Shell all set to spend R1.6bn on fracking

How much of the Karoo is state owned? For Shell to actually exploit. I take it for granted that most land is owned by farmers. Anyway, frack fracking. The energy minister will also have his 9 months in a cell when the bribery and corruption comes out in a few years time.
 
Shake&Bake said:
How much of the Karoo is state owned? For Shell to actually exploit. I take it for granted that most land is owned by farmers. Anyway, frack fracking. The energy minister will also have his 9 months in a cell when the bribery and corruption comes out in a few years time.
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Does this not fall under mineral rights?
 
Mila said:
Does this not fall under mineral rights?
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I read in the OP that the Energy Minister voiced support for fracking - so that's what I was running with.

Also the 9 months in a cell, obviously comes with its 'Get out of jail on medical parole card'

They'll be handing out more at the next ANC conference later this year.
 
Good news for the economy. Bad news for the greeny beanies.

ChocolateBadger said:
Proof? Also that not saying that they will go the root without chemicals.

I really hope a certain company I know gets to do the environmental damage report on this before the go ahead, fracking will be banished from South Africa forever and the government can do squat.

If you want to see the damage that fracking causes, watch Gas Land, Its a documentary about fracking in America
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It's not a documentary, it's a propaganda piece with so many debunked falsehoods. It is Michael Moore-type ignorance.
 
The guys at MossGas must be happy about this.

From PetroSA

Our talent for innovation is recognised globally. In 1992, we started operating the world´s first gas-to-liquid (GTL) refinery at Mossel Bay. It remains the third largest GTL refinery among the five now operating worldwide. Here, our specialist teams produce some of the cleanest fuels on the market using some of the most environmentally friendly processes ever developed.
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Never knew we were sort of world leaders :). It makes sense to frack in the Karoo if the close-by MossGas plants can be upgraded.
 
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As Alan Shore said, "Money money money money money money money money money".
 
Techne said:
Good news for the economy. Bad news for the greeny beanies.


It's not a documentary, it's a propaganda piece with so many debunked falsehoods. It is Michael Moore-type ignorance.
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Just watched the documentary now. There's a lot of stuff in there that you just can't debunk. So while it may be a well designed movie to stir emotions... how can the effects filmed (gas bubbling up through streams and taps after the exploitation of gas in the area) be falsehoods? Was there gas coming up through the streams before the gas mining? Was there after? Question answered. What about the gas spewing up from the tanks they filmed? That kind of stuff will ruin the air quality. As someone who grew up in an industrial town (Richards Bay), I know what the effect of industry does on public health. Go do the maths on Asthma alone in Richards Bay. It's horrendous what Alusaf and the other factories pump out. Now Shell want to push hydrocarbons and benzene into the Karoo atmosphere?

You can't expect to agitate gas inside the earth to pump it up... then expect it not to flow everywhere else it can. This is going to monumentally ***** up ground water in the Karoo if it goes ahead.
 
shogun said:
Just watched the documentary now. There's a lot of stuff in there that you just can't debunk. So while it may be a well designed movie to stir emotions... how can the effects filmed (gas bubbling up through streams and taps after the exploitation of gas in the area) be falsehoods? Was there gas coming up through the streams before the gas mining? Was there after? Question answered. What about the gas spewing up from the tanks they filmed? That kind of stuff will ruin the air quality. As someone who grew up in an industrial town (Richards Bay), I know what the effect of industry does on public health. Go do the maths on Asthma alone in Richards Bay. It's horrendous what Alusaf and the other factories pump out. Now Shell want to push hydrocarbons and benzene into the Karoo atmosphere?

You can't expect to agitate gas inside the earth to pump it up... then expect it not to flow everywhere else it can. This is going to monumentally ***** up ground water in the Karoo if it goes ahead.
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Dont forget all the awesome Acid Mine Water we have inherited.

"Geophysicist warns the Water and Environmental Affairs Committee in parliament that the Cradle of Humankind is being threatened by mine drainage and that urgent action is required"
 
shogun said:
Just watched the documentary now. There's a lot of stuff in there that you just can't debunk. So while it may be a well designed movie to stir emotions... how can the effects filmed (gas bubbling up through streams and taps after the exploitation of gas in the area) be falsehoods? Was there gas coming up through the streams before the gas mining? Was there after? Question answered. What about the gas spewing up from the tanks they filmed? That kind of stuff will ruin the air quality. As someone who grew up in an industrial town (Richards Bay), I know what the effect of industry does on public health. Go do the maths on Asthma alone in Richards Bay. It's horrendous what Alusaf and the other factories pump out. Now Shell want to push hydrocarbons and benzene into the Karoo atmosphere?
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This article sums up a few of the lies in the film.
 
daveza said:
Pro and against could play ping pong forever.

If someone can guarantee that there will not be a single incident of contamination then fine, let them go ahead.

The downside is they will be forced to shoot their family if there is one.

Do you think we'd have all the pro-fracking lot lining up to take a chance ?
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Just to be clear, I am not under the impression that fracking is a clean business or that there will not be environmental impacts that may negatively influence some parts of the Karoo.

I do however think there are good arguments that there will be more pros than cons. For example, I think it would be better to invest in fracking than say wind farms. South Africa needs energy if we are to get people out of poverty. This is a good opportunity to not only solve that problem but also invest in our future by training skilled engineers and other skilled labour needed to get this thing going.
 
Just to be clear, I am not under the impression that fracking is a clean business or that there will not be environmental impacts that may negatively influence some parts of the Karoo.
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Well if that is the case then Shell are lying.

If it's dirty and there will be negative environmental impacts then leave it the fsk alone.
 
[video=youtube;cKpv_LaSQVY]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cKpv_LaSQVY[/video]
 
daveza said:
Well if that is the case then Shell are lying.

If it's dirty and there will be negative environmental impacts then leave it the fsk alone.
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Did you actually read the whole article Techne posted? :)
 
daveza said:
Well if that is the case then Shell are lying.

If it's dirty and there will be negative environmental impacts then leave it the fsk alone.
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This isn't news really. Back in 2006 they reported on this. It took them a few years testing what the impact will be to the environment.
Apparently Shell said back then that they will be using a new and advance way of fracking that will not have an impact. Only time will tell if this is a lie or not, that is to say if they are going on with it.
 
I don't trust them, I'm just saying. And it's not as if they are going to stop because of comments people raise in this forum.
All oil companies are "evil", I hate them. But it's not like you're helping the cause. Everybody use petrol, gas etc. People grow dependent on this resources they use for transportation, electricity, everything. Now some resources is growing low, there is a big demand (for consumers and for Shell CEO to fill his wallet), where do they go. Everywhere they go, they gonna get people who oppose what they do.
I say it again, I don't like them, but they are doing the dirty work that some people won't do to keep society from living without luxury and to keep their pockets full.
 
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