Gartner Analysts Warn That Windows Is Collapsing

[ShockG]

Sorry to break it to you but in term of shader language OpenGL can do anything DirectX can, I haven't installed Vista or looked at the latest DirectX 10 specs so I can't comment on that but I don't see much of a improvement as far as screenshots from games go, perhaps when it actually becomes viable I'll have a look at the spec, but shader enhancements are usually on order of optimization anyway, I'd be surprised if you couldn't do almost everything with PS3.0 you could do with PS4.0 (if not everything)

Ok I suggest you quit while you're still ahead.
Please tell me how do you in OpenGL, do a simple translation of a set of vertices (in an arbitrary space defined within the rendering frame) inside GLSL without you resorting to the fixed functionality part of the API? Last I checked the call didn't exist under the shading language at all but did under the regular ARB extensions... But then again you know better...

2. Nope GLSL can't do what SM4.0 can do (It's not PS.40 or VS4.0 btw ) there's no early exit for primitives for one which is usual in high order tessellation algorithms. In GL a primitive must exit the rendering pipeline at the front end and get re-fed into vertex buffer... But maybe you in your infinite wisdom have figured it out
3.

I don't see much of a improvement as far as screenshots from games go, perhaps when it actually becomes viable I'll have a look at the spec,

Screenshots of what? Unless you're talking about reference render screenshots of a specific scene the statement doesn't make much sense. You can use DirectX8.1 reference renderer to render an equivalent to what a DirectX10 tech demo will look like but that has never been disputed, its a software rendition that only has to be mathematically correct it doesn't have to be in real time...

shader enhancements are usually on order of optimization anyway

Define optimization. Since the dawn of computing we've been optimizing mathematical processes and that was in Von Neumann's time. At an application level in 3D it's still vertex in, fragment out as it has been since Geforce 256 days so I'm not sure what exactly it is you're trying to say.
Vertex Fetch by Nvidia and Fetch4 by ATI are both used to optimize (make more efficient, hence requiring less cycles) what PCF does for shadows. So by optimization in your context what is it you're talking about?

Really? You don't think ET: Quake Wars comes in somewhere over there?

LOL , ET is Doom3 engine with mega-texture as the biggest difference. Shaders are by and large of the same complexity we saw in Quake4, Prey, or any other Doom3 engine.
ET looks nice, but please...

Cry Engine needs Windows Vista and a monster of a computer to look pretty doesn't really impress me.

Crysis works in Xp if you didn't know We are also not here to impress you. Crytek pushes the boundaries of consumer computing technologies using the most advanced API available just like they did with FarCry. Which was the first game to introduce FP32 HDR which was available on the then recent DirectX9.0c (done via HLSL )
Doom 3 didn't introduce anything, FarCry was out by the time Doom came and it still looked better. Hard edged stencil shadows that lean on Z-stencil efficient hardware are not impressive If you didn't notice Riddick looked the same as Doom3 if not a little better

I've learned DirectX this past holiday and I took graphics in my third year (OpenGL).

I suggest you ask for your money back because you seriously got short changed. I don't call myself a graphics guru I wouldn't dream of it, but you seriously need to re-visit your literature and I'm not being obtuse or anything.

You must be thinking that I think OpenGL is better than DirectX, you're mistaken, I simply don't see one as better than the other, OpenGL keeps up with DirectX and in terms of professional application DirectX doesn't even exist, the reason being OpenGL works completely different from DirectX with different objectives in mind.

"Professional applications?" you can amend an OpenGL ICD and insert custom extensions for a specific hardware feature that's why it's used "professionally". It can also be ported to many different platforms provided underlying hardware supports exact same feature set. OpenGL does not have an abstraction layer so despite it's portability, its tied to hardware much more than DirectX is.

OpenGL works completely different from DirectX with different objectives in mind.

Nope, in fact traditional rendering pipeline (vertex in one side, fragment out the other) is called the OpenGL rendering pipeline which DirectX used for the longest time as well, discarding it with DX10. At a functional level it is still that way to some degree.

