Fires in Australia

[TooFastTim]

so ... too soon to play some Midnight Oil?

I pay tax in the UK, Aus and NZ and I don't think that's appropriate. Suggest you might wish to spend some time in Aus and appreciate what the 'oils lyrics mean.

PS. I was an SA taxpayer.

 

[TooFastTim]

I've heard people complain about a lack of controlled burning.

It's part of the problem.

 

[antowan]

It is horrible. But something went wrong in how they managed the fire risk. Something went off kilter.

I'm sure there must be a thread already about this but I couldn't find it. It sounds really hectic this year
https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1212523804620152832.html

There doesn't seem to be much talk about it in SA or anywhere, that I've seen. I know we have a few people here on myBB who are now living in Australia, it not as bad as the twitterverse is making out or what?

 

[antowan]

Australians blame their politicians for everything that goes wrong:

Australia fires: Angry residents berate PM Morrison in blaze-ravaged town

Scott Morrison is confronted in Cobargo as residents insult him and tell him he is unwelcome.

www.bbc.com

Peripheral news, but NZ has been blanketed by smoke:

Australia fires: Smoke turns New Zealand skies 'eerie' yellow

More than 2,000km from the fires, New Zealanders are seeing hazy yellow skies and smelling burning.

www.bbc.com

The Ozzies have a right to blame the politicians. Who else oversees the funding and policies related to the management of fire hazards? Government. By a mile! They have it right. At least in this case. Somebody didn't do their job.

 

[NarrowBandFtw]

I pay tax in the UK, Aus and NZ and I don't think that's appropriate

Wasn't going for appropriate, dark humour rather ...

Suggest you might wish to spend some time in Aus and appreciate what the 'oils lyrics mean

Why would I need to spend time there? The lyrics are pretty obvious: they've taken the country from the natives and the guy reckons it's time to give it back to them. Apparently he also does lots of charity work along the same lines.

None of that changes the fact that its an Aussie band literally singing about beds burning and these days large parts of Australia are literally burning.

 

[krycor]

I've heard people complain about a lack of controlled burning.

Australians blame their politicians for everything that goes wrong:

Australia fires: Angry residents berate PM Morrison in blaze-ravaged town

Scott Morrison is confronted in Cobargo as residents insult him and tell him he is unwelcome.

www.bbc.com

Peripheral news, but NZ has been blanketed by smoke:

Australia fires: Smoke turns New Zealand skies 'eerie' yellow

More than 2,000km from the fires, New Zealanders are seeing hazy yellow skies and smelling burning.

www.bbc.com

The Ozzies have a right to blame the politicians. Who else oversees the funding and policies related to the management of fire hazards? Government. By a mile! They have it right. At least in this case. Somebody didn't do their job.

This is a tricky one.. pending your view on Climate Change as fact or fiction.

If fact ie carbon in atmosphere = leading to heating of planet.. well isn’t the pot calling the kettle black? Australia is one of the biggest polluters (other than SA.. we not innocent, US, etc) directly (dirty electrical generation via coal) as well as indirectly exporting coal to China en mass.

If you watch the politics being played they very careful with their statements as gov pointing finger at climate change means 4 pointing back to source of carbon.

Controlled burning again exacerbates things as.. more carbon pollutant.. see India, Brazil and Congo for impact that has.. hell Delhi has major air quality issues as a result of deforestation & annual field clearing via burning.

I wonder if this will start climate lawsuits with Nzl being a good example. They now suffer degraded air quality.. if this was controlled burning.. yes it would be lesser but impact would be there if blew into Nzl airspace. Would they be able to sue?

Interesting times ahead as always.. I dunno about others but till recently the major issues globally have been man controlled mainly around war or financial.. this time round it seems those are side issues waiting to flare as the climate brings all previous issues together and to the fore again.

Reality is if we all have same human rights on this planet, either developed world lifestyles gonna have to be put in check or we accept that 3rd or developing world has to be the slave class.. but then the lottery of birth is again a big thing.

 

[rietrot]

This is a tricky one.. pending your view on Climate Change as fact or fiction.

