ICT skills shortage a major problem

KMPG want Computer Science grads from universities but don't really want to pay what a BSc degree deserves. Ofcourse they gonna find a shortage.

I dont disagree that there is a shortage, but if they also looked elsewhere ( and not only to universities) for IT skills, they could recruit alot more staff.
 
Bleh! Whining about a lack of graduates being taught how to patch up and maintain their old COBOL barges.
 
Yip... nobody I know who actually means something technically went to study a "degree" or at university.

The people keeping the systems of the world in tippie top shape probably did not go study tertiary (apart from systems training) , so I see a major flaw in the KMPG survey.
 
@KirPlunk, a university degree usually shows that a person is willing to work or can think a little, that is why these companies go after them. When it comes to hiring IT students, there are two major degrees that get you an IT grad. One is a BSc Computer Science and the other is Bcomm Information Systems. I am completing my honours in Computer Science and I have been through KPMG's interview process. It's not the worst, but I do see why they are struggling. I think the shortage is with BEE IT skills (I am indian so I am BEE). A company like KPMG that prides itself on its BEE status (which it really shouldn't do, because personally I think it means nothing) only seems to want to hire people who are "black" under the BEE laws.
 
whatever - this is not the first time I have seen such an article. I have seen Engineers Cum Laude BSc Honors Degrees in Universities, and have personally seen that some of them have no idea how to even configure a basic LAN, and don't even understand what a IP Address is - to much theory and no practical, and now they want to design complex systems...

My opinion is that you cannot beat experience, simple as that. I know more people with almost no formal qualification that can do more magic than those with one...

Off course there will be a skill shortage - look what some IT programmers get paid and they simply leave the industry due to:
1) The amount of hours they have to work
2) The salary they get vs the hours they work
...its crazy!

Selling health insurance can earn you more than working in a industry where there is a so called 'skill shortage'...
 
Maybe if companies were actually willing to pay the IT staff what they are worth more people might actually be interested in going into that sector.

We have to work hours of over time, and not get paid.

We have loads of stress due to ridiculous deadlines because some silly manager who has no idea what the changes required to implement his QUICK change actually entails.

Yet we get paid very little, and we have to be on 24 hour call. So why would people want to go into the IT field.

I personally know of so many people that once they get over a certain age are so irratated with the jobs in the IT sector that they would do anything to get out of it.

So to all those companies out there that want to pay peanuts, you know what you'll get...

As for studies, I did a basic Technikon Diploma way back in '92, not fancy degree, but you what, you need practical experience, not book worm work. I've seen so many people come and go because they don't have the practical knowledge to solve a problem.

:D
 
kadaver said:
Maybe if companies were actually willing to pay the IT staff what they are worth more people might actually be interested in going into that sector.

We have to work hours of over time, and not get paid.

We have loads of stress due to ridiculous deadlines because some silly manager who has no idea what the changes required to implement his QUICK change actually entails.

Yet we get paid very little, and we have to be on 24 hour call. So why would people want to go into the IT field.

I personally know of so many people that once they get over a certain age are so irratated with the jobs in the IT sector that they would do anything to get out of it.

So to all those companies out there that want to pay peanuts, you know what you'll get...

As for studies, I did a basic Technikon Diploma way back in '92, not fancy degree, but you what, you need practical experience, not book worm work. I've seen so many people come and go because they don't have the practical knowledge to solve a problem.

:D
Click to expand...

exactly...can a hear a 'hell yeah!!'
 
Well, i dont know about other degrees, but Computer Science at WITS teach you to think practically and interms of "solving the damn problem." With regards to people not being able to do what they claim to, its a shame but it happens.

I also agree with experience, but most of these companies (and KPMG included) run graduate programs where they teach people who don't really know what to do how to do what they need them to do. The problem here again is they look for grads, and this country just doesn't have enough.

I agree the companies pay **** and if you read my first post, KPMG don't pay what IT staff should get.

Anyways I start an IT job next year, i am happy with the starting salary but I will keep you guys posted about it if your'e intrested.
 
All valid point's made by everyone I must admit...

Unfortunately in the the "Corporate World" there's 2 classes nowadays. IT Guys and everyone else. The main reason why "IT Guys" don't get paid that much or are abused, taken advantage off, etc... Is because IT Guys are not business people. There's managers and there's IT People. You very rarely find a manager high enough who was a hardcore techie IT guy.

The simple reason for this is that companies are run by MD's, CEO's and Board's of Directors. To get to those positions you need to go the business route. Bcomm Accounts, Economics, Finance, etc... and MBA's always help. Mix that together with you IT Degree/Diploma and then Business will love you and pay you what you want.

Unfortunately things dont work like that in the real world. As professionals in the ITC sector we are all kind of thrown into one basket. 1 size fits all, from network support engineer to Software Architect. But there is one thing for certain. You don't need a degree or fancy diploma to be able to do you job in the IT world. I personally find that people with degrees/diploma's actually know less, and require more training then hiring someone who was a "computer hobbyist".

IT is all about experience. EXPERIENCE EXPERIENCE EXPERIENCE EXPERIENCE....
Nothing beats it... The beauty of this is that good and competent managers and decision makers who know what they are doing realize this and only hire people with good track records and who have loads of experience and proof of it. Unfortunately we have many managers and decision makers in today's large corporate companies that just hire individuals in the ICT sector based on race, colour of skin and to fill up qoutas for BEE scorecards.

Not only is this backward, it hampers and damages the career potential of these newly created ICT professionals with no experience in the long run.

