MWEB Uncapped ADSL Feedback - Part 2

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smokemaryjane said:
Are there any issues currently with Mweb communicating to Europe?

I'm unable to log into D3 EU realm, but connecting the the D3 US realm works 100% of the time. I would post you a ping trace, but all pings to Battle.net end at Telia.net and you get no reponses after that. So there is really nothing you will gain from looking at the ping trace.
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Good Afternoon, I have escalated your query to our gaming team. We are trying to replicate the problem on our side and we will provide you feedback.
 
MWEB Guy said:
Hi Bradlesliect, I think you're confusing the issue a bit. An outage, is an outage. Meaning the customers in that area are currently experiencing a loss of connectivity or are affected by a confirmed Telkom Network fault. We put these notices up for the benefit of our customers, but these outages are not MWEB specific. They would be affecting any user connected to the specific DSLAM.

The importance of investigating every case and having proper data from customers claiming a poor experience cannot be overstated. While symptoms may be similar there are a number of reasons why a customer might have a poor experience and we cannot make any assumptions about fault causes without proper investigation.
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Not to sound arrogant or anything but I have a VERY strong ISP background. I come from way back when IAfrica was still around before they moved to MWEB. Back then we still had the E1, E3 and T1 Telkom connections...so...I know what an outage is. I used to be a Network Tech work on Cisco routers - all that was available and at my disposal - so I know a little bit about small, medium and large networks. I am also familiar with the Telkom network topology.

I think you missing the point...which is...that after these so called Telco outages ONLY MWEB users are affected with connectivity problems, more to P2P connectivity. Will@MWEB(not sure if this is u using another Alias) confirmed earlier that P2P is AT THE BOTTOM of the pile of traffic that gets priority. That being said, it would appear that certain nodes within your network have also been limited re HTTP traffic, however...it appears not to be Corp Customers?

Bottom line is that it would appear MWEB has changed their "shaping" policy to be more aggressive on some of their gateways where traffic volumes are too high and reaching the max bandwith available threshold. This does make business sense but I still think it should not be as aggressive after business hours and over weekends as this is when your home-user base would like to do things. Agree?

I think before this gets out of hand and goes south really quickly, I am withdrawing myself from further comments.
 
bradlesliect said:
Not to sound arrogant or anything but I have a VERY strong ISP background. I come from way back when IAfrica was still around before they moved to MWEB. Back then we still had the E1, E3 and T1 Telkom connections...so...I know what an outage is. I used to be a Network Tech work on Cisco routers - all that was available and at my disposal - so I know a little bit about small, medium and large networks. I am also familiar with the Telkom network topology.

I think you missing the point...which is...that after these so called Telco outages ONLY MWEB users are affected with connectivity problems, more to P2P connectivity. Will@MWEB(not sure if this is u using another Alias) confirmed earlier that P2P is AT THE BOTTOM of the pile of traffic that gets priority. That being said, it would appear that certain nodes within your network have also been limited re HTTP traffic, however...it appears not to be Corp Customers?

Bottom line is that it would appear MWEB has changed their "shaping" policy to be more aggressive on some of their gateways where traffic volumes are too high and reaching the max bandwith available threshold. This does make business sense but I still think it should not be as aggressive after business hours and over weekends as this is when your home-user base would like to do things. Agree?

I think before this gets out of hand and goes south really quickly, I am withdrawing myself from further comments.
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+10000000
 
bradlesliect said:
Not to sound arrogant or anything but I have a VERY strong ISP background. I come from way back when IAfrica was still around before they moved to MWEB. Back then we still had the E1, E3 and T1 Telkom connections...so...I know what an outage is. I used to be a Network Tech work on Cisco routers - all that was available and at my disposal - so I know a little bit about small, medium and large networks. I am also familiar with the Telkom network topology.

I think you missing the point...which is...that after these so called Telco outages ONLY MWEB users are affected with connectivity problems, more to P2P connectivity. Will@MWEB(not sure if this is u using another Alias) confirmed earlier that P2P is AT THE BOTTOM of the pile of traffic that gets priority. That being said, it would appear that certain nodes within your network have also been limited re HTTP traffic, however...it appears not to be Corp Customers?