If fact ie carbon in atmosphere = leading to heating of planet.. well isn’t the pot calling the kettle black? Australia is one of the biggest polluters (other than SA.. we not innocent, US, etc) directly (dirty electrical generation via coal) as well as indirectly exporting coal to China en mass.

If you watch the politics being played they very careful with their statements as gov pointing finger at climate change means 4 pointing back to source of carbon.

Controlled burning again exacerbates things as.. more carbon pollutant.. see India, Brazil and Congo for impact that has.. hell Delhi has major air quality issues as a result of deforestation & annual field clearing via burning.

I wonder if this will start climate lawsuits with Nzl being a good example. They now suffer degraded air quality.. if this was controlled burning.. yes it would be lesser but impact would be there if blew into Nzl airspace. Would they be able to sue?

Interesting times ahead as always.. I dunno about others but till recently the major issues globally have been man controlled mainly around war or financial.. this time round it seems those are side issues waiting to flare as the climate brings all previous issues together and to the fore again.

Reality is if we all have same human rights on this planet, either developed world lifestyles gonna have to be put in check or we accept that 3rd or developing world has to be the slave class.. but then the lottery of birth is again a big thing.

This is a prime example of why relying on a government to fix the problem is a stupid idea. They will probably just push some climate change BS like this.

Climate change has nothing to do with any of this.
Droughts have always been a thing
Wild fires has always been a thing
How much coal Australia use and export doesn't factors into this in anyway.

We know how to do forestry properly to mitigate for fire risk. Burning isn't only solution It's just one tool to clear away the brush and dead plant matter. People or animals can also do that.

It truly amazes me that a wildfire can burn buildings. To protect a building and to clear around it is actually really easy, if you aren't waiting for either the government to do it or think it's all the fault of global warming.

 

[Alan]

I've heard people complain about a lack of controlled burning.

 

[Nanfeishen]

It truly amazes me that a wildfire can burn buildings. To protect a building and to clear around it is actually really easy, if you aren't waiting for either the government to do it or think it's all the fault of global warming.

Have you seen how Australia builds houses , especially in the rural areas ? There are trees all around most towns and throughout them.

When you are dealing with long standing drought conditions, winds gusting up to 60 miles per hour in places, fanning flames anything from 30 to 70m high in places and your houses are built with weatherboard , it is not that difficult to understand.

 

[Gordon_R]

Hectic when hundreds of holidaymakers have to be evacuated by boat:

Australia fires: Navy rescues people from fire-hit Mallacoota

Two ships have removed around 1,000 people in total from the tourist town of Mallacoota, Victoria.

www.bbc.com

 

[rietrot]

Have you seen how Australia builds houses , especially in the rural areas ? There are trees all around most towns and throughout them.

When you are dealing with long standing drought conditions, winds gusting up to 60 miles per hour in places, fanning flames anything from 30 to 70m high in places and your houses are built with weatherboard , it is not that difficult to understand.

Trees isn't the problem. Big trees don't burn when the grass is short and the undergrowth has been cleared.

 

[maumau]

Have you seen how Australia builds houses , especially in the rural areas ? There are trees all around most towns and throughout them.

When you are dealing with long standing drought conditions, winds gusting up to 60 miles per hour in places, fanning flames anything from 30 to 70m high in places and your houses are built with weatherboard , it is not that difficult to understand.

Apart from the fact those gum trees are super flammable.

 

[MrGray]

It truly amazes me that a wildfire can burn buildings. To protect a building and to clear around it is actually really easy, if you aren't waiting for either the government to do it or think it's all the fault of global warming.

You would think so, yes, but what they're dealing with here in many cases are not so much mere wildfires as huge firestorms with their own weather system, so the problem is that even if you've cleared everything for 100 metres or more around your building, a rapidly approaching front of 100m high roiling flames and sparks and hot ash burning at +800°C is still probably going to take you out if you're downwind of it. The heat is so intense even at a fair distance that many people are killed by it long before the actual flames even reach them.

 

[Neoprod]

Melted rims

 

[nightjar]

I've heard people complain about a lack of controlled burning.

I have relatives in Australia and they say that the environmentalist & green groups are utterly against any sort of preventative measures and now they are reaping the whirlwind.

