Haiti . . .

[grayston]

What about them? You made the assertion that colonisation was the main factor behind Africa's plight. I debunked that theory by pointing out that 1) "colonization" has taken place throughout history to everybody and 2) other countries, continents and peoples have gone on to prosper after suffering that fate like for example South Korea.

So obviously colonization is not too blame.

Then it must just be that Asians are better than Africans or South Americans at overcoming the lasting effects of colonisation.

Well, okay. Not Asians in general. Just South Korean Asians in specific...

 

[Alan]

Your logic is flawed. To debunk my assertion you need to show that all African countries had failed after colonisation. I can point out Botswana, Namibia and South Africa and various other than are far better off now that when Colonised. I can also point out non African countries who were colonised and are failed states such as most of South America, Eastern Europe and South East Asia.

South Korea and most of the Asian "tiger" economies took 40 years or more after being colonised to make large strides. They and Japan also have the large advantage of being heavily invested in my their post colonial occopiers, The U.S.A.

South Africa has been liberated for only 15. Just by using GDP growth and growth of population over time we will be in a similiar position in 25 years time. So it's a little premature to call us a failed post colonial state don't you think ?

Wait you just debunked your own theory.

Colonization is not the common denominator for the failings of African or any states. But when one does fail oh suddenly here's the convenient politically correct scapegoat.......

 

[grayston]

South Korea was only briefly colonised by the Japanese anyway in modern times. They're known as the hermit Kingdom and were pretty much ignored through out history. Quite different to the hundreds of years of abuse Africa endured. Compare apples with apples.

Fine. So let's compare Botswana with, say, the DRC.

Both African states. Both former colonies. Both currently run by Africans. Both in a continual state of civil war and general unrest OH NO WAIT.

So, either colonialism can be defeated, leaving behind a stable, successful country. Or Africans are naturally violent and ignorant and colonialism just gave them better ways to fight each other.

Which is it? Black or white? There's only one cause for every thing, according to Alan. If colonialism wasn't the cause, what was it? What could it have been?

 

[killadoob]

Wait you just debunked your own theory.

Colonization is not the common denominator for the failings of African or any states. But when one does fail oh suddenly here's the convenient politically correct scapegoat.......

Yup Africans are good at one thing and that is blaming the past.

I am amazed there are people out there who blame the past for africa's problems, it's like believing the world is flat. How on earth can you blame the past for the current? Nobody is saying there are no other countries as bad as african countries but the problem is it's like a disease ruining the entire continent. Allow no education, make sure the government is so corrupt there is no money for people. Defending Africa by using the past is more than likely the biggest problem because they can do what they like and just blame the past and amazingly people are like OK yea maybe that is reason.

The worst thing about africa is people look up to folk like mugabe and the like, they give them standing ovations and vote for them. Of course that is because they are kept dirt poor and uneducated so they cannot think for themselves.

Explain why zimbabwe was doing well even under mugabe and then suddenly bam let's wreck the country. How did colonialism affect that decision? This was in roughly what early 2000.

 

[killadoob]

Pickup this sums it up fairly well bud

A CRISIS OF LEADERSHIP

Venal leaders are the curse of Africa. If sub-Saharan Africa is "in a mess," to quote Julius Nyerere, Tanzania's founding president, it is a mess made by its leaders. To be sure, Africa has its geographical constraints, a cascade of tropical medical ills, and a complex colonial legacy. But where visionary leadership lifted Asia up out of poverty since the 1960s, too many African heads of state in the same period presided over massive declines in African standards of living while carefully enriching themselves and their cronies.

 

[TheHiveMind]

Read up a little on how African despots are kept in power and funded the the West etc in exchange for bias trade deals. The west gets Africa's natural resources and the rich and corrupt stay in power. Did you think all that money coming to Africa from the West was done in the name of charity ? What a sweet mind of a child you have.

So why haven't Africans sorted it out? Why so complacent?

 

[killadoob]

Read up a little on how African despots are kept in power and funded the the West etc in exchange for bias trade deals. The west gets Africa's natural resources and the rich and corrupt stay in power. Did you think all that money coming to Africa from the West was done in the name of charity ? What a sweet mind of a child you have.