Bottom line is that it would appear MWEB has changed their "shaping" policy to be more aggressive on some of their gateways where traffic volumes are too high and reaching the max bandwith available threshold. This does make business sense but I still think it should not be as aggressive after business hours and over weekends as this is when your home-user base would like to do things. Agree?

I think before this gets out of hand and goes south really quickly, I am withdrawing myself from further comments.
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Brad perhaps you'd like to let us have your contact details - I believe MWEB guy has requested this in the past? We would love to investigate your specific experiences in more detail and try and assist you.

I'd also be more than happy to chat to you telephonically to give you a more detailed explanation of how the IPC network architecture is put together and where you need to separate issues between the Telkom backhaul and the ISP network.
 
bradlesliect said:
I trust you've seen my further comments. I never make a big stink about things I cannot prove. As I've said its too much of a coincidence don't you think?

Being a pessimist and at the risk of being flamed...you are probably not affected because either they haven't picked up high volumes at the gateway(s) you connect to or your exchange has not had an outage - this is speculation from my side.
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Just very briefly on this there aren't any MWEB gateways at the exchanges which I think is where your assumption is going awry. ADSL users connect to DSLAMS in the exchange. This traffic is aggregated onto Telkom's ESR Backhaul (Edge Service Routers) and customers then break out from their onto their respective ISP networks via IPC links.

MWEB Operates 3 IPC links in Cape Town, JHB and Durban respectively which are connected by a triangular 10Gb backbone, with International breakout via Seacom in JHB and WACS in CPT.

Until the traffic reaches our side of the IPC link we have no control over the customer experience, nor any mechanisms in place to in any way prioritize, or shape it.

As I said I'd be more than happy to chat with you over the phone and share anything else I'm able to about how this works.
 
@Will

Thanks very much but I think I'd rather withdraw from this.

I have indicated that I am not the only one experiencing the problem and I don't see the need to provide additional information. The common thing is there were outages and ever since they've happened the problem exists but it seems to be MWEB customers only in those areas that were affected, so how can you say its a Telkom problem?

Below is another thread which I started and as you can see there are others out there but its too little for MWEB to do an investigation, I wouldn't spend my energies on it either.

http://mybroadband.co.za/vb/showthread.php/478612-What-s-going-on-here-Are-we-being-blocked

I can provide the information you need but this can only be done this evening when I'm home.

So..before I get kicked off this forum, I'll rather be quiet.

Thanks for your time.
 
arni1954 said:
NO No No I think you are very very right . :) There is something wrong there and it is not on an individual basis . I have seen this before with Afrihost .
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Thanks mate. For a minute I thought I was sounding like Mal-enema there coming "yhere with those thendansies" but I've decided to retract myself from this debate. I run the risk of being kicked off this forum. Trust me...its happened before and just because I exposed an "Area 51" and aired my views.

I r now being observer. For Real. Promise.
 
Will@MWEB said:
Just very briefly on this there aren't any MWEB gateways at the exchanges which I think is where your assumption is going awry. ADSL users connect to DSLAMS in the exchange. This traffic is aggregated onto Telkom's ESR Backhaul (Edge Service Routers) and customers then break out from their onto their respective ISP networks via IPC links.

MWEB Operates 3 IPC links in Cape Town, JHB and Durban respectively which are connected by a triangular 10Gb backbone, with International breakout via Seacom in JHB and WACS in CPT.

Until the traffic reaches our side of the IPC link we have no control over the customer experience, nor any mechanisms in place to in any way prioritize, or shape it.

As I said I'd be more than happy to chat with you over the phone and share anything else I'm able to about how this works.
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I am not a MWEB client, but this is a very good post about how things actually work.

Thanks for the detailed explanation!
 
bradlesliect said:
@Will

Thanks very much but I think I'd rather withdraw from this.

I have indicated that I am not the only one experiencing the problem and I don't see the need to provide additional information. The common thing is there were outages and ever since they've happened the problem exists but it seems to be MWEB customers only in those areas that were affected, so how can you say its a Telkom problem?

Below is another thread which I started and as you can see there are others out there but its too little for MWEB to do an investigation, I wouldn't spend my energies on it either.

http://mybroadband.co.za/vb/showthread.php/478612-What-s-going-on-here-Are-we-being-blocked

I can provide the information you need but this can only be done this evening when I'm home.

