Jooste sacked as Steinhoff CEO

rietrot said:
This report value their share at R20 bottom 1st page, now trading at R11 I'm taking the gamble. They are to big to fail.
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Too big to fail? Remember that they are not a bank, so there is probably no Reserve Bank that is going to rescue them. Plus the parts are greater than the sum at this stage, so its worth unbundling it.
 
rza said:
Too big to fail? Remember that they are not a bank, so there is probably no Reserve Bank that is going to rescue them. Plus the parts are greater than the sum at this stage, so its worth unbundling it.
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I wouldn't want them to get rescued by rhe government or central bank. You do realise which stores steinhoff opperate right?
 
rza said:
Too big to fail? Remember that they are not a bank, so there is probably no Reserve Bank that is going to rescue them. Plus the parts are greater than the sum at this stage, so its worth unbundling it.
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For once, I'm with rza on this one.

Best case scenario, they can still operate but with massive impairments, maybe sell some subsidiaries.

Worst case scenario, they'll be debundled and the subsidiaries sold one by one.

The money will first go for the tax liabilities, fines, employees and secured creditors.

The shareholders will be last, if there is something left.

I wouldn't touch this share with a 10ft pole.
 
The JSE seem to to be adopting some sort of wait and see and unless there is evidence of insider trading they seem happy to just let the carnage go on.
 
https://www.fin24.com/Companies/Retail/steinhoff-starts-selling-assets-to-raise-r16bn-20171207

Johannesburg - Steinhoff International extended Wednesday’s record plunge in the wake of an accounting scandal and said it planned to raise at lease €1bn from an asset sale to boost liquidity.

The global retailer also confirmed that chief financial officer Ben La Grange remains in his position as there’s no evidence he was involved in matters being investigated.
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Meaning they do have a liquidity issue, they are probably going to get raped on the value of these assets.
 
R13... said:
The JSE seem to to be adopting some sort of wait and see and unless there is evidence of insider trading they seem happy to just let the carnage go on.
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A good thing. If you don't want to sell your shares at this prices you don't have to. Let the market take its course.
 
rietrot said:
I wouldn't want them to get rescued by rhe government or central bank. You do realise which stores steinhoff opperate right?
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Yes I'm aware, but they can't run when the holding company is cash strapped and high in debt. The best ting for those stores is to go alone otherwise they'll go down with the holding company. Remember that in most groups like Steinhoff the cash is managed centrally by Group Treasury, and that's the problem is.
 
rietrot said:
A good thing. If you don't want to sell your shares at this prices you don't have to. Let the market take its course.
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I don't want to know what a person will do when they have lost 80% of their money. The most natural thing is to wait it out and hope that you can recoup the losses, but unfortunately that is more a heart decision than a head decision. Feeling sorry for those who lost their money.
 
rietrot said:
Basically what their SENS this morning said. And they plan on using the south african subsidiary to raise another Billion, that's somewhat concerning.
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If they need cash now then you know they are in trouble.
 
rza said:
Yes I'm aware, but they can't run when the holding company is cash strapped and high in debt. The best ting for those stores is to go alone otherwise they'll go down with the holding company. Remember that in most groups like Steinhoff the cash is managed centrally by Group Treasury, and that's the problem is.
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Unbundleing them at this stage would be a mess. They can't just go alone, ownership is still at group level and with the shareholders, the only concern is their liabilities, but I'm sure some more creative accounting will easily restructure that.
 
Christo is back on saddle - he will try to sort it out as honestly as possible.
 
surface said:
Christo is back on saddle - he will try to sort it out as honestly as possible.
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I wouldn't be that sure, he is the beneficial owner of some of the off balance sheet entities.

https://viceroyresearch.files.wordpress.com/2017/12/steinhoff-article-viceroy2.pdf

Southern View Finance: a Wiese entity which held two loss-making consumer finance issuers operating at Steinhoff entities: JD Consumer Finance and Capfin. Southern View Finance received significant financial support from Steinhoff and kept its loss-making loan portfolio off Steinhoff’s books for several years before selling them to Campion Capital. Steinhoff has recently purchased Capfin and JD Consumer Finance’s administration and collection facilities, allowing the company to book further income from off-balance sheet, non-performing loans.
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rza said:
You can't put honesty and Stellenbosch Mafia in the same sentence. :D
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My take is that he is being targeted by "colonialists" like he was in 2012.

https://www.iol.co.za/the-star/tycoon-fights-for-seized-millions-1329192
An SA billionaire says he should not have been treated with suspicion for trying to board a plane with nearly £700 000 (R9.2 million) in cash – because that amount of money is peanuts to him.

Customs officers seized £674 920 from Christo Wiese at London City Airport in 2009, and a judge later ordered that the money be forfeited as “the proceeds of criminal activity”.
 
rza said:
You can't put honesty and Stellenbosch Mafia in the same sentence. :D
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Interesting, had to look it up. Markus & Christo - both are from 'bosch. Markus has been with Steinhoff since 1988 and Christo from 2011. No scandals for either of them before so wonder what happened now.
 
surface said:
Interesting, had to look it up. Markus & Christo - both are from 'bosch. Markus has been with Steinhoff since 1988 and Christo from 2011. No scandals for either of them before so wonder what happened now.
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You can't trust guys who go around with $1m in their back pack. :D
 
https://www.dailymaverick.co.za/art...s-multichoice-faces-fires-on-multiple-fronts/

The Way of Gupta? Pressure mounts for Naspers as MultiChoice faces fires on multiple fronts

With MultiChoice accused of having essentially “bought” government policy over digital encryption to benefit its business, calls for investigations are heaping up both locally and internationally. In addition to a potential class action lawsuit against the company being mooted by a US firm, the Chinese Securities Regulatory Commission has also been asked to launch an inquiry into Naspers. Comparisons between Naspers and the Gupta-owned company Oakbay, meanwhile, are inevitable. By REBECCA DAVIS.
 
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