So you are saying all the african leaders are corrupt and destroying their countries for money. Exactly what we are saying except you are blaming the west and ignoring the african leaders who are corrupt as shyte allowing their own kind to suffer.

Fsking disgusting in my opinion. So we are actually on the same page except you place the blame on the west and we do not.

 

[zulgin]

Read up on Leopold II and how he raped the Belgium congo. Of the divisive classification of Hutus and Tutsis. The Belgiums directly lead to that genocide. Again compare apples with apples. Botswana was extremely lucky her Diamonds were discovered mostly post colinisation.

you are aware that the Rowandan genocide occured 30 years after indepenence? its absurd to blame the belgiums for their own doing.

 

[grayston]

So you are saying all the african leaders are corrupt and destroying their countries for money.

Dude. Stop being a *****. You want to say that Africans are automatically pre-disposed to be violent, ignorant and cruel, so just say so.

Or are you scared someone might call you a racist? Judge Dennis Davis of the WC High Court was once called a racist by none other than Barney Pityana, and he rolled with it quite well as I recall.

Be like Judge Dennis Davis.

 

[killadoob]

Dude. Stop being a *****. You want to say that Africans are automatically pre-disposed to be violent, ignorant and cruel, so just say so.

Or are you scared someone might call you a racist? Judge Dennis Davis of the WC High Court was once called a racist by none other than Barney Pityana, and he rolled with it quite well as I recall.

Be like Judge Dennis Davis.

If i wanted to say it i would, i am not worried if people think i am racist. I do however wonder why on earth that prize for the best president is never won?

Explain to me why not one single african president can be awarded president of the year?

For me it seems african presidents are pre-disposed to be violent, ignorant and cruel. I do not think it is an african thing to be this way in terms of the general african population but it does seem to plague an african who becomes president.

Explain to me why no african president can win such an award? Surely there must be one african president? no not even one.

 

[Alan]

*sigh*

Degraded to playing the race card.......

 

[killadoob]

*sigh*

Degraded to playing the race card.......

Yup if it isn't the race card then it's the past, always someone or something else to blame.

 

[Alan]

Leopard doesn't change its spots.

Might have fallen out with ANC comrades but still resort to the same tactics.....

 

[grayston]

If i wanted to say it i would, i am not worried if people think i am racist. I do however wonder why on earth that prize for the best president is never won?

Explain to me why not one single african president can be awarded president of the year?

Must be because they're all black, right?

Or maybe there are other issues SUCH AS the legacy of colonialism, which as you will recall, arbitrarily drew borders where none existed and created countries full of different peoples speaking different languages and then just suddenly left them all to their own devices one day.

The colonists didn't just bring roads and electricity, you know!

For me it seems african presidents are pre-disposed to be violent, ignorant and cruel. I do not think it is an african thing to be this way in terms of the general african population but it does seem to plague an african who becomes president.

Fine. But why only African presidents? Why ignore the South American dictators? The Asian military despots? The communist regimes of Eastern Europe? Those people were pretty damn violent and cruel as well.

Explain to me why no african president can win such an award? Surely there must be one african president? no not even one.

Actually, I think you need to explain that one! Why can't any African president win the 'Good Governance Award' (which I believe is what you were referring to).

I know they haven't. But why can't they?

 

[killadoob]

President of the year or good governance it's the same thing. You don't win an Oscar because you suck at acting .

I am not saying only african presidents are horrible nasty people who cause their people to starve i am saying it seems in africa that is the case in just about every country. To me it seems in africa you do not find a good african president where as on other continents you will find decent well run countries.

 

[killadoob]

Do people use the race card so much against you that you have to sigh ? Might be something to do with you. Ever consider that ? No smoke without fire and all that ? I never have the problem of anyone using the race card on me. I suppose that's because I'm not racist.

You must be an african then .

A prejudice against africa, you are damn right i do.

Go and have a look at the suffering, disease, lack of education, starvation and war. Of course i Fking i hate africa. It disgusts me to see what seems like an entire continent of people suffering due to a few dumb corrupt *******s(not the word you may think it is) you know me being racist and all it could only be a racist word

Sadly i cannot live my life and say o well you know over in asia some countries are not run well so let's copy them.