If you actually want to make a point rather try pointing out that most games run on DirectX rather than OpenGL because technology wise, there isn't much either way.

I wait still for a better open source graphics API than Microsoft's DirectX. Point me in the right direction please....

Let us debate the slightly more technical side to all of this and lets really go at it since you can't seem to accept that some people just don't care to change to Linux and are happy with windows. It is not because they are lazy, stupid or afraid of the unfamiliar it is simply because they have no reason too. It seems most Linux advocates suggest people's reasons for using windows is due to their ignorance on what a blissful experience Linux can be. So here I am asking you to please provide me with an alternative to DirectX which so far has allowed me to do what I want to do just fine. You say Linux is better, and I am asking you, show and tell in this context.

An operating system to me is a tool or an enabler if you may, which allows me to do something of far greater importance than the tool itself. You say Linux is a better tool, but so far have failed to show me how it is a better tool for my needs.

 

[fskmh]

Oh goodness this is just sad really... Lua is a programming language not an API. GGI is nowhere near Direct3D as a rendering API. In fact it can't match OpenGL1.4
Lastly SDL is a "Direct Media Layer" as it says and uses OpenGL as it's graphics rendering API as per quote

So no. you haven't offered an equivalent alternative. Take another stab at it

Yes, it is quite sad. Let's take a look at what I actually said:

So you're not using open source, huh?
Take a look at the applications at the bottom of that page.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lua_(...ng_language)
Now sidestep that.

Did I say Lua had anything to do with the game rendering? No, it just suited you to try and fob me off with no real answer to the fact that open source software is being used by the gaming software houses. Now take a stab at that .

As for the technical merits of the two APIs I offered, my motivation was merely to show they exist, lest people form the impression that open source programmers are sitting on their collective behinds .

huh? er... is gaming not the fastest growing form of entertainment in the world? does it not generate several billions of dollars in revenue each year? I would not call gaming a pitiful area and I'm sure others wouldn't as well. Yes it may be a single area but it's hardly pitiful. Look here on this very forum how many threads ask about gaming graphics cards, CPUs and the like.

Huh? Is that all you've got? What happened to the productivity (work) aspect that you mentioned earlier?
It's true that gaming is driving a lot of exciting hardware developments, but so is HPC, (there are some similarities in hardware requirements), but you blew that aspect off to get in some snide posturing about the relevance of my physics and computational background .

Is gaming all the PC is about? Why not just buy a console then?

Yes it is one area but it is the one area I have some idea about. There is no point in me discussing security. I' have no knowledge of that so I can't attempt to engage in a meaningful semi technical argument in that area.

Just as well.

If Linux is superior indeed to Windows (I am not saying it's not as that's not the point), why is it failing in this one area that matters most to millions of people? Why should these people ignore this obvious short coming and focus on other merits Linux might have which they care nothing about?

This has been discussed in other [-]flamewars[/-] threads about Linux and gaming. If you haven't realised it yet, (and going by your previous posts, you haven't), I did not actually weigh into this discussion arguing about the Linux gaming platform. You might want to read that again. Yes, I'm being condescending too .

The crux is about where the shortcoming is; is it the software platform itself, is it the market (i.e. demand), or is it MS's dominance is the desktop market?
(We are talking about gaming on the PC platform now.)
That is where the debate should be taking place. Perhaps the current situation is just a snapshot in the evolution of the Linux gaming platform.
Even if OpenGL 3 comes out to critical acclaim, it's nothing without a market. If more games were available as native binaries for Linux, it would provide more impetus behind OpenGL than it is enjoying in the current scenario with DirectX determining the consumer's choice of graphics card, (i.e. does the card support DirectX 10.x?).
Would I buy A Linux version of Supreme Commander instead of trying to play it with Cedega, (which will always be playing catch-up to pixel-shader x.y support etc)?
Yes, but the software companies obviously won't bother if the demand isn't there, so it's a catch-22 situation in that respect. (O.K., Epic managed with ut2004 and id managed with Doom 3 and Quake 4 for Linux, perhaps EA games etc. have some non-economic reasons for not supporting Linux.)
This is why I bemoaned the fact that even technically inclined people on this forum pass off their ignorant, (not in the derogative sense), opinions about Linux without verifying the facts for themselves. If this is happening, what are the chances of regular consumers trying out Linux?

