Leaving SA for good

LancelotSA said:
So I trust you will blame yourself if you were to run and something were to happen to your family there? Perhaps a victim of crime. Perhaps a victim in a car accident. Perhaps a victim of drug addiction. Perhaps... perhaps... perhaps... If you never left these things might never have happened. You would never forgive yourself..... You see how life works?
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Now that's just a specious argument. There is a direct correlation between living in SA and increased exposure to violent crime. Obviously X thing happens in Y places, but the higher the frequency of X in a given location, the higher the chance of encountering X. I am trying to lower the risk of my family being exposed to X, in this case violent crime. In doing so they will actually have reduced incidence of being exposed to car accidents as well.

And really you shouldn't be getting down. I'm not trying to convince anybody. Whether you choose to live in SA or not is your business, as is my position on many other things such as religion. I shan't criticise you but for you to trivialise my exposure to violent crime and murder is testament to you having grown up or having spent too long in this country.
 
nkpza said:
In SA, I earn good money in IT and will move up the ladder quickly. In Canada, I'll have to start at a lower paylevel and compete with the other millions of Chinese and Indian immigrants. However I'm more confident about the future, albeit a dull, predictable one, in Canada than I am in SA. Anyone else contemplating the same/similar move? Just want to hear other points of view on this...
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Tough one. Hmm. Move to a dull cold place to face a very competitive environment...? Or stay in sunny SA where your skills guarantee you a good salary and prompt promotions...? Err, what was your question again?
 
nkpza said:
Anyone else contemplating the same/similar move? Just want to hear other points of view on this...
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Already gone.

Currently residing in Aotearoa.

All the whinging about other countries have problems like SA is BS.

They have problems granted, but nothing like on the scale of South Africa, The Aotearoans can't begin to even comprehend the risks and lifestyle sacrifices that South African's face every day.

Their eyes just glaze over when you tell them.
 
cbrunsdonza said:
I'm trying to keep my options open just in case. If things really do hit the fan I'm covered but only if airlifts where being deployed.

Personally I would love to work in Canada or New Zeeland for a few years but will most likely only do that once my kids are out of school (in 18 yrs time). But I would return.
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Rather do it now and give your kids the benefit of growing up in a first world society.
 
Milano said:
Tough one. Hmm. Move to a dull cold place to face a very competitive environment...? Or stay in sunny SA where your skills guarantee you a good salary and prompt promotions...? Err, what was your question again?
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Depends on how scared you are of fair competition.
 
alloytoo said:
Already gone.

Currently residing in Aotearoa.

All the whinging about other countries have problems like SA is BS.

They have problems granted, but nothing like on the scale of South Africa, The Aotearoans can't begin to even comprehend the risks and lifestyle sacrifices that South African's face every day.

Their eyes just glaze over when you tell them.
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...and here he is clutching to his South African roots, which he apparently despises so much, by continuing to hang around a South African forum.

And glad to see you are one of those who go overseas and then bash South Africa. Of course you have no desire to see this country improve and bashing it suits your needs. Nice one.
 
I am sending my better half over to the UK to see if she can carve a future for herself out of the profession (travel) that she enjoys.
I have watched her be abused by our travel companies, working 6 days a week, 7 days in season, with 14 days of annual leave and token overtime pay for more than 5 years now, the latest trick pulled was to give the management position that she was in line for to a person who has been working there for 3 months (and a bit) as an AA placement.
The trend amongst our companies is clear.
Quite funny really, she has been hijacked twice, we have been burgled twice and I was lucky enough to manage to fight off 4 peeps armed with knives at the latest attempt.
Crime we can still deal with, BUT it becomes extremely problematic when you realise that you will not be able to build a career in this country with the current policies that are forced into place by government.
If she fails, well then at least she gave it a shot, and she will have to resign herself to being an underpaid go-nowhere slave until these idiotic racial policies are amended.
Sad really, and this whole experience has lowered my pride in my country quite substantially.
As for me, I spend 93% of my life indoors staring at a screen bashing on a keyboard, I can do that anywhere they have electricity and reasonable internet.
 
LancelotSA said:
...and here he is clutching to his South African roots, which he apparently despises so much, by continuing to hang around a South African forum.

