SONA 2015

blunomore said:
........ what is he laughing at? Every other single face is serious. Maybe it was photoshopped.
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Easy answer: He's laughing at Democracy.

Does it really matter if it was photoshopped? The picture perfectly depicts his mentality of himself and the ANC as being invincible.
 
how much money would your ask for to be made a fool of like Zuma was yesterday?
 
Well done DA? ANC walked into that?

With all due respect guys, it's the DA who walked into the ANC's plan there.

Their impact woul've been greater had they fought with the EFF against those Mbete thugs.

Instead Maimane&his DA were already walking out, when Thandi Modise said "walk out on your flimsy terms then afterwards refrain from saying it was the ANC/Speaker who said leave". At that point Mmusi&everyone in the DA froze and sat down again.

They continued asking useless questions which Thandi Modise replied perfectly I am not able to tell who was a police or not.

Basically, the DA walked out on the basis of uncertainty or lack of clarification, but they didn't walk out when "clarified obvious abuse by gun carrying thugs in parliament" were manhandling men AND WOMEN of the EFF.

What tops it all for me is the fact the Maimane(Leader) and Steenhuisen(Chief Whip) were not ejected for , yet quiet members of the EFF were all kicked out with those who spoke.

That must tell the country something about who the overwhelming majority really fears.

Personally I say the DA walked out for nothing.

After that Zuma had an uninterrupted speech, and in my opinion one of his best ever speeches!

Plenty people appreciated his speech, including that eNCA test audience.

It would;ve been better if DA was there interrupting and asking for "opportunities" to be quantified. Not walking out because of uncertainties that can easily be cleared in future rendering you stupid.
 
is there footage anywhere of the parades by the army and navy etc. that took place.

i thought they were fantastic.
 
Albereth said:
The DA walking out has absolutely no effect on voters. I'm not sure where people get this line from? Lazy news reporters?

All that happened last night was some turd talking crap. If anyone was really interested in what that chop had to say, well his speech is published.
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On the contrary the DA walking out is a win for voters of whichever party. What happened last night is that yet again a faction of the ANC sought to impose the notion that Parliament is an entity to be controlled and that the presiding officer dictates to the House.
 
Paul Hjul said:
On the contrary the DA walking out is a win for voters of whichever party. What happened last night is that yet again a faction of the ANC sought to impose the notion that Parliament is an entity to be controlled and that the presiding officer dictates to the House.
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ZCFOutkast disagrees.
 
I did think the speaker was quick to interrupt JZ to get the EFF member to speak.
 
Paul Hjul said:
On the contrary the DA walking out is a win for voters of whichever party. What happened last night is that yet again a faction of the ANC sought to impose the notion that Parliament is an entity to be controlled and that the presiding officer dictates to the House.
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It seems to have been clearly planned and discussed beforehand that, if Mmaimane does not get a satisfactory answer to his reply, the walkout will take place.
 
ZCFOutkast said:
Well done DA? ANC walked into that?

With all due respect guys, it's the DA who walked into the ANC's plan there.

Their impact woul've been greater had they fought with the EFF against those Mbete thugs.

Instead Maimane&his DA were already walking out, when Thandi Modise said "walk out on your flimsy terms then afterwards refrain from saying it was the ANC/Speaker who said leave". At that point Mmusi&everyone in the DA froze and sat down again.

They continued asking useless questions which Thandi Modise replied perfectly I am not able to tell who was a police or not.

Basically, the DA walked out on the basis of uncertainty or lack of clarification, but they didn't walk out when "clarified obvious abuse by gun carrying thugs in parliament" were manhandling men AND WOMEN of the EFF.

What tops it all for me is the fact the Maimane(Leader) and Steenhuisen(Chief Whip) were not ejected for , yet quiet members of the EFF were all kicked out with those who spoke.

That must tell the country something about who the overwhelming majority really fears.

Personally I say the DA walked out for nothing.

After that Zuma had an uninterrupted speech, and in my opinion one of his best ever speeches!

Plenty people appreciated his speech, including that eNCA test audience.

It would;ve been better if DA was there interrupting and asking for "opportunities" to be quantified. Not walking out because of uncertainties that can easily be cleared in future rendering you stupid.
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would you mind repeating what you were saying, oh I get it - nothing.
 
Stefanmuller said:
Freedom of speech and constitutional rights is shooting House proceedings in the foot. Seems like if someone speaks up in parliament even during the presidents speech, the House HAS to recognise it and listen to what the person has to say. This is what happened last night and during the previous sittings. Different people jumping up, given the chance to say exactly what the previous person said. Seems like the House cant invoke rules because its contrary to freedom of speech rights. Conundrum?
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For me, this conundrum is a tension between constitutional values and constitutional rights. We all know that any decision in parliament, with the exception of constitutional changes, could easily be voted in/out by the majority party - a constitutional administrative right. However, the constitutional values which underpin democracy rejects the precepts of rule-by-the-majority-vote only situation - an all inclusive representative and robust discussion culminating with good decision making on matters at hand is rather the important imperative. At the heat of battle, in parliament, the minority parties are, as in our case, armed with privileges, including the right to questions and answers within the framework of parliamentary rules, this in order to uphold the already mentioned constitutional values. However, this privilege, when abused known as filibustering, albeit not new, is one such mechanism that is used to highlight dissatisfaction before the inevitable is concluded - a necessary evil in my opinion albeit a disruptive one.
We need only cast a cursory gaze towards what actually precipitated last night, and what becomes patently clear is that the constitutional rights to have JZ account to parliament and encountered with the temerity by which the majority disregards this constitutional right, is now at tension with constitutional values "abused" by the minority...and therein rests the conundrum - a conflict not easily untangled.
 
blunomore said:
It seems to have been clearly planned and discussed beforehand that, if Mmaimane does not get a satisfactory answer to his reply, the walkout will take place.
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Of course it was.

The DA were banking on the EFF doing what they did, and the ANC overreacting and bringing in the police and then trying to hide that fact... The ANC walked RIGHT into it.

Also, the ANC claim to have "won" last night... if they think they won anything, then they're even bigger idiots than i though.
 
blunomore said:
It seems to have been clearly planned and discussed beforehand that, if Mmaimane does not get a satisfactory answer to his reply, the walkout will take place.
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But by Thandi Modise saying what she said and then them hesitating for another 15 minutes while asking the same questions they had when they first decided to walk out the initiative was already handed back to the ANC.

Why exactly did the DA walk out? Makes zero sense. They go through such discussions in Parly but never walkout becaus eof uncertainty. Speaker just say will review your questions and respond at the start of the next seating. By saying she can't tell she's bascially covering her back in case they were.

My feeling is there were no SAPS but executives' security. ANC are smarter than that.

She answered Malema&EFF but we were stubborn because it was our intention from the beginning. She answered the DA properly but they were not satisfied with the answer and made a meal out of it. Inessence they wre satisfied with the beatings meted out to fellow MPs before?

How can people blame Chad Le Cloes. At what point exactly did people want Le Clos to walk out? When EFF MPs were being ejected.

So why then was it ok for DA to remain behind, if it's not ok for Le Clos to remain behind too.
 
Arietans said:
I did think the speaker was quick to interrupt JZ to get the EFF member to speak.
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Quick? No.

Took probably 15-20 agonising seconds of the EFF member trying to get attention, and Zuma just ploughed on regardless.
 
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