 

[ShockG]

Sony came to nVidia and said: "I need a chip for the PS3", nVidia gave them 2 choices: "Pay me x amount which I could earn created a new GFX card for x86" or "Pay me y amount which is less than what we could earn by developing a new chip for x86 but we get to use that chip on our next generation which will also be released for the x86". Guess which one they picked. Obviously the chip wasn't just developed for the Playstation, wake up and smell the dollar bills.

Rubbish...
Gnome, you're seriously out of your depths here. There was no such thing. NV2A that was in original Xbox was NV20/NV25 hybrid core. Number #1 in NVIDIA's POV is their visual computing products and nothing else. Reason ATI was able to make a GPU for Xbox was because it shared many similarities between their upcoming R600 and what Microsoft needed at the time. Developing a GPU takes years, and time which just wasn't there for a new GPU to be developed from the ground up for Sony.
Core business for both ATi and NVIDIA is in computing not consoles. They don't waste engineers and time on something that isn't going to benefit them technologically.
The Flipper core in the Gamecube and it's succesor Hollywood in the Wii are based on R200 from ATI, Xenos in 360 based on R600. NV2A Xbox is based on NV20/25 and RSX in PS3 is based on G70/G71. Do you see a pattern here?

For a more in depth insight into how consoles are developed look at the XBox development and you'll see why a Console maker chooses X hardware over Y hardware, it isn't because it's better, it's because it's cheaper

You're very wrong. I urge you please Gnome, you're seriously reaching and its quite shocking what you would come up with. Cheapness has nothing to do with it. Blu-Ray is hideously expensive and Sony went with it instead of DVD. The PS3 uses it's much touted Cell CPU which is also very expensive and their online service is free for users, which costs them money. Please I urge you once more, do not take chances. The important thing with consoles is install base, because developers pay a fee to develop for your title, sales of games directly affect your bottom line. That's why the companies are willing ot make a loss on hardware, because it is subsidized by licensing fees.
I work in the industry and you're reaching. I suggest we get back to the issue at hand.

 

[ShockG]

Did I say Lua had anything to do with the game rendering? No, it just suited you to try and fob me off with no real answer to the fact that open source software is being used by the gaming software houses. Now take a stab at that.

Sigh... :/ we were talking about APIs. I don't think anybody has doubts about the existence of open source programming languages. Please show me where that was ever disputed or discussed. API's please APIs. Show me an Open Source real time graphics API that is better than DirectX
You may as well have pointed me to a C++ page... honestly :|

As for the technical merits of the two APIs I offered, my motivation was merely to show they exist, lest people form the impression that open source programmers are sitting on their collective behinds

Once again nobody said they are sitting on their behinds... The best "Open Source" has to offer is OpenGL, which isn't a match for DirectX and isn't really Open Source but an Open Standard rather...

If this is happening, what are the chances of regular consumers trying out Linux?

Did it ever occur to you that maybe they don't want too? I mean seriously it's like Linux users want more people to support it. That's fine and all the best of luck, but you can't then turn around and tell these very same people you want support from that their chosen operating system is absolute rubbish, full of security holes, and in general attempt to victimize them for not finding fault in windows. It's not fair, and I don't think it's the way to champion support.

Here is a thread, 10 pages long almost and so far nobody here is going to leave their windows and start using Linux and those who use Linux are not going back to windows. All the people here I will assume know more than the average windows users about Window's and Linux's short comings. If nobody here can be convinced to switch over to Linux, what are the odds Joe Soap is going to feel the need to change over?

 

[fskmh]

I wait still for a better open source graphics API than Microsoft's DirectX. Point me in the right direction please....

