Luke Watson Saga

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Addressing the wrongs, :sick:
How, by appointing AA rugby officials and AA players that effectively make a mockery of the game, what a joke.

There are more and more players of colour coming through the official channels now and making it purely on merit into the top sides.
Why are the ANC not happy about this? Why? The future looks good if the people get on with it.
 
Pity it's going to ruin the country :o

Yeah like Apartheid and the Nat govt was a blessing for this country and who had to clean up the effects of this grand experiment and social mess and pay back all those international debts ???.

Not the Nats mind you but the ANC ... how ironic but rather fortunate for us all.
 
At least I know where I stand. Do you?

Indeed ... I stand with the majority of South Africans ... we are not the ones who are disgruntled about the changes in our society or that are stuck in the past.
 
I don't remember rugby being a political football during apartheid.

Didn't the Springboks win a lot of games during that period?
 
The question that has to be asked is do we want to just participate in international sport or are we there to compete? If all SA Rugby / Cricket / Soccer / Whoever wants is participation, then by all means, put whoever you want in the side because it doesn’t matter if the team wins or loses as long as they take part. Officials should just be prepared to trade their expensive German sedans in on something more affordable when sponsors take their money elsewhere and they have to start looking for a real job.

I doubt the problem here is with Luke Watson as a player, I’m sure there are as many Watson supporters out there that disagree with his exclusion as there are those who disagree with his inclusion.

The problem lies in administrators interfering with decisions they have made the coach and selectors ultimately responsible for. If they force players in, and the team doesn’t perform, whose fault is it? This is made worse when selections are made by people who at the end of the day are first of all are unqualified to make the them, and secondly don’t even bother to consult the selection committee. Administrators should do exactly that … administer… if they want to get involved in the coaching they should apply for the job along with all the other suitably qualified applicants

Irrespective of the form of the affected players, these are team sports, and as such players have to perform as a team. A coach selects players not only for their relative abilities on the playing field, but also based on how the player will enhance the dynamics of the team. This works exactly the same in business. If I don’t feel someone will “fit” my team, I won’t employ them no matter how good a worker they are. Any effective environment works this way.
 
After these comments, Jake White should resign and Stofile and Hoskins should coach the Springboks for the world cup so we can see how far they get with their 'popular selection' equal opportunity side...
Cannot believe the fiasco regarding this.

A white player is now a black player. The coach who 'should' know best is overruled by 'government' about quotas (nevermind the white skin, which should be black.) Dance macabre doesn't even come close. And in the background are charts and number games describing "how it should be."

As I sit and watch this on tv there is absolutely no difference between our present government and the last one. The numbers game. The quality of your hair (the colour of your skin.) SICKENING. This government and the last one are one and the same (different colour, same sh#t.)

Jake White and Luke Watson deserve an apology for the racist attacks and racist debates about 'their quality of leadership or play,' or the colour of their skin and the decisions made one way or the other.

And to drag this through the media shows the mindset of these 'politicians,' bringing the game and the country into disrepute playing the numbers, skin colour game on the world stage.

Sound like the same lot, look like the same lot, and make the same lot type decisions!

Ja, white is now black and black is now white and anybody who says any different is a racist. Sad, sick, disgusting. And the punters who stand by this kind of debate of numbers cannot see their own bigotry for the colour of their skin. Exactly like the nats.

Indeed ... I stand with the majority of South Africans ... we are not the ones who are disgruntled about the changes in our society or that are stuck in the past.

Watch the past replayed before your eyes but no, it is not I, it be them!
 
cant believe how far this thread has gone tbh

makes for some good reading though

why cant we all live in peace and play rugby? do we always have to turn back the clocks and make the wrongs right!

all in all when the final squad is called then may the best man win
 
cant believe how far this thread has gone tbh

makes for some good reading though

why cant we all live in peace and play rugby? do we always have to turn back the clocks and make the wrongs right!

all in all when the final squad is called then may the best man win
A wrong of the past can never be a right of the present. And the present is reflecting the past. What does this tell you? One is an equal racist to the other. Simple really.
 
... and let's face it, Luke Watson is white and has never been disadvantaged

Not 'disadvantaged' as such but the Watson family suffered under apartheid due to the position Cheeky Watson took on rugby.
It is believed death threats were a regular thing for them even.

why cant we all live in peace and play rugby? do we always have to turn back the clocks and make the wrongs right!
Ask Stofile and Hoskins, maybe they should explain that to the flanker that is going home to make way for Watson.
 
Not 'disadvantaged' as such but the Watson family suffered under apartheid due to the position Cheeky Watson took on rugby.
It is believed death threats were a regular thing for them even.

