PS3 in a Death Spiral

They're taking that loss by selling the PS3 at a loss, how are we talking about different things???

:confused: Okay I am talking about a different thing :D

There is a difference in saying that it's bad to sell a console at a loss and saying that it's bad that Sony is losing such a large amount on the PS3 which is not being returned through Game sales.

Selling the console at a loss is standard market practice as you'll make your money in game sales.

Selling the console at a loss and not selling games is bad.... very very bad....

Can Sony really afford to lose $3Bn in the next 2 years? No one knows that for sure.

Unless Sony starts bringing out games that people buy on mass they are going to be in deep trouble. If they can't push enough consoles into the market the developers won't make a game like that which is what the entire point of the article was about.
 
Retro, I echo GM's sentiments, it's been about SCE's attitude for the last 3 years, and now when it's time to finally put up or shut up, they're coming short and people are calling them on it.

I don't know how long you've been following the 'war' but I always look back to E3 2005 as a watershed moment. Sony came out swinging - Dual HDMI ports for dual 1080p output, built in ethernet and wifi hub (it had 4 ports) 7 bluetooth boomerang controllers etc etc. Then came the smack talk (like the above quote about the 360 being like a PS2) yadda yadda they had a full go. In contrast Microsoft simply said "We'll see when the chips are down". then came the Killzone 2 debacle, and the Motorstorm debacle, then the features started falling off and they missed their adamant launch date of November 05, then again they missed April 06, then came "$600 is too cheap", all the time they've kept up this belligerent façade, While in the mean time the 360 got on with the job. That's not even mentioning the non SCE issues. One of my big anti sony moments from last year was the root kit debacle, that was also handled appallingly.

Not once have they shown a bit of humility or even customer care it's all about "this is what we want you to buy because it makes us money, so buy it **** it!" MS gave us what we want, content and options.

Microsoft did not have it easy either, but when looking at the numbers just remember MS launched in 3 territories at once as opposed to just two, and while the Japanese may not have bought 360's, MS still had to manufacture according to their (overly hopeful) expectations.
 
Can Sony really afford to lose $3Bn in the next 2 years? No one knows that for sure.

Just as nobody knows for sure that they will...

Unless Sony starts bringing out games that people buy on mass they are going to be in deep trouble. If they can't push enough consoles into the market the developers won't make a game like that which is what the entire point of the article was about.

Agreed. But it's way too early to say whats going to happen.

And, if developers decided to make games from the amount of 360's that were sold a year ago, then they shouldn't have a problem with developing games for the PS3, since PS3 sales are going great (talking about numbers, not comparing to what another console is selling NOW).

Retro, I echo GM's sentiments, it's been about SCE's attitude for the last 3 years, and now when it's time to finally put up or shut up, they're coming short and people are calling them on it.

And people should, but not on things they're not doing wrong.
 
And, if developers decided to make games from the amount of 360's that were sold a year ago, then they shouldn't have a problem with developing games for the PS3, since PS3 sales are going great (talking about numbers, not comparing to what another console is selling NOW).

And if there was no other console selling better all the developers would be in the PS3 corner now. But the fact is there are more 360's in the market and the monthly sales favour the 360 slightly. So the gap will always grow.

The developers only need to look at this for a minute to realise that unless this changes the 360 will always have the bigger client base which gives them the option to sell more titles.

Unless the PS3 starts outselling the 360 there is no reason why the developers should develop for the PS3 as their primary console.

Then throw into the mix that it is easier and cheaper to develop primarily for the 360. now add in that porting from the 360 to a PC is easy it gives it an even bigger edge.

Currently the PS3 does not have enough reasons going for it and the only thing that can change that is sales so Sony need to do their best to get the most consoles into the market, but that is not even going to guarantee them anything.

They are 9 million units behind so they need to make that up before they get to the nice place that Xbox currently sits at. I also don't see M$ sitting around if the PS3 starts catching up. Price Drops, bundles and major marketing are three ways for M$ to keep it's lead.

Sony can only compete on 2 out of the 3 options.

but again this all depends on what happens in the weeks following the 23rd of March... If Sony bombs in the EU the war will be over very very quickly.
 
If you believe spelling = intelligence, I've fixed it for your benefit.You do realise were talking about "GAMES" consoles ... thought the games would actually get a mention in deciding the winner.

Do you at all realise everything is moving towards a central entertainment or Home theater PC system. Even integrated on line. Consoles is not anymore for games only, only for you young fnuckers that is bored to death playing WOW and NFSx. Game consoles in now more streamlined for Multi media and Home Theatre, more so than PC's atm. That is evident on the X360 and PS3 and Blue ray an the HD capability. Even the PS2 have many "games" more in line with exercise and entertainment like the dance mat and other physical activities.
So Yeah, grow up Boy! Do not fall of your high horse, may damage the mirror!
 
derekc said:
Sony to beat MS by 2010.

Huh? are we reading the same article? It's about the WII , not really about PS3 vs Xbox360.

