Is the move to adjusted level 4 lockdown a good move?

Is the move to adjusted level 4 lockdown a good move?

  • Yes

    Votes: 118 35.6%

  • It's too much

    Votes: 115 34.7%

  • It's not enough

    Votes: 37 11.2%

  • Other

    Votes: 61 18.4%
  • Total voters
    331
pbpluke said:
Yes, I had a taste of it just a while ago
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Can't even say that the flu can also be dangerous, the covid is the omega and the alpha the one and only.
Just remember no flu deaths happened last year.
 
Lupus said:
Can't even say that the flu can also be dangerous, the covid is the omega and the alpha the one and only.
Just remember no flu deaths happened last year.
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Yes, amazingly flu seems to have been "eradicated". People seem to have stopped dying from TB and AIDS as well. All I know, is our freedoms are on the line here. They will keep taking them away to keep us "safe". And it won't be given back. The lockdowns were Supposed to just allow hospitals to prepare for the on rush of patients that was expected. Somehow it has become that we must hide away from the virus. A pandemic should make us really scared with the dead bodies piling up, yet I have not seen this. In actual fact the government has to keep reminding us their is a pandemic. So when people come along and tell me I should be scared, I really find it hard to be scared. What does scare me is the slow but continuous move to take our rights away.
 
rietrot said:
Well apparently it is childish behavior for an adult to want to be free and engage in normal economic and social intercourse.
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Let's rather call the economic intercourse what it really is...... trying to survive....

The government says non-essential businesses have no such right as others are more important...
 
pbpluke said:
Yes, amazingly flu seems to have been "eradicated". People seem to have stopped dying from TB and AIDS as well. All I know, is our freedoms are on the line here. They will keep taking them away to keep us "safe". And it won't be given back. The lockdowns were Supposed to just allow hospitals to prepare for the on rush of patients that was expected. Somehow it has become that we must hide away from the virus. A pandemic should make us really scared with the dead bodies piling up, yet I have not seen this. In actual fact the government has to keep reminding us their is a pandemic. So when people come along and tell me I should be scared, I really find it hard to be scared. What does scare me is the slow but continuous move to take our rights away.
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You'll need to back that one up.

Note:
On 30 January 2020 COVID-19 was declared a Public Health Emergency of International Concern (PHEIC) with an official death toll of 171. By 31 December 2020, this figure stood at 1 813 188. Yet preliminary estimates suggest the total number of global deaths attributable to the COVID-19 pandemic in 2020 is at least 3 million, representing 1.2 million more deaths than officially reported.

With the latest COVID-19 deaths reported to WHO now exceeding 3.3 million, based on the excess mortality estimates produced for 2020, we are likely facing a significant undercount of total deaths directly and indirectly attributed to COVID-19.

1624900721761.png

www.who.int

The true death toll of COVID-19 estimating global excess mortality

Estimates suggest the total number of global deaths attributable to the COVID-19 pandemic in 2020 is at least 3 million, representing 1.2 million more deaths than officially reported.
www.who.int www.who.int
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That was back in the beginning of the year, this one is from May: https://www.reuters.com/world/afric...higher-than-official-tally-report-2021-05-13/
JOHANNESBURG, May 13 (Reuters) - A South African report into excess deaths over the past year suggests more than 133,000 people in the country have died from COVID-19, far more than the official tally of nearly 55,000.

The South African Medical Research Council (SAMRC) has been monitoring excess deaths since May 2020.

In its latest report, published on Wednesday, the SAMRC said South Africa had seen 157,000 excess deaths in the past 12 months and estimated that 85% of them were caused by COVID-19, which means just over 133,000 people have died from the disease.

This compares to an official death toll of 54,968 since the start of the pandemic.

[...]
The SAMRC report said the excess death rate per 100,000 population for South Africa was 258 over the past 12 months. This places the country - on an age-standardised basis - in the top five countries for which excess deaths are measured.
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Delta variant is hitting after that report, the main one in Gauteng:

Is the Delta variant more transmissible?​

“Most studies indicate Delta is 50-60% more transmissible than the Alpha variant,” says Dr Bhramar Mukherjee, associate director for quantitative data sciences at the University of Michigan Rogel Cancer Center. “The Alpha variant itself was nearly 50-60% more transmissible than the original strain.”

This, according to Mukherjee, implies that if the reproduction number for the original strain was around 2.4-2.6, the one for Alpha is 3.6-4.2, and for Delta it is 5.6-6.7. In layman terms, if a person infected with the original strain could infect nearly two people, a person with the Alpha variant could infect four people. With Delta, one person could infect nearly seven other people. It’s important to remember that these are averages, not absolute numbers; one Delta carrier might infect zero people, or 25.

[...]
The other consequence of a higher reproduction number (denoted as R in epidemiological data) in an epidemic is that it increases the threshold for herd immunity. That is, more people will need to have the antibodies—either through infection or vaccination—to be protected as a community against the Delta variant. “With an R of 2.5, the threshold for herd immunity is 60%, but with an R of 6, it is 83%,” explains Mukherjee.

qz.com

How dangerous is the Covid-19 delta variant?

Delta variant, a strain of Covid-19 that likely wreaked havoc during India’s second wave has been identified in at least 85 countries. According to the World Health Organization (WHO), the delta covid variant is the most transmissible of all the variants identified so far. Acknowledging the...
qz.com qz.com
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Johnatan56 said:
You'll need to back that one up.