You previously said "as proficient " and the goalpost has moved to "better".
There has to be a demand driving this, and since you are in the industry, you should know that all too well.

Let us debate the slightly more technical side to all of this and lets really go at it since you can't seem to accept that some people just don't care to change to Linux and are happy with windows. It is not because they are lazy, stupid or afraid of the unfamiliar it is simply because they have no reason too.

Well it would be stupid to try and move a satisfied customer to something new and unfamiliar. This is certainly not what I have been suggesting.
Does this characterise 100% of Windows users though?

It seems most Linux advocates suggest people's reasons for using windows is due to their ignorance on what a blissful experience Linux can be.

It is for me. If it isn't for you, stick to what works for you .

An operating system to me is a tool or an enabler if you may, which allows me to do something of far greater importance than the tool itself. You say Linux is a better tool, but so far have failed to show me how it is a better tool for my needs.

But your needs appear to be limited to gaming. You will find posts in several threads where Linux users are advocating dual-boot solutions for people that also find this aspect important.
You have failed to show that Windows is a better tool for anything except gaming .

 

[fskmh]

Sigh... :/ we were talking about APIs. I don't think anybody has doubts about the existence of open source programming languages. Please show me where that was ever disputed or discussed even. API's please APIs. Show me an Open Source real time graphics API thay is better than DirextX
You may as well have pointed me to a C++ page... honestly :|

My point was that open source is being used in games. You still have not adequately addressed the post that you're quoting.

Once again nobody said they are sitting on their behinds... The best "Open Source" has to offer is OpenGL, which isn't a match for DirectX and isn't really Open Source but an Open Standard rather...

You deny commenting about a 7 year head start? You didn't answer my challenge to that comment either.

Here is a thread, 10 pages long almost and so far nobody here is going to leave their windows and start using Linux and those who use Linux are not going back to windows. All the people here I will assume know more than the average windows users about Window's and Linux's short comings. If nobody here can be convinced to switch over to Linux, what are the odds Joe Soap is going to feel the need to change over?

Check the title of the thread. It isn't about switching over to Linux. I personally couldn't care if people want to use MS-DOS 3.3.
It got to 10 pages because of people deflecting questions, trading barbs and doggedly sticking to their agendas instead of debating the actual merits.

 

[ShockG]

But I never set out to prove windows is better than Linux. Find me a single quote where I say explicitly windows is better than Linux. :/

Does this characterise 100% of Windows users though?

Who knows, but if you look at the install base maybe it will tell you something, I honestly have no idea. We can't assume that the sole reason people stay with windows is because the computer they buy is pre-loaded with it.

stick to what works for you .

That's what I've been saying all along. Leave the windows users alone, it's like at every turn it's "let's bash Microsoft and their users" Maybe people should be fumed at Microsoft, but why bash the users as well?

But your needs appear to be limited to gaming.

This is true for many more people as well. The thing is even if your needs are something else, if windows does the job adequately enough (assume Linux does it the best possible way even) some may feel the effort involved in changing over to Linux is not worth what they gain. After all it's not like they weren't functional before. Linux will most certainly make it better, but maybe not by enough of a margin to warrant the change.

 

[chiskop]

I haven't installed Vista or looked at the latest DirectX 10 specs so I can't comment on that ...

Don't let your let of direct experience there hold you back - there's plenty of windows users in this thread who're quite comfortable talkiong about stuff they have had no experience with.

If Linux is superior indeed to Windows (I am not saying it's not as that's not the point), why is it failing in this one area that matters most to millions of people? Why should these people ignore this obvious short coming and focus on other merits Linux might have which they care nothing about?

I don't care in the slightest for what's important to millions of users - I care about what's important for me. All your talk about gaming and DirectX etc falls into that category of merits that windows might have that I care nothing about.

For me, linux does what I need it to faster and more efficiently than anything else, and its a lot more fun. And yes, I've used windows to do the same stuff, so I can compare directly here.