PS3, Xbox 360 to hammer Wii in console war, says analyst

An analysis report on the current console war leading up to 2010 cites PS3 and Xbox 360 will dominate over Wii in all major territories

Only part in that article:
predicting the PS3 to overtake Xbox 360 in Japan and Europe

Firstly that is a "prediction" [which translates to : "pulled it out of my a$$" as he provides no reason why he thinks so..] and then the territories of JAPAN and Europe ....we all know Japan is PS3 territory, so that's like a 'duh' . Europe is debatable though, again no indication why he thinks the 360 will dominate in America but not in Europe..... I wouldn't make such predictions BEFORE the actual PS3 launch there though.
 
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Do you at all realise everything is moving towards a central entertainment or Home theater PC system.
Oh come on, maybe you should wake up. The media features of both devices are just nice to have value adds. Find me one person who bought and X360/HD-DVD or PS3 just to be a media player with absolutely no interest in playing games.

Games drive consoles ... period, and the formula for success is simple ...

Better developer support = better games = more successful console = more developer support = even better games = even more market success.

So Yeah, grow up Boy! Do not fall of your high horse, may damage the mirror!
As this is just a reflection of your maturity & intelligence, I wont bother with a response.
 
Huh? are we reading the same article? It's about the WII , not really about PS3 vs Xbox360.



Only part in that article:


Firstly that is a "prediction" [which translates to : "pulled it out of my a$$" as he provides no reason why he thinks so..] and then the territories of JAPAN and Europe ....we all know Japan is PS3 territory, so that's like a 'duh' . Europe is debatable though, again no indication why he thinks the 360 will dominate in America but not in Europe..... I wouldn't make such predictions BEFORE the actual PS3 launch there though.

just an observation..nothing much to read by it. good to post other views as well.
 
The Xbox360 & PS3 are essentially just players. You cant record, burn or edit video using them. You can't tune in normal TV and use the consoles as glorified PVRs. I think the games are still the best thing going for these systems, up until now consoles have been confined to being arcade emulators, now they're taking over the PC. Saying that though, I'm going to be interested to see how RTS and pukkah FPS games contend with the gamepad handicap.
 
Actually i think nintendo will win japan over this time round . If you look at it , they sold 1.5 million wii's in japan and just +-400,000 ps3 over there. We all know the sad truth of 360 over there , not even blue dragon could save it.
And then there is the DS , it is so popular in japan , they even took the newest dragon quest 9 which would have been on ps2 or ps3 and placed it onto a DS rather!! The DS success over there is definetely helping the wii aswell , and the wii is spitting out games over there too , they already got two brand new games there , fire emblem and naruto if i'm not mistaken.
 
Yeah, I know these "analysts" they base all their predictions on raw historical data and have no metrics for this like innovation or consumer preference.

The guys that are saying Sony outright, ms pale second and Nintendo last are basing it on the performance of the company not the product.

I really believe Nintendo is going to own Japan, both the Wii and the DS - Look at the content, most Japanese content revolves around hand drawn Anime, rather than complex CG. I think Microsoft will be happy if they break 1 million 360's in Japan.
 
Thanks Gavin.

Basically:
IP TV - literally turns the 360 into a decoder like DSTV, except using broadband instead of Satellite. The platform also includes the ability to record to the 360 hard drive or a home server. One of the biggies is that you can set it up to record TV while you're playing a game. Telkom is launching this product, they are official MS partners and have acknowledged they will be supporting the 360.

XBLVM - Xbox Live video Marketplace - in short it's video on demand. It's currently operating in the states. You pays yours moneys ands gets exactlys whats yous wants ;) TV series, Movies, they're all available for download. DSTV can't even offer that ;)

when I originally bought my 360 I was in two minds as to whether to wait for the Wii, the second I heard this announcement, and saw Home Server (basically a central machine that will allow you to share above mentioned downloaded content on all you homes devices PC, Xbox, zune etc) I knew I'd made the right decision.
 
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Two things mainly,



2. Microsoft is a sw development company at heart, and I believe there is no way someone like Sony will reach their depth of experience & understanding of sw development environments and the culture of the 3rd party development community itself.

MS is a software company at heart but their operating systems are bug filled,
pieces of bloat. Compare them to Apple who is a hardware company and
Mac OSX which blows Vista/XP out of the water. I would not read anything into MS being a 'software' company - they only made second rate software thus far.
 
MS is a software company at heart but their operating systems are bug filled,
pieces of bloat. Compare them to Apple who is a hardware company and
Mac OSX which blows Vista/XP out of the water. I would not read anything into MS being a 'software' company - they only made second rate software thus far.

Absolutely second rate... If they where a decent company they would easily have taken the largest market share already... oh wait...

What did this have to do with the PS3 and Xbox 360 by the way?
 
MS is a software company at heart but their operating systems are bug filled,
pieces of bloat. Compare them to Apple who is a hardware company and
Mac OSX which blows Vista/XP out of the water. I would not read anything into MS being a 'software' company - they only made second rate software thus far.

It all depends how you see it. MS opens up it's operating system such that tools and apps are relatively easy to develop on which will obviously lead to many loopholes that one cna exploit. Apple effectively locks down its OS which basically ties a developer's hands when writing software. There's always a tradeoff. As GavinM said, there's a reason why MS monopolises the desktop OS market. they didn't do it because they sold buggy software but software that improves productivity and simplifies certain business and home tasks.
 
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