 

[Pitbull]

I pay tax in the UK, Aus and NZ and I don't think that's appropriate. Suggest you might wish to spend some time in Aus and appreciate what the 'oils lyrics mean.

PS. I was an SA taxpayer.

lol?

Because you pay tax you have an issue with the treatment of aboriginals which lead to a song? It's a great song which highlighted a cause. WTF does that have to do with you paying tax?

 

[rietrot]

Melted rims

View attachment 762094

Google say aluminium melts at 660 C.

 

[Vox Populi Vox Dei]

I have relatives in Australia and they say that the environmentalist & green groups are utterly against any sort of preventative measures and now they are reaping the whirlwind.

The Greenies have already blamed climate change and giving the Conservative PM hell....

Redirect Notice

 

[Alan]

The Greenies have already blamed climate change and giving the Conservative PM hell....

Redirect Notice

A Cobargo resident has passionately defended his town after a video went viral of Scott Morrison being heckled by angry locals.

Prime Minister Scott Morrison was met by angry residents in bushfire-devastated Cobargo in south-east NSW.

“We are totally forgotten about down here”: Residents of bushfire ravaged Cobargo take aim at @ScottMorrisonMP #AustraliaFires #ausfires #NSWfires pic.twitter.com/ZD9sSiNVbT
— news.com.au (@newscomauHQ) January 2, 2020

But the owner of the local pub, David Allen, tells Natalie Peters and Erin Molan that the reaction to Scott Morrison is not reflective of the town. “He’s the Prime Minister of Australia and he deserves some respect.

“He was here to listen and unfortunately a tiny minority of people did that and it’s not representative of the community. “Those people who did it, they’re just no-hopers, they haven’t been seen helping anyone.

“I was just so embarrassed for the town because that’s not what we are.”

'It’s wrong!': Cobargo resident 'ashamed' of treatment of Scott Morrison

A Cobargo resident has passionately defended his town after a video went viral of Scott Morrison being heckled by angry locals. Prime Minister Scott Morrison was met by angry residents in bushfire-devastated Cobargo in south-east NSW. “We are totally forgotten about down here”: Residents of...

www.2gb.com

 

[RaptorSA]

Trees isn't the problem. Big trees don't burn when the grass is short and the undergrowth has been cleared.

No dude. That's simply not true.
I've seen fires in Mpumalanga as a kid where what I can only describe as "gargantuan flame balls", literally jumped massive distances over completely open tarred roads and ignited the tops of trees on the other side as if they were prepped to be lit.

People severely underestimate what happens to air temperature, humidity etc. and the foliage nearby when a huge fire is on the roll.
Some of those fires threw smoke into the air so thick that the carbon would cause Eskom power lines to short out with the ground, causing lightning that would go off like bombshells as we were scrambling to get away in pitch black darkness.

It was something to behold, and these Australian fires make the stuff I've seen look like candlelit dinner.

A good example of what a proper firestorm is like is looking at the WWII Bombing of Tokyo city (mostly built from wood at the time)

When Fire Rained From the Sky

The first low-level B-29 raid on Tokyo introduced a terrifying new tactic in the war against Japan

www.historynet.com

"A fully developed firestorm is a horrifically mesmerizing sight. It seems like a living, malicious creature that feeds upon itself, generating ever higher winds that whirl cyclonically, breeding updrafts that suck the oxygen out of the atmosphere even while the flames consume the fuel—buildings—that feed the monster’s ravenous appetite. Most firestorm victims do not burn to death. Rather, as carbon monoxide quickly reaches lethal levels, people suffocate from lack of oxygen and excessive smoke inhalation."

"The superheated ambient air boiled the water out of ponds and canals while rains of liquid glass flew, propelled by cyclonic winds. Temperatures reached 1,800 degrees Fahrenheit, melting the frames of emergency vehicles and causing some people to ignite in spontaneous combustion."

"A firestorm also could threaten the airmen who created it. Bomber crews over urban areas had to contend with wind shear as well as powerful thermals. The firestorms created violent cyclones and vertical winds that could toss 50-ton bombers onto their backs."