The truth is that if you as an ITC professional want to succeed and grow in your career/profession you have going to have to work 3-4 times as hard as anyone else. Whether you a network guy or developer. IT is one of the most cut-throat and fast moving industries in the world. In order for you to stay "relevant" and up to date you have to keep yourself up to date with the latest technologies etc... Being a networker who can build lans, wans, etcc... is not enough. If you can network, develop, graphic design, run SEO campaigns, architect large solutions across SOA and seperate backend systems... the more attractive you'll become and the more marketable.

Its survival of the fittest out there and unfortunately it is so easy to be left behind. The ones that put in the most work and the ones that get the most out. Simple really... Hard work and due diligence equals a career longevity :) <- hopefully...

But there definitely is a huge ITC skills shortage out there. Outsourcing is becoming more and more attractive but you still need local skills to manage that. So lets see what the future holds...
 
KPMG pays rubbish...I know..I did my Bcom IS at Wits (Terrible) ..so I practically had to teach myself how to code.

Their program is geared towards producing people for "Business Analyst" roles. In the end you get graduate not appreciating the tech side of IS..they could learn a thing or two from UCT...

IT people need to get paid properly though..its crazy out there :(
 
Hmm, I have heard about people complaining about quality of degree from wits before... anyone else think their degrees are not so good and didn't turn out to be what they expected? I met a dude who did Honours in Computer Science at RAU and couldn't tell me what a Turing Machine is! Sort of shocked me!
 
Lets start an IT Union! :cool:

Lets see what happens when we strike and complain then, industry will never allow that because they rely to heavily on anything IT, yet we get treated like dogs, or is that monkeys, with peanuts.

But seriously, a Union could work.
 
I think the problem is IT explosion happen about 2000/1 and lots of people went to get those mcse's etc and while this is good for filling in gaps in the market/business it does not do well for careers in the long run.

Nowadays I have seen quite a few companies asking for IT people with a degree + diplomas which is all fine and dandy.. but here comes my gripe. Why would a computer engineer/scientist/Information technology want to do a job that places them on the same plateau as the diploma guys of past? And then it pays often worse off than a specialist in your own field(engineering/maths based).

And then you have the management train that seems to always happen in more developed economies, see US, people realise that there is more money to be made as a manager/lawyer/banker role rather than something technical which is generally harder work. In addition to this banks, insurance companies and other manufacturing etc are starting to recruit engineering, maths and computer scientists for jobs that have absolutely nothing to do with what they studied and pays better too :p

So yah, obviously they gonna loose out.
That being said, was thinking as soon as i get me nice job i'm gonna do a few of those cisco courses, not so much because i need it, but simpkly because knowing how to do something means little when u don't have those diplomas to show and even if i never use it, i love doing technical courses. Something i really disliked about being at university was often the lack of things like it.
 
mezu said:
I did my Bcom IS at Wits (Terrible) ..so I practically had to teach myself how to code.(
Click to expand...

That is also a problem. One of our former employees managed to convince the people that interviewed her that she is a good candidate. I have never in my life being so irritated with someone's complete lack of knowledge about the anything to do with computers, not even to mention her programming skills. She did a B.Com Hons IS and is an excellent example of people with degrees that doesn't fit the skills required by the ICT sector.

My point is that one can't just assume that everyone with degrees will be skilled.
 
Yea i get what you guys are saying, but if you are looking for an out and out programmer why not get a CTI grad that know the language you looking it ? Like i know i can code java but nowhere near some of the guys out there. But yea there are some guys in my class even that can program, but they program such filth it belongs in the dustbin.
 
phiber said:
Well, i dont know about other degrees, but Computer Science at WITS teach you to think practically and interms of "solving the damn problem." With regards to people not being able to do what they claim to, its a shame but it happens.

I also agree with experience, but most of these companies (and KPMG included) run graduate programs where they teach people who don't really know what to do how to do what they need them to do. The problem here again is they look for grads, and this country just doesn't have enough.

I agree the companies pay **** and if you read my first post, KPMG don't pay what IT staff should get.

Anyways I start an IT job next year, i am happy with the starting salary but I will keep you guys posted about it if your'e intrested.
Click to expand...
We have a Wits Electrical Engineering graduate starting off with us and he doesn't know what a VM is, let alone how to set up a testing environment. Bottom line is you can't beat experience. I understand that everyone has to start somewhere, but employers should pay people based on their skill set and prior accomplishments, not what qualification they hold. It's as simple as that.

I have no problem with a graduate with sound experience getting paid more than someone with no qualification and the same level of experience. But to offer graduates who know nothing a better package over a non-graduate with decent knowledge is a slap in the face. Of course there will be a shortage.
 
School of hard knocks...

I studied a bit, but oh what a waste. I learned more working in the industry, and it is up to me to stay updated with my knowledge. I have quoted my experience and personal research way more than anything I have ever studied, and usually it feels real world to the person I am explaining it to, because it is real world.

I think we are entering a future where the average Joe in need of support will go down a little as many are forced to learn the basics to keep going in the different career choices that they make. But along with that more complicated problems will arise I am sure...Create a fool-proof solution, and life throws a better fool...

I am still young, so the challenges in the industry forces me to use my noggin and I like that. I hope I don't get worn out soon like it seems many are. It is hard work, and people are very rarely grateful. Then I struggle to break the 10k a month, where a friend of mine in the UK started IT 2 years ago, finished studying in 6 months and is earning round about 80k a month. I think I should move...:rolleyes:

Sigh!
 
@francoislr how long have you been working for and what do you do ?
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top
Sign up to the MyBroadband newsletter
X