London Terror Arrests Disrupted Public Beheading Plot

[ShaunSA]

I was under the impression that the quran stipulates that all infidels are to be killed?

It's open to interpretation

 

[STS]

So it's open to interpretation but his is wrong and yours is right?

one again, i'm drawing a difference. there is a difference between sex and rape, even tho they're both the same act. when you start saying "no no, there is a difference", so it's the same with interpretation

 

[Ockie]

It's open to interpretation

"And kill them wherever you find them, and turn them out from where they have turned you out. And Al-Fitnah (disbelief) is worse than killing."

So what does that mean then?

 

[Hamster]

I'm no expert on the Quran, but I believe this is the verse:

(9:5)*And when the forbidden months have passed, kill the idolaters wherever you find them and take them*prisoners, and beleaguer them, and lie in wait for them at every place of ambush. But if they repent and observe Prayer and pay the Zakat, then leave their way*free. Surely, Allah is Most Forgiving, Merciful.

If I'm not mistaken most say this should be read in the context of the time and it had to do with a violated peace treaty. Easy to see though how the but jobs can misinterpret this. Very open to interpretation especially to us non Muslims.

 

[STS]

"And kill them wherever you find them, and turn them out from where they have turned you out. And Al-Fitnah (disbelief) is worse than killing."

So what does that mean then?

and do you know the context of that verse and why he said it, and what followed? or is it simply a verse that people grab and point to and scream "AAAHHH! THEY WANT TO KILL USS!!!"?

 

[OrbitalDawn]

I'm no expert on the Quran, but I believe this is the verse:



If I'm not mistaken most say this should be read in the context of the time and it had to do with a violated peace treaty. Easy to see though how the but jobs can misinterpret this. Very open to interpretation especially to us non Muslims.

Indeed. Similar to Deuteronomy 13: 6-16

“If your brother, the son of your mother, your son or your daughter, the wife of your bosom, or your friend who is as your own soul, secretly entices you, saying, ‘Let us go and serve other gods,’ which you have not known, neither you nor your fathers, of the gods of the people which are all around you, near to you or far off from you, from one end of the earth to the other end of the earth, you shall not consent to him or listen to him, nor shall your eye pity him, nor shall you spare him or conceal him; but you shall surely kill him; your hand shall be first against him to put him to death, and afterward the hand of all the people. And you shall stone him with stones until he dies, because he sought to entice you away from the Lord your God, who brought you out of the land of Egypt, from the house of bondage. So all Israel shall hear and fear, and not again do such wickedness as this among you.

“If you hear someone in one of your cities, which the Lord your God gives you to dwell in, saying, ‘Corrupt men have gone out from among you and enticed the inhabitants of their city, saying, “Let us go and serve other gods”’—which you have not known— then you shall inquire, search out, and ask diligently. And if it is indeed true and certain that such an abomination was committed among you, you shall surely strike the inhabitants of that city with the edge of the sword, utterly destroying it, all that is in it and its livestock—with the edge of the sword. And you shall gather all its plunder into the middle of the street, and completely burn with fire the city and all its plunder, for the Lord your God. It shall be a heap forever; it shall not be built again.

 

[STS]

I'm no expert on the Quran, but I believe this is the verse:

If I'm not mistaken most say this should be read in the context of the time and it had to do with a violated peace treaty. Easy to see though how the but jobs can misinterpret this. Very open to interpretation especially to us non Muslims.

the verse in question was because after suffering persecution for years, they ran away to another area and when they were chased down and continued to be harassed, they lost their **** and fought back

while war is never nice, there is no doubt that sometimes nations have to fight back, and at the time the muslims had the best ethics when fighting in a war. today there are too many splinter beliefs and cultures differ too greatly and too many history lessons for there to be any kind of unity

 

[ShaunSA]

one again, i'm drawing a difference. there is a difference between sex and rape, even tho they're both the same act. when you start saying "no no, there is a difference", so it's the same with interpretation

You are drawing a difference according to YOUR interpretation. And then calling his interpretation bollocks.

 

[OrbitalDawn]

"And kill them wherever you find them, and turn them out from where they have turned you out. And Al-Fitnah (disbelief) is worse than killing."

So what does that mean then?

Fitnah isn't disbelief, so you can already spot the agenda there.

And check out the verses before and after that one. Seems the historical context was a war, so it's about a war in self-defense, and says hostilities should stop immediately when hostilities against you stop.

 

[Nick333]

Only a savage would behead a[-]n innocent[/-] person , they are cowards and should be exterminated .

Fixed.

 

[Ockie]

and do you know the context of that verse and why he said it, and what followed? or is it simply a verse that people grab and point to and scream "AAAHHH! THEY WANT TO KILL USS!!!"?

Well, all I know is that islamic terrorists are getting worse and worse and people are afraid, and they should be. No matter the context that their prophet in the desert had in mind 2000 years ago, they are killing in the name of their god and islam. I will not be caring about the context Mr Muhammad had in mind as a knife cuts my head off.