I understand that my needs may be different to yours - so use what works for you.

 

[Kasyx]

4. Know the reason why iD went with OpenGL in the first place
Yes long before DirectX had a meaningful renderer people used Mini drivers like 3Dfx who had a very good mini driver for an accelerated Quake. (Obviously because Scott Sanders and others who stated 3Dfx worked at SGI which coined the OpenGL standard in the first place)
Quake run and looked better on GL based drivers than software. As result of the tool set of the time. Writing for GL and Dirext3D was near impossible because DirextX was just so poor. (When the original Unreal came out, the Direct3D rendering path was slow, of low quality and terribly broken, but the 3Dfx /Glide version was incredible)
iD continued to work on GL engines. When Quake3 came around, curved surfaces and the like required some form of fragment shading and that was not available in DirectX6.1 at the time but did exist in any OpenGL1.3 ICD.

If you look at Doom3 code you will see that it was started way before GLSlang was around so its shaders are issued via the fragment and vertex extensions and not via the shader language. Which is why it looks pretty much the same on a GeForce3 as it does on an 6800.
JC is genius at engines don't take away from him by using him to defend a questionable argument. The best looking engine in the business today par none is DX (Cry Engine) so is the 2nd best (UE3), etc...

As to what DX offers that OpenGL doesn't. Simple = allot

I just don't feel like typing this out yet again, so I will direct you to this thread

Also, I think we would all appreciate it if you would create your own threads in which to argue your complete lack of facts, so don't reply in the thread I just linked, it's for helping, not arguing and I don't really want you derailing that.

Can you do that for me? Thanks

 

[Devill]

Windows - but then try to buy a computer without it. People aren't choosing it - they have no choice.

Nope. So wait, did your grandmother install Office 2007? Respect if that is the case.

IMO, Open office is simpler for new users to pick up and use, no fiddling about trying to figure how the ribbon works, or realising that you have to click the windows logo to save your document.

But hey, use what works for you.

My grandad and gran-ma can install windows and office
windows xp = 1 cd

How many cd's is linux?

also are drivers readily available for printers webcams graphix cards ectect on linux?

and still you guys keep hammering on on something you think im saying...i said WINDOWS will stay top dog till something better AND user friendly comes along......not windows is better nor its better for people to stick to what they know! although people WILL in general stick to what they know till something BETTER CHEAPER EASIER to use comes along

If someone else brought out a operating system that had all the drives , simple point and click interface andwas cheaper than windows most PCs would come out standard with that

PS like i have said before im not a windows fan

 

[chiskop]

Respect to your granny.

ubuntu comes on one cd - takes about six clicks* and fifteen minutes to install, then you've got openoffice and all the other things your granny will need. Clearly you've never tried installing ubuntu, or you'd know it is BETTER CHEAPER EASIER.

If someone else brought out a operating system that had all the drives , simple point and click interface andwas cheaper than windows most PCs would come out standart with that

Many people have, but computers still come with windows pre-installed - and that is the biggest obstacle to desktop growth. (FWIW: my laptop has four partitions: ubuntu sees all four, vista sees two).

You say you're not a windows fan, why do you persist with something that you don't like?
________________________________________
*Select time zone, select language, select keyboard, install location, enter user name and password. Default will work for all but time zone and username, obviously.

 

[Devill]

Respect to your granny.

ubuntu comes on one cd - takes about six clicks* and fifteen minutes to install, then you've got openoffice and all the other things your granny will need. Clearly you've never tried installing ubuntu, or you'd know it is BETTER CHEAPER EASIER.

Many people have, but computers still come with windows pre-installed - and that is the biggest obstacle to desktop growth. (FWIW: my laptop has four partitions: ubuntu sees all four, vista sees two).

You say you're not a windows fan, why do you persist with something that you don't like?
________________________________________
*Select time zone, select language, select keyboard, install location, enter user name and password. Default will work for all but time zone and username, obviously.