And glad to see you are one of those who go overseas and then bash South Africa. Of course you have no desire to see this country improve and bashing it suits your needs. Nice one.
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Lance, just because people emigrate does not mean they love SA less. It just means they chose to live elsewhere. I am sure they do miss SA.

The longest I left SA was for a 6 month travel stint and I tried to keep up with what was happening here by reading.
 
nkpza said:
Got the stamp on my passport allowing me to move+work in Canada. I applied so that I have an option in case things go badly in SA. Now that I have it, all I can think of is selling everything and moving. I don't have family in SA and most of my SA friends will be moving to UK,Aus, Canada or US in the next 1-2 years. Part of me wants to stay in SA and be part of the process of building the country so I can be part of something bigger. Other part of me is pessimistic and telling me to leave while I can and my savings are worth something. In SA, I earn good money in IT and will move up the ladder quickly. In Canada, I'll have to start at a lower paylevel and compete with the other millions of Chinese and Indian immigrants. However I'm more confident about the future, albeit a dull, predictable one, in Canada than I am in SA.

Anyone else contemplating the same/similar move? Just want to hear other points of view on this...
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Good luck with your venture! The world has become a small place, boundaries are diminishing, give it a go I say - and if it doesn't work come back.
 
mass09 said:
Have a look here for stats on murder with firearms - Link
South Africa - 31,918
Canada - 144

And per capita
SA - 0.719782 per 1,000 people
Canada - 0.00502972 per 1,000 people
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turned out those statistics are outdated and totally implausible. anyone got a reliable source?
 
SiriS said:
Good luck with your venture! The world has become a small place, boundaries are diminishing, give it a go I say - and if it doesn't work come back.
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I find myself agreeing with this post. Nothing ventured nothing gained.

I would wait until next year though. Few things will dishearten me faster than moving straight into a Canadian winter knowing it's summer here.
 
LancelotSA said:
...and here he is clutching to his South African roots, which he apparently despises so much, by continuing to hang around a South African forum.
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I don't despise this forum.

And glad to see you are one of those who go overseas and then bash South Africa.
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The truth isn't bashing.

Of course you have no desire to see this country improve and bashing it suits your needs. Nice one.
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Spent too long waiting for the country to improve, wasted time, wasted taxes, wasted effort.
 
Wikipedia has more up to date stats but they aren't particularly pleasant reading either. South African murder rates have apparently dropped by about 10% but how much of that is as a result of the well publicised misreporting of stats by SAPS is not certain.

Canada is vastly superior in terms of crime. However, your first Winter there will probably kill you.
 
LancelotSA said:
...and here he is clutching to his South African roots, which he apparently despises so much, by continuing to hang around a South African forum.

And glad to see you are one of those who go overseas and then bash South Africa. Of course you have no desire to see this country improve and bashing it suits your needs. Nice one.
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I fail to see where he despises anything.
It is reality that its safer living in Canada than it is here in SA. That doesnt mean he hates SA, it might just mean he wants to lead a lifestyle where he feels safer on a day to day basis.
 
Rocket-Boy said:
I fail to see where he despises anything.
It is reality that its safer living in Canada than it is here in SA. That doesnt mean he hates SA, it might just mean he wants to lead a lifestyle where he feels safer on a day to day basis.
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I'm not seeing it either. He seems to hate the extent of the violent crime wave that seems to be enveloping the nation but nowhere does he say he hates the country. Perhaps LancelotSA should refrain from trying to read too much in between the lines?
 
Linky for all sorts of stats

Total crimes per capita for
SA - 77 per 1000
Canada - 75 per 1000
The UK, US and New Zealand are higher than us. However, they have mostly non violent crime. You can check the murder rates, robberies etc to verify this. But I think that with better education our violent crime rates will drop.
 
Archer said:
Linky for all sorts of stats

Total crimes per capita for
SA - 77 per 1000
Canada - 75 per 1000
The UK, US and New Zealand are higher than us. However, they have mostly non violent crime. You can check the murder rates, robberies etc to verify this. But I think that with better education our violent crime rates will drop.
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David+Bristol
4th June 2010 The figures are over 12 years old, don't take them seriously!!
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interesting ..... :rolleyes:
 
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