So..before I get kicked off this forum, I'll rather be quiet.

Thanks for your time.
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Thanks Brad and we certainly aren't trying to 'keep you quiet', your feedback is valuable and appreciated - I really just want to be given a fair shot at investigating your experience in detail so that we can understand what's causing it.

I appreciate that you've been around the industry for a while - I have been myself too and if there is one thing I've learnt is to treat every customer complaint and fault on it's own merits and be methodical about your troubleshooting. We all know who's mom assumption is :D
 
@CPTBoy....I know all of this already. I was instrumental is setting up backbones, entry points and gateways for 2 ISPs. I worked on IGX, many models of the Cisco Routers, know the Cisco Protocols so I know exactly how it works.

I did not discard the explanation at all and the reason for a triangular setup is for the purpose of redunancy and the only time yuor network would take strain is when one of your major backbone links die and you need to re-route traffic or if you suspecting a DDoS attack from a specific IP range and you need to isolate where its coming from.

Yes...MWEB does not control traffic on the IPC network, however...they have their own set of IP ranges and do control how the traffic reaches the user on the other end of their router.

Telkom provides the infrastructure, they provide the Internet Service.

Damn...there I go again. I said I was going to be quiet.
 
bradlesliect said:
@CPTBoy....I know all of this already. I was instrumental is setting up backbones, entry points and gateways for 2 ISPs. I worked on IGX, many models of the Cisco Routers, know the Cisco Protocols so I know exactly how it works.
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Umm, this was not aimed at you, but it's good information in general for people who wants to know how ISP's work.
 
bradlesliect said:
@CPTBoy....I know all of this already. I was instrumental is setting up backbones, entry points and gateways for 2 ISPs. I worked on IGX, many models of the Cisco Routers, know the Cisco Protocols so I know exactly how it works.

I did not discard the explanation at all and the reason for a triangular setup is for the purpose of redunancy and the only time yuor network would take strain is when one of your major backbone links die and you need to re-route traffic or if you suspecting a DDoS attack from a specific IP range and you need to isolate where its coming from.

Yes...MWEB does not control traffic on the IPC network, however...they have their own set of IP ranges and do control how the traffic reaches the user on the other end of their router.

Telkom provides the infrastructure, they provide the Internet Service.

Damn...there I go again. I said I was going to be quiet.
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@Brad. If you're comfortable with how all of that works then you understand that IPC is a centralized architecture, which was sort of my original point :) Outages at individual exchanges are on the Telkom last mile portion of the ADSL network so any post outage issue being experienced at these localized points needs to be investigated on a case by case basis and escalated to Telkom if we have proof of an outstanding issue.
 
bradlesliect said:
I have indicated that I am not the only one experiencing the problem and I don't see the need to provide additional information.
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They are simply asking for your customer details. :wtf:

How can you expect them to assist, if you refuse to tell them who you are?

For all the claims that many are having issues, there are many more, like myself, who are not - So that argument holds no water.

MWEB seem to be, in this instance, offering to help in any way they are able, but you won't even give them the simple (and obvious) courtesy of letting them know which customer you are...

Ridiculous...
 
copacetic said:
They are simply asking for your customer details. :wtf:

How can you expect them to assist, if you refuse to tell them who you are?

For all the claims that many are having issues, there are many more, like myself, who are not - So that argument holds no water.

MWEB seem to be, in this instance, offering to help in any way they are able, but you won't even give them the simple (and obvious) courtesy of letting them know which customer you are...

Ridiculous...
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Your sarcasm is not needed. You are obviously not affected by what's happening and from your comment you obviously have not read all the comments I have made! So may I ask you to please back off! If you trying to bait me into some kind of retort, please try again. I have told Will - if you had bothered to read ALL the comments that I can provide the info this evening.

Please go troll elsewhere.
 
copacetic said:
They are simply asking for your customer details. :wtf:

How can you expect them to assist, if you refuse to tell them who you are?

For all the claims that many are having issues, there are many more, like myself, who are not - So that argument holds no water.

MWEB seem to be, in this instance, offering to help in any way they are able, but you won't even give them the simple (and obvious) courtesy of letting them know which customer you are...

Ridiculous...
Click to expand...

I am willing to give my details if it will help fix the issue .
 
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