1st thanks that you can be civil and make a valid point unlike some

Are drivers readily available for printers webcams graphix cards ectect on linux? (asked this in previouse post )

If they are i might consider switching to ubuntu but i really dont have time/patience to sit and "figure it out" if it takes a bit of getting use to (to lazy and busy )

Also how are the updates on ubuntu? (regular/good?)

you are right i havnt tryed ubuntu because i dont have time to figure it out and everything i want to do works fine on windows ...from matlab to gaming and all the rest

lol...why does it say killove on the QUOTE from me that you used on the post above?

 

[chiskop]

1st thanks that you can be civil and make a valid point unlike some

Are drivers readily available for printers webcams graphix cards ectect on linux? (asked this in previouse post )

If they are i might consider switching to ubuntu but i really dont have time/patience to sit and "figure it out" if it takes a bit of getting use to (to lazy and busy )

Graphics card = Open System > Administration > Restricted Drivers - click. (for nvidia at least - don't have experience with other cards)
Don't have a webcam - so don't know about that. (You see what I did there - I admitted that I had no experience of something, and didn't provide an uninformed opininion about it.)
In general software installs and updates are managed from within a GUI interface, in my case called synaptic. From there I can search for and install any software that i need, including drivers.

Also how are the updates on ubuntu? (regular/good?)

Everything is controlled from the Update Manager - no need for separate Windows, Adobe, etc update managers. Updates are classed so you can choose only to download those that affect security updates or whatever. Updates are continuous, lots of incremental updates, and security fixes as soon as they're available. Security fixes are measured in hours, rather than having to wait until the first Tuesday of next month, if at all.

you are right i havnt tryed ubuntu because i dont have time to figure it out and everything i want to do works fine on windows ...from matlab to gaming and all the rest

If it works for you, then stick with it - but stop talking rubbish about an OS that you haven't used.

lol...why does it say killove on the QUOTE from me that you used on the post above?

Because I did it manually and I'm an idiot.

Sorry if I come on a bit strong about the using it before forming an opinion stuff - in general the difference between a linux users opinion of windows, and a window users' opinion on linux is that the linux user has used windows and knows its strengths and weaknesses while windows users recycle five year half-truths and it gets a little irritating tbh.

 

[w1z4rd]

My grandad and gran-ma can install windows and office

Your grandma could install linux.. seriously, download a copy and actually try. Also, your grandma would not have to install office, as openoffice comes by default with ubuntu. So one less step for her, and more of her pension money to spend on a new walker.

windows xp = 1 cd

How many cd's is linux?

1cd - ubuntu

also are drivers readily available for printers webcams graphix cards ectect on linux?

I havent had to install a driver yet. On my windows parition I had to install just about every driver. Im sure some devices due to hardware vendor lockouts have to be installed the hardway.. but off the bat my:

- ipod nano
- bluetooth dongle
- usb wireless NIC
- logitech webcam
- nvidia pci express card
- skype phone
- Huawei e220 modem

All worked without my having to install a single driver. Unlike windows. Linux was simply simpler than windows.

although people WILL in general stick to what they know till something BETTER CHEAPER EASIER to use comes along

This reminds me of a quote. The dark ages were not dark because there was no light, but because people failed to see it. (Thanks discovery).

Devill.. do yourself a favor. Wait for the new version of Ubuntu to come out. Get an older machine... and install it. Get some experience with the new ubuntu and then once you have, please let us know how hard or easy it was to install all your devices.

 

[Kasyx]

1st thanks that you can be civil and make a valid point unlike some

Are drivers readily available for printers webcams graphix cards ectect on linux? (asked this in previouse post)

If they are i might consider switching to ubuntu but i really dont have time/patience to sit and "figure it out" if it takes a bit of getting use to (to lazy and busy

Also how are the updates on ubuntu? (regular/good?)

you are right i havnt tryed ubuntu because i dont have time to figure it out and everything i want to do works fine on windows ...from matlab to gaming and all the rest

lol...why does it say killove on the QUOTE from me that you used on the post above?

