Free data with Vidi

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Waynebow

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Hi

After many hours of banging my head against a wall, I turn to the good people of the MyBroadband forums for help!

Vidi apparently have a way of ensuring that you will not be charged for any data you use while streaming from an ADSL line. More information can be found here:

I've been trying to get those going but have so far been unable to do so. I have tried the following three ADSL routers but am still finding that with each one my data use increases substantially while streaming. My ISP is Afrihost and the data use is confirmed on their Clientzone.
  • Netgear DGND3700V2
  • MWEB Technicolor TG589vn v3
  • Telkom Mega 105WR

I have been contact with Vidi support who have so far been unable to help. They have informed me that my Netgear does not support the "free" data. This is a bit surprising as the Vidi website claims that this feature works with all Netgear routers.

I've spent many hours fiddling with the settings on these routers although I am hampered by the fact that I don't really understand how the free data works and what the impact of all the setting changes are. However, based on some Googling, I have generally tried to enable port forwarding on port 1723. But I've tried playing around with a variety of other settings.

I've also tried everything listed in the following link:
http://kb.netgear.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/966/~/troubleshooting-vpn-passthrough-for-home-routers

So, are there perhaps any users out there who have had a more positive experience? If so, what router are you using and did you have to change any settings on those routers?

I would consider buying a new router but it would have to be a reasonable cost and I'd have to be sure that it would work.

I would be most grateful for any assistance!

Cheers,
Wayne
 
Waynebow said:
I have been contact with Vidi support who have so far been unable to help. They have informed me that my Netgear does not support the "free" data. This is a bit surprising as the Vidi website claims that this feature works with all Netgear routers.
Click to expand...

Sounds like a netgear claim that they have simply regurgitated.
 
Pfffft. Unless your ISP says its free data, you will be charged for the data you use even if it is using a VPN.

Edit: That is unless they are dialing up another ppoe connection of their own and using that instead....which I find highly unlikely.
 
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On your netgear you need to look for a ppoe relay option. That will put your router in half bridge mode, so the vidi app will be able to dial up their connection for you.
 
However, they claim that this works on all NetGear modems, but the DGN2200 Telkom router (IIRC) has no option for half-bridge mode.

To be honest, this is the only way that they can get around your ISP charging you for each packet that traverses their network, by not sending Vidi packets over your ISP's network in the first place.

I don't understand the references to VPN passthrough modes, though. The only way I can see that working is if they have agreements with all the ISP's to chargeback any traffic to a specific VPN server to Vidi, rather than to your own ISP data usage. This would not be a generic solution, though, and would have to be negotiated with each ISP individually.
 
RoganDawes said:
However, they claim that this works on all NetGear modems, but the DGN2200 Telkom router (IIRC) has no option for half-bridge mode.

To be honest, this is the only way that they can get around your ISP charging you for each packet that traverses their network, by not sending Vidi packets over your ISP's network in the first place.

I don't understand the references to VPN passthrough modes, though. The only way I can see that working is if they have agreements with all the ISP's to chargeback any traffic to a specific VPN server to Vidi, rather than to your own ISP data usage. This would not be a generic solution, though, and would have to be negotiated with each ISP individually.
Click to expand...

Maybe it uses VPN and ppoe. When it can't do ppoe, it reverts to VPN connection via users isp to hide authentication/DRM packets from the ISP?
 
imranpanji said:
Maybe it uses VPN and ppoe. When it can't do ppoe, it reverts to VPN connection via users isp to hide authentication/DRM packets from the ISP?
Click to expand...

I understand what a VPN does, I just don't see how it can avoid being "counted" as data on the user's normal ISP account.
 
RoganDawes said:
I understand what a VPN does, I just don't see how it can avoid being "counted" as data on the user's normal ISP account.
Click to expand...

Lets say that the app could be possibly doing the following:

1. Attempt to open up it's own ppoe connection using their own ISP via Half Bridge/PPOE mode.

If it fails then it

2. Opens up a VPN connection to their network using whatever internet connection is available.

In scenario 1 you are not charged for data as it's using their own "ISP"
In scenario 2 you are charged for data as the VPN is using your ISP data

Make sense?
 