 

[Alan]

Do people use the race card so much against you that you have to sigh ? Might be something to do with you. Ever consider that ? No smoke without fire and all that ? I never have the problem of anyone using the race card on me. I suppose that's because I'm not racist.

So the ANC never used the race card on you. Well, well rather telling.......

Eish what about Mad Bob. Would he not consider you a racist either hmmm

 

[grayston]

President of the year or good governance it's the same thing. You don't win an Oscar because you suck at acting .

I am not saying only african presidents are horrible nasty people who cause their people to starve i am saying it seems in africa that is the case in just about every country. To me it seems in africa you do not find a good african president where as on other continents you will find decent well run countries.

The answer you are looking for is that the continent of Africa is a great cradle. It doesn't get too hot or cold, there's no extreme weather like hurricanes or typhoons, there is no natural _need_ to build permanent structures because there isn't much that you need to protect yourself from.

In Europe, the case is different. The weather sucks. You have to stay indoors more. You need to exercise forward-thinking to make it through the winter, or you'll either freeze or starve. That is why people in Europe "progressed" quicker than in other areas.

However, right up until 1945, Europe was ravaged by war after war after war. Do you know how many times France and England invaded each other? Do you remember what the Scandinavian vikings did? Are you up to date on your history of Cold War-era Eastern Europe and the atrocities committed there? Europe may have 'progressed' further than other places, but the people there were just like people everywhere: selfish, greedy, and willing to do anything to get what they want - including genocide. Do you remember Bosnia?

Seriously, look up your history, son. You'll find that all these terrible things that you believe are endemic to Africans are actually a feature of human beings all over the world. Some do it better, some do it worse, but we all do it. If you can accept that, then you can start to comprehend how hurtful the legacy of colonialism and systemised racial hatred have been.

Humans aren't genetically pre-disposed to be nice to each other - especially not when resources are scarce (or being funnelled off to richer countries). The colonies divided up bits of Africa without regard for the people living there: people who now live in the same country but speak completely different languages and have completely different cultures and beliefs. Take away their food and its inevitable that they would fight. It's happened all over the world. Africa is no different.

The answer to why Africa is still so far behind can be either: external forces making a bad situation worse, or Africans just can't get along with each other. Your inference that Africans as a whole are just a brutal bunch of thugs while people in the rest of the world are higher evolved and better at resolving their differences just doesn't stand up to any sort of scrutiny.

Those Africans throwing stones at each other are no more or less violent than the people in the first world throwing missiles at each other. The only difference is the amount of technology available to them.

People are a-seholes. Everywhere and in every country, you will find a-seholes. From the top to the bottom of society, they are there. Give them right environment and half a chance, and they will show you just how arseholian people can be.

But the point to remember at the end of the day is that they are still just people. And if you were in the same situation, you would end up behaving in exactly the same way.

 

[killadoob]

No dude there is no way in hell i would make millions suffer to enrich myself, i don't know who teaches that class but they should be shot bud.

I never said africans as a bunch i said african leaders, All you are doing is giving me some BS history lesson but you still have not answered why an african president did not win the award again this year? wait the answer will be a page about the Swedish in 1891 or something again.

 

[killadoob]

But tracking your comments you really seem to hate all the people of Africa and think they are all "savages". How could I believe your hate for Africa is just concern for it's people at the hands of their leaders ? That seem very insincere.

Dude how can you like africa, do even realize what goes on in africa? You just go defensive and start harping on racism and what someone said about africans.

Your logic 101

1. it is not the african presidents fault, the west brides them
2. it is not the african presidents fault, the colonialists came to africa
3. it is not the african presidents fault, whites are racist

The best one

4. it is not the african presidents fault, other countries are just as messed up.

Now this logic applies through out africa and it more than likely is the main reason africa is what is because all those poor uneducated folk get told how it is not the presidents fault they are starving. Of course the african presidents ensure the people are poor and uneducated so they will believe the BS they get fed so the african presidents can continue taking brides and living it up while the people of africa suffer.

African logic 101 as applied by pickuptruck and taught all over Africa.