This price includes Unit only, flues & accessories are sold separately. Please ask for a quote if required. ON SALE WHILE STOCKS LAST! [block id="in-stock-delivery-message-above-r2000-gauteng-only"]

braaiculture.com

 

[TedLasso]

Having both, I disagree. The pool is a PITA. A good fireplace is brilliant though. Wood over anthracite and maintenance is getting someone once a year to service it and chimney - a 1000 spend that can save your house.

To the point about wood length, last year, we used good wood eco logs so that I could fit them in my fireplace and they worked rather well. Easy to break . Placed an order for them this year too.

Guy coming in to tomorrow to service my fireplace and chimney sweep. 950

Time to turn the bugger on.

Sorry to derail thread, but some of the posters talked about their fireplace having a fan or placing a fan strategically to move the hot air around.

My mate from the UK, had told me about this a few years ago and also recommended that I replace the top of my fireplace with a thick piece of metal as it would absorb the heat and distribute over a longer time. Thinking maybe it's time do consider this too.

Anyone care to share pic of said fan as I recall mate saying it was a fan designed to be near heat?

Ta in advance

 

[Snyper564]

Guy coming in to tomorrow to service my fireplace and chimney sweep. 950

Time to turn the bugger on.

Sorry to derail thread, but some of the posters talked about their fireplace having a fan or placing a fan strategically to move the hot air around.

My mate from the UK, had told me about this a few years ago and also recommended that I replace the top of my fireplace with a thick piece of metal as it would absorb the heat and distribute over a longer time. Thinking maybe it's time do consider this too.

Anyone care to share pic of said fan as I recall mate saying it was a fan designed to be near heat?

Ta in advance

View attachment 1288134

I plan on getting the fan too when fireplace is installed here you go

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[_kabal_]

I have a “cheap” hydrofire branded internal combustion fireplace.
Have had it since April 2017.
Next to aircon in summer it is by far the best thing we did for our house.
I do the yearly sweep with GC fires.
Use about 1000 pieces of bluegum a year, and always have another 1000 pieces seasoning.

It’s a much more pleasant heat compared to aircon IMO (which I use in my office for heating in winter)

 

[shadow_man]

Hey guys. This may be a bit of a strange request but we are thinking about putting in a fireplace at home. We have a wheeled around gas heater that functions well but we want something that's great for heating and great for ambience. At the moment we are looking at gas, cast iron and anthracite. What would you recommend from experience or would you recommend against it all together. As I said its both for heating and ambience.

I run a cast iron 8kw Charnwood Country 8 - very happy with it and occasionally I use the flat potjie pot on the top to cook, or the teapot to make tea.

 

[Snyper564]

I run a cast iron 8kw Charnwood Country 8 - very happy with it and occasionally I use the flat potjie pot on the top to cook, or the teapot to make tea.

Happy doggies you have there! Really beautiful setup yoou have there. Arnt you worried its a bit close to the tv?

Happy with the thermofan?