To be perfectly honest, I have had more trouble with Windows finding drivers for my hardware than I have with Linux. I can't load Vista on my laptop (LG something or other) due to there not being drivers for things like my touchpad and sound and so on. Kubuntu "just works" on my laptop, no further installation necessary. And it is way prettier than Vista.

So to answer your question; if you have some horribly obscure piece of hardware, then there is a chance that Linux may not pick it up (although you could probably get it working with some thought, unlike in Windows where if you don't have the exact right driver, you cannot use that piece of hardware), but there is also that chance with any OS you use. Printer support on Linux (well Ubuntu at least) is pretty damn good and I have not come across a printer that doesn't work for it. And if you happen to have issues installing your printer, google it and chances are you will find a quick and easy fix.

In terms of gfx cards, I have a 8600GT, and when I install Kubuntu (a variant of Ubuntu using KDE as a window manager instead of Gnome), it picks up that I have an nvidia card, tells me that the driver is third-party, and downloads and installs it for me via Apt (Ubuntu's package management system).

Updates on Ubuntu are excellent. Personally, I'd say that Ubuntu is one of the best-supported Linux distributions there are. The version names are taken from the release dates (i.e. Ubuntu 7.10 was released on the tenth month of 2007), so if you check all the previous versions of Ubuntu, you will see how well supported it is (usually around two major updates per year). One can download the latest update (i.e. to go from 7.10 - current, to 8.3 - coming up) when it comes out without having to reinstall. Also, updates can be downloaded locally which does wonders for speed and cap (unlike Microsoft's updates which are international). In fact, all common packages for Ubuntu can be downloaded from a local mirror - it is, after all, Proudly South African

Try Ubuntu, you won't be disappointed

 

[Devill]

Thanks people ....lol...chiskop want talking about you with the flames and terror ways , i was talking about gnome

Ok who knows if matlab works on ubuntu and how is gaming on ubuntu?

If both are good than i pledge to go get ubuntu soon and use it

 

[chiskop]

Updates on Ubuntu are excellent. Personally, I'd say that Ubuntu is one of the best-supported Linux distributions there are. The version names are taken from the release dates (i.e. Ubuntu 7.10 was released on the tenth month of 2007), so if you check all the previous versions of Ubuntu, you will see how well supported it is (usually around two major updates per year). One can download the latest update (i.e. to go from 7.10 - current, to 8.3 - coming up) when it comes out without having to reinstall. Also, updates can be downloaded locally which does wonders for speed and cap (unlike Microsoft's updates which are international). In fact, all common packages for Ubuntu can be downloaded from a local mirror - it is, after all, Proudly South African

Try Ubuntu, you won't be disappointed

Good point about the local updates.

Yes, ubuntu has a South African name, and a South African SABDFL - but I think that's about has South African as it gets. Canonical's address is in the Isle of Man (AFAIK) and my CDs come from the Netherlands.

 

[chiskop]

Thanks people ....lol...chiskop want talking about you with the flames and terror ways , i was talking about gnome

He can't help it. Mentioning gnome in a linux thread is an invitation to a flame war.

KDE FTW!!!

Ok who knows if matlab works on ubuntu and how is gaming on ubuntu?

I think fskmh can tell you about matlab, and see kasyx's thread about games.

 

[Kasyx]

He can't help it. Mentioning gnome in a linux thread is an invitation to a flame war.

KDE FTW!!!

Yeah. Screw Gnome.

All heil KDE!

 

[Devill]

now see what can happen when you settle down and dont shlt in your best linux supported underwear as soon as some one dares voice their complaints about linux

Now you have answered/corrected me and im really now thinking of getting ubuntu

You guys should really relax a little because if you are trying to convince some one of something flaming him/her is not going to help you one little bit ..... but hay not all people have the maturity nor the intelectual capacity to reason it out like adults but anyway keep shouting someone down instead of advising and explaining things to them.....seems to work great with 3 year olds

PS i was talking about gnome the poster/person