Look at the wording on their website:

How does VIDI pay for my data?
If you are using ADSL and ADSL only, the player will detect whether point-to-point tunnelling protocol (see http://www.enterprisenetworkingplan...66/Networking-101-Understanding-Tunneling.htm) is enabled and available via your router. If it is, then the player initiates a secure tunnel connection to our server, creating a separate connection to your current PPPoE account, not allowing us to pay for the data. To change these settings, please see your router manufacturer guide which will show you how to login easily to your router and change your PPPoE settings to enable your router.
Click to expand...

It's like one of those fongkong manuals, and it seems to a confusion of pptp and ppoe. Using my Chinese translator (the guesswork algorithm), i think it wants you to put your router in half bridge mode
 
Thanks very much for the feedback! I will do another test using half bridge mode and post the results.

A second question: Do you think it is necessary to use the Android / IOS app or do you think the above will work while streaming Vidi through a browser?
 
This sounds like BS. In order to establish a tunnel/vpn you need to have ppoe connection already (or some other form of connection). How else are you suppose to connect the two tunnel end points?
 
Waynebow said:
Thanks very much for the feedback! I will do another test using half bridge mode and post the results.

A second question: Do you think it is necessary to use the Android / IOS app or do you think the above will work while streaming Vidi through a browser?
Click to expand...

I find it highly unlikely that a browser session would dial up a ppoe connection (not necessarily impossible though) and will be a bit of a security concern. I am very skeptical of their claims
 
ponder said:
This sounds like BS. In order to establish a tunnel/vpn you need to have ppoe connection already (or some other form of connection). How else are you suppose to connect the two tunnel end points?
Click to expand...

Am in agreement with you. It sounds like BS, and not only from the technical but especially from the financial standpoint...the costs vidi would incur would make this project not viable.

Edit: ponder, in theory would an android or iOS be able to able to establish a ppoe session over WiFi?
 
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I'm afraid I struggled with the Netgear. I could not find a setting to enable PPPOE relay and some Googling seems to show that there is no easy way to accomplish this on this particular router.

As for the Mega 105WR, I also could not find a setting but I found a few posts on this forum stating that PPPOE relay is activated by default on the Mega.

Unfortunately, our Vidi streaming was still added to our Afrihost data usage when using the Mega and streaming via the Android app.

I've sent a follow up email to Vidi and if they come back with anything useful, I will post it here.
 
imranpanji said:
Edit: ponder, in theory would an android or iOS be able to able to establish a ppoe session over WiFi?
Click to expand...

I don't see why not, if you can do it on a pc why not a phone which is essentially a small computer.
 
Waynebow said:
I'm afraid I struggled with the Netgear. I could not find a setting to enable PPPOE relay and some Googling seems to show that there is no easy way to accomplish this on this particular router.

I've sent a follow up email to Vidi and if they come back with anything useful, I will post it here.
Click to expand...

I'm telling you now this free data thing is marketing BS on Vidi's part, you will still be using your adsl data to use their service.
 
In theory, it might be possible, if they have an ISP arrangement with Telkom, and their app can establish a PPPoE connection via your ADSL router. Then any traffic destined to their servers can be routed over that PPPoE connection, and nothing will accrue on your own ISP account.

In practice, you need to have a certain number of variables line up, particularly half-bridge mode on your router, as well as using an app that has the ability to establish a PPPoE connection, as well as update routing tables to make sure that the traffic is going through the right PPPoE connection. (I suppose in theory this could all be done in userspace, but you would still need raw socket access to create PPPoE frames, and you'd need Administrator privs for that anyway).

Bottom line, no, any browser-based app will not be able to do this, unless it installed a plugin of some sort, in which case, I'd be checking my security to make sure that it has not been weakened by this app. To the best of my knowledge, mobile apps will not allow this either. So the only way to benefit from this offer/feature is to use the PC-based app, it seems.

So, this does appear to be mostly marketing BS, and a lot of people will think they are getting free streaming video, and have a rude shock when they suddenly get capped.
 
RoganDawes said:
In theory, it might be possible, if they have an ISP arrangement with Telkom, and their app can establish a PPPoE connection via your ADSL router. Then any traffic destined to their servers can be routed over that PPPoE connection, and nothing will accrue on your own ISP account.
Click to expand...

That is one possibilty (and probably the only one) where in essence they act as an ISP. I'm 99.999% percent certain this is not the case though.
 
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