 

[STS]

You are drawing a difference according to YOUR interpretation. And then calling his interpretation bollocks.

i'm not arguing interpretation, i'm arguing logic i don't deny the existence of god based on interpretation, nor do i treat every person as a terrorist based on interpetation

 

[Grant]

It's news like this that makes most people give a pass to the Surveillance State.

Pity the poor frustrated prospective beheaders, who were hoping to die at the hands of the infidels as they resisted capture. They'll have to wait out their prison spells before they have another shot at 'martyrdom' so as to get at the 72 high-breasted virgins, as promised by Muhammad.

"Theirs shall be gardens and vineyards and high-bosomed maidens for companions.” ∼ Koran 78:31-33.

Sex is probably the greatest motivator for young muslim men who go on jihad. Islam has only one absolutely guaranteed way of getting to paradise with its nympho virgins, and that is to die in battle for the faith. A fool's paradise.

soos vir dit:
[video=youtube;_vj-IfC1vHU]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_vj-IfC1vHU&list=UUGm3p8cbctFRIXEtfbWiMxQ[/video]

 

[STS]

Well, all I know is that islamic terrorists are getting worse and worse and people are afraid, and they should be. No matter the context that their prophet in the desert had in mind 2000 years ago, they are killing in the name of their god and islam. I will not be caring about the context Mr Muhammad had in mind as a knife cuts my head off.

it's only getting worse because you're noticing it more and mor information is available now, but it's ALWAYS been this way. just because we don't have the beheadings from the Crusades uploaded to instagram or the Liveleaks of witches being burnt doesn't mean that the world has become more savage

things have also become a lot better in the world. we only see the bad news so often, just as people see the bad news of our country

 

[STS]

soos vir dit:

[video=youtube;wC4Trv8PWBU]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wC4Trv8PWBU[/video]

from a movie but sums up my brother's attitude when people give him ****

 

[Ockie]

it's only getting worse because you're noticing it more and mor information is available now, but it's ALWAYS been this way. just because we don't have the beheadings from the Crusades uploaded to instagram or the Liveleaks of witches being burnt doesn't mean that the world has become more savage

things have also become a lot better in the world. we only see the bad news so often, just as people see the bad news of our country

Oh ok. I am sorry, I will not worry then anymore about the beheading of journalists, planes being flown in to skyscrapers, london being bombed, a soldier having his head cut off in a street in London, or plans for more beheading of innocents in London, or that terrorists are now being trained and coming out of non Muslim countries like the UK etc. I feel much better now, because the world was always ****. What a relief. Thanks you for that.

And seeing that you bring up the crusades and the witch hunts, I aint no fan of Christianity either....but at least you don't have christians going around blowing things up and terrorizing the world.

 

[OrbitalDawn]

Oh ok. I am sorry, I will not worry then anymore about the beheading of journalists, planes being flown in to skyscrapers, london being bombed, a soldier having his head cut off in a street in London, or plans for more beheading of innocents in London, or that terrorists are now being trained and coming out of non Muslim countries like the UK etc. I feel much better now, because the world was always ****. What a relief. Thanks you for that.

And seeing that you bring up the crusades and the witch hunts, I aint no fan of Christianity either....but at least you don't have christians going around blowing things up and terrorizing the world.

Don't be disingenuous now. That's not what he's saying.

 

[Grant]

it's only getting worse because you're noticing it more and mor information is available now, but it's ALWAYS been this way. just because we don't have the beheadings from the Crusades uploaded to instagram or the Liveleaks of witches being burnt doesn't mean that the world has become more savage

things have also become a lot better in the world. we only see the bad news so often, just as people see the bad news of our country

interesting you brought up the crusades - you see the difference is, the adherents to that religion, have a 1000 years later moved on, whereas the ones responsible for the beheadings, 1000 years later - refuse to.

 

[chrisc]

Sex is probably the greatest motivator for young muslim men who go on jihad. Islam has only one absolutely guaranteed way of getting to paradise with its nympho virgins, and that is to die in battle for the faith. A fool's paradise.

How can a virgin be a nympho? She will not have had the experience to yet become a nympho, surely that takes a lot of work, lying on your back?

 

[STS]

Oh ok. I am sorry, I will not worry then anymore about the beheading of journalists, planes being flown in to skyscrapers, london being bombed, a soldier having his head cut off in a street in London, or plans for more beheading of innocents in London, or that terrorists are now being trained and coming out of non Muslim countries like the UK etc. I feel much better now, because the world was always ****. What a relief. Thanks you for that.

And seeing that you bring up the crusades and the witch hunts, I aint no fan of Christianity either....but at least you don't have christians going around blowing things up and terrorizing the world.

you said things were getting worse, i was merely pointing out that the situation has always been this way. this does not mean you should ignore any future evil and wrongs, just don't act like it's a new phenomenon.