Don't get me wrong .. I reckon he's a great player and should have got a chance ages ago... I just think the way things have been done and the excuses used are BS.
 
No ... it is called justice which is done by addressing the WRONGS of the past.

It is obvious you want to troll.

Your inability to run with the big dogs is rubbed under our noses each day.

It is apparent you struggle. Still.

I told you it is history. Still you want to brag because you are inadequate.

Go and get equal with us. Not by running us down to make you feel better. Go out and join us.
 
I stumbled across this forum and felt compelled to respond with some of my own thoughts on the matter.

With regards to Luke Watson being 'selected', there are many people (on various sites I've visited and some here) saying that he deserved to be there and therefore it's good that Hoskins has stepped in. I'm sorry but the ends does not always justify the means. If they felt that the selectors and the coach were not up to the job they could have fired them. To ride roughshot over their decisions because "they know best" is a terrible precedent to set, and fundamentally why so many people are not happy about it.

With regards, to Luke Watson 'being black', the interesting thing this throws up is that we now have clear evidence that affirmative action policies are being pushed and promoted by a number of non-white leaders who simply see black = disadvantaged.

But maybe this will open a debate on what constitutes disadvantaged and therefore who should be getting support. You see, Rasool said something which although debatable, is how we should be thinking about AA:

"Given where he comes from, and where his father deliberately chose to play his rugby, on the dusty, pot-holed fields of the Eastern Cape's townships, Luke comes from a historically disadvantaged community," Rasool said.

But where he showed that his thinking is archaic and dangerous to South Africa’s chances of a multiracial, fair and equal society, he then adds:
"Jake White shouldn't be looking at Watson as a white player. If there are white flanks of equal ability, then Luke should get the nod because of his family's history."

That is where he brought colour into it and colour should have nothing to do with it. He assumes that all whites were/are advantaged. It’s like assuming all blacks were/are disadvantaged. It doesn't wash with me.

We will never move past racial lines in our country if policies are adopted that directly use race to classify things.

And lastly, it saddens me but doesn't surprise me that so many non-white people assume every white South African is either an open racist, or a closet racist. For example, I openly question AA because I believe it's implementation in SA is not the correct way to go about solving our problems. I'm not for one second suggesting that the horrors of Apartheid and it's lasting affect don't need to be dealt with, I am simply questioning the vehichle we are using to do so. But more often then not I am seen, at best, as insensitive to the enduring effects of generations of racism or, at worst, a racist seeking to preserve my own privilege.

As I said I am not surprised that there is mistrust for the white man, but I can assure you that there are many young white South Africans that long for an equal society that openly seeks to redress the imbalances caused by Apartheid. But that does not mean we will keep quiet when we see errors being made in pursuit if this and I find it offensive that I am judged simply on the colour of my skin when I voice such disagreement. Are the people who judge me any better than the Apartheid leaders of old who judged every black man by the colour of his skin?

PS. Sorry for the long post. I've just had to get it off my chest, and taking a closer look at this site, maybe an ADSL broadband site was not the place for it. Alas, I feel better for venting. ;)
 
I think it is quite clear who the 3rd force is - the government.

Rugby has had its nonsense and since getting rid of van Rooyen things seemed to be going along okay. Springboks did okay, S14 did okay, Southern Spears got sorted more or less okay. So we have a new bill that allows interference if there is a crisis. What? There is no crisis? Quick, create one.

Sorry - Luke Watson - you are not in the frame. We have better loose forwards at the moment. Perhaps if you could be a wing... we like small players there?

But of course SARU could deal with it in this manner. The player of the year, the S14 player of the year, the provincial player of the year will all get invites to the training camp. The selectors and coach will choose the remaining numbers.

I really don't have a problem in Watson being there if he is good enough. But you can't help but think that maybe his family history has something to do with him being the Stormers captain and the S14 player of the year. In one swoop SARU cast doubt over what may be real talent. I just don't know if it was merit or a little back hander. Do you?
 
Indeed ... I stand with the majority of South Africans ... we are not the ones who are disgruntled about the changes in our society or that are stuck in the past.

Forgot the saying? "Meng met die semels.............. " You join the masses (Majority) because they are the masses, more than 50% do not even know what it is all about. They vote for skeletons, just like zim. No difference.

I am not stuck in the past, will support a GOV to the fullest if somebody worthy comes to the fore, like I supported Mandela and now Zille.

You just watch and see how rugby will degrade, not unlike our soccer, to a third wold class outfit only fit to play against Zimbabwe or the rest of Africa. That day will come to pass if the GOV continue their ways.
 
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