SA middle class forced back into poverty?

Nobody "forced" the middle class into poverty, the big chunk of them are living well beyond their budget. When you can't handle an electricity price hike, you got only your unsustainable lifestyle to blame.
 
Hemps said:
We have 2 kids, pricey pricey pricey.
R1500+ on grocery shopping a week for the 4 of us plus nanny.

No credit cards in our family, still on FNB basic account with no bank charges applied.
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Yeah, kiddies = expenses. And lots of it :(

But I love my kids :)

Good to hear about the CC. We have one (Game) that I'm paying off. As soon as it is paid off, I'll close it (no matter what Frau Hitler will say) as I don't want that millstone around my neck anymore.
 
Stokstert said:
The new middle class has no clue about money matters and making debt left, right and centre. The BMW, Italian shoes and eating out are a necessity. No one saves first and buys later, rather pays a shatload of interest to loan sharks.
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If people don't eat out, all those Panarottis and Burger Kings will close. What then? The middle class is parasitic. It's people feeding on each other.
 
HDS said:
Nobody "forced" the middle class into poverty, the big chunk of them are living well beyond their budget. When you can't handle an electricity price hike, you got only your unsustainable lifestyle to blame.
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Not really. Most of that middle class isn't really middle. Savings are becoming worthless as the Rand depreciates and inflation soars.
 
The_Librarian said:
Yeah, kiddies = expenses. And lots of it :(

But I love my kids :)

Good to hear about the CC. We have one (Game) that I'm paying off. As soon as it is paid off, I'll close it (no matter what Frau Hitler will say) as I don't want that millstone around my neck anymore.
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A CC is a good thing to have. Have the bank pay off the entire amount each cycle which prevents finance charges. In addition when using a CC you have some additional protections such as charge backing when your delivery does not arrive.
 
The_Librarian said:
FWIW I would advise newlyweds and young people not to have any children unless they have a very secure financial footing.
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It depends. A child can motivate people to save, work and invest in their qualifications. If you're gonna be boozing and partying because you have no-one to look after, what good is that. At least a kid is an investment and they're priceless.

And to work very carefully with their money, like avoiding things like credit cards etc...
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I disagree. A cc is an excellent thing to have. Just make sure you do full debit each cycle, i.e. no finance charges and don't spend more than you can. What next, getting rid of overdraft?

And if you do need money suddenly for real emergencies, it's there.
 
Space_Chief said:
I disagree. A cc is an excellent thing to have. Just make sure you do full debit each cycle, i.e. no finance charges and don't spend more than you can. What next, getting rid of overdraft?

And if you do need money suddenly for real emergencies, it's there.
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I agree, only spend what you can afford on the credit card and its an easy way to make payments. Pay the thing in full before the due date and you're fine. Don't have an overdraft, no point, you pay for it but don't use it.
 
Personally feel for an economy like ours its better if people keep spending. If we all tighten our belts we suffer more. We all benefit from others spending money in some way.
 
I feel sorry for the guys just starting out from varsity.. Inflation and enconomic down turn is making starting up in life incredibly hard.

Just do some maths, if you were to start with nothing right now at the entry level salary for a basic degree, living on own.. Would you survive?

Scary thing I find and see when in Cpt in particular is young people living in expensive areas, driving newish cars.. But when I ask about it it seems like it's 'old money' ie parentals footing parts of the bill to allow them the lifestyle. But how long will that be possible as surely it must be straining things.
 
Actually this is a trend common in a lot of capitalist countries recently post rescission. The only people making money are the top 1%.. In this country I bet the ANC brain trust is in that group, so according to them the economy is fine
 
Another clear sign would be home ownership. It was far easier to own a home from a low income salary years ago. It is much more dificult now, even for middle class to own their home. A. Lot of the current generation are either still living with their parents or both have invested in a joint home.
 
I thinks some people are missing the point here .
The price of electricity is to expensive and soon will be out of reach of the average person which will lead to more electricity theft which will just lead to a spiral in the price .
The eventual consequence of this will be only the rich will have electricity .
There will come a point when solar panel installation will be cheaper than ESCOM , that day will mean the end of ESCOM as we know it .
 
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Wait..."forced back" into poverty?

I've never been in poverty, nor my family.


I'm wondering if that might be the real problem - the recent origin of many of the middle class.
 
The_Librarian said:
FWIW I would advise newlyweds and young people not to have any children unless they have a very secure financial footing.

And to work very carefully with their money, like avoiding things like credit cards etc...
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Thats exactly what were doing. We have two cars paid off. Theyre small cars but one is under 40000km and the other under 100000km. Going to be riding the lowest mileage one for another 10+ years, and selling the other to get a Jazz or something more suited to children (second hand).

My wife and I work strictly with cash and only use credit cards to build a credit rating. Bank is pestering me to increase limits and upgrade, I just ignore them.

When I was younger I came to the realisation that people are working backwords.

They make debt. Then Pay it off. Then they have to make debt again and the cycle continues.

I thought "why dont you do it the other way around?". Suffer in the beginning and save up. Then you have cash and buy what you want. Then you can save up again and have cash when you need it. Also no interrest expenses this way.

I cringe at the thought of making debt, except for Education, car(if no other way) and a house.
 
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HeftyCrab said:
Thats exactly what were doing. We have two cars paid off. Theyre small cars but one is under 40000km and the other under 100000km. Going to be riding the lowest mileage one for another 10+ years, and selling the other to get a Jazz or something more suited to children (second hand).

My wife and I work strictly with cash and only use credit cards to build a credit rating. Bank is pestering me to increase limits and upgrade, I just ignore them.

When I was younger I came to the realisation that people are working backwords.

They make debt. Then Pay it off. Then they have to make debt again and the cycle continues.

I thought "why dont you do it the other way around?". Suffer in the beginning and save up. Then you have cash and buy what you want. Then you can save up again and have cash when you need it. Also no interrest expenses this way.

I cringe at the thought of making debt, except for Education, car(if no other way) and a house.
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Best advice I have heard in a long time. If more people did this I have a feeling society would be a lot more stable with power a lot less concentrated as people would be more in control of their lives.
 
The_Librarian said:
Yeah, kiddies = expenses. And lots of it :(

But I love my kids :)

Good to hear about the CC. We have one (Game) that I'm paying off. As soon as it is paid off, I'll close it (no matter what Frau Hitler will say) as I don't want that millstone around my neck anymore.
Click to expand...

Ive always made saving an expense on my sheet along with insurance, med aid and petrol. I wanted to buy a house, so I started transferring the bond payments into my investment acc each month as if I had already bought a house so that I got used to not having the money available.

Spend what you don't save. Don't save whats left that you haven't spent.
 
The middle-class with their unsecured debts even destroy the savings of others who saved in money-market funds. When African Bank went belly up, they took a certain percentage of money-market funds of other banks who had invested in African Bank.

You can't win!
 
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