Note:

That was back in the beginning of the year, this one is from May: https://www.reuters.com/world/afric...higher-than-official-tally-report-2021-05-13/
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Actually I don't need to back it up. My point was that I don't see anyone dying around me. What the media says is another story. And you welcome to believe the media if you want. I'm not saying you must believe what I believe. If you see people dying left right and center around you, then your reality will be that people are dying by the hundreds and thousands. I'm not saying you have to believe what I believe, And I most definitely don't have to back up anything I say just because you demand it.
 
pbpluke said:
Actually I don't need to back it up. My point was that I don't see anyone dying around me. What the media says is another story. And you welcome to believe the media if you want. I'm not saying you must believe what I believe. If you see people dying left right and center around you, then your reality will be that people are dying by the hundreds and thousands. I'm not saying you have to believe what I believe, And I most definitely don't have to back up anything I say just because you demand it.
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So in your bubble no one has gotten it yet, doesn't mean it isn't a problem, that's a very narrow view, good luck with using the same logic for everything.
And if you make a claim of no one died of AIDS/HIV, you do need to back it up, it's obviously false.
 
Corelli said:
Some people live in shacks, it leaks terribly. They can tell you how it is to starve. There are people way less fortunate than the useless politicians that complain. Ah shame, they cant goto Woolies, or watch rugby matches live (while drinking beer with their friends).

Honestly there are kids that barely gets food in their tummy, they sleep on wet floors from the rain, they goto school hungry not having eaten for days.
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And now they will have even less because their parents can't go to work and feed the rest of the family
 
Johnatan56 said:
So in your bubble no one has gotten it yet, doesn't mean it isn't a problem, that's a very narrow view, good luck with using the same logic for everything.
And if you make a claim of no one died of AIDS/HIV, you do need to back it up, it's obviously false.
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Obviously peole have died of AIDS and TB. You somehow seem to not understand
sarcasm. All we hear of is the covid deaths. However in your bubble it seems everything the media tells you, you believe. I bet you think the vaccine is a tried and tested product too.
 
pbpluke said:
Obviously peole have died of AIDS and TB. You somehow seem to not understand
sarcasm. All we hear of is the covid deaths. However in your bubble it seems everything the media tells you, you believe. I bet you think the vaccine is a tried and tested product too.
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Red herring there, nice.
 
pinball wizard said:
BTW, it's evolutionary disadvantageous for a virus to become more deadly. It dies when it's host dies. It's evolutionary beneficial to become more transmissible but less deadly.
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But it will become do if evolutionary weaker strains loose their advantage. Like through lockdowns (aka selective pressure)
 
pbpluke said:
Obviously peole have died of AIDS and TB. You somehow seem to not understand
sarcasm. All we hear of is the covid deaths. However in your bubble it seems everything the media tells you, you believe. I bet you think the vaccine is a tried and tested product too.
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There are many people (also on this forum) who's bubble includes dead family & friends from the first round of covid. Be careful of too much generalizing from your own experience.
 
pbpluke said:
Actually I don't need to back it up. My point was that I don't see anyone dying around me. What the media says is another story. And you welcome to believe the media if you want. I'm not saying you must believe what I believe. If you see people dying left right and center around you, then your reality will be that people are dying by the hundreds and thousands. I'm not saying you have to believe what I believe, And I most definitely don't have to back up anything I say just because you demand it.
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Half true......most people are dying in the hospitals.....very sad places to visit these days.
 
As long as there are 7 Billion people plus on the planet, and travel between countries are possible, this see-saw game might go on forever, just as it cooled down you here a new mutation surfaced and a fresh fly in from another country, and there it goes again. Now to get 7 Billion people vaccinated within 6 months is impossible practically.
It wil be interesting to see how this one ends.
 
Moto Guzzi said:
As long as there are 7 Billion people plus on the planet, and travel between countries are possible, this see-saw game might go on forever, just as it cooled down you here a new mutation surfaced and a fresh fly in from another country, and there it goes again. Now to get 7 Billion people vaccinated within 6 months is impossible practically.
It wil be interesting to see how this one ends.
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I just hope i will be around to see how this ends.
 
saor said:
There are many people (also on this forum) who's bubble includes dead family & friends from the first round of covid. Be careful of too much generalizing from your own experience.
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Unfortunately people die everyday from many different reasons. And it is a terrible situation, but it is a fact of life. Trying to make my views offensive to everyone seems to be your effort to censor my views. I hope you get round to having a go at everyon else that does not feel as you do. I must believe your reality, And to not do so is offensive.
 
pbpluke said:
Trying to make my views offensive to everyone seems to be your effort to censor my views.
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Dafuq are you on about? I was merely pointing out that people are dying even if you don't see it happening.

pbpluke said:
Actually I don't need to back it up. My point was that I don't see anyone dying around me.
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There are plenty people on this forum who've seen people die due to covid. Go speak to someone who works in a hospital and ask them how the last year has been.
 
saor said:
There are many people (also on this forum) who's bubble includes dead family & friends from the first round of covid. Be careful of too much generalizing from your own experience.
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There are just as many (well, statistically there must be many more) whose bubble includes family and friends who contracted covid and made a perfectly fine recovery.

Be careful not to over-emphasise on the personal effect of anything.
 
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