Stop Destroying Videogames

Hmm, was expecting this "backlash" eventually.

I, for one, have never, and will never purchase any game that a) Requires an internet connection, or b) is a digital download.

It's enough that that kant, Bill Gates, has effectively disabled my paid-for physical media (eg, most of the Need For Speed games, amongst others) by making the latest version(s) of Windows incapable of playing them (anti-piracy software, SafeDisc, SecuRom, StarForce, etc).

The only way I can play these games nowadays, if I wanted to, is to download a cracked copy, (i.e. pirated) EVEN ALTHOUGH I HAVE THE ORIGINAL CD THAT I PURCHASED!

tl/dr: Thank Bill Gates for the current scenario. He stated publicly many, many years ago that this was/is his idea and this is exactly what he intended to do all along.

*spits*

Reminds me of the launch of Half-Life 2 which was the first game I ever bought that need online activation.

It just didn’t work.

Ended up pirating a game I literally just purchased just to make it work.

As I recall the data was all on the disc and I could install it, just couldn’t activate it or update it and without updating it then it wouldn’t run.

Ended up having to nuke the install and reset it to vanilla and then crack it.
 
1,198,164 signatures towards 1,000,000 goal

Some have claimed many of these signatures could be either incorrect - as in the name has been misspelled or in some cases actual fake signatures. Hopefully we'll get way above threshold before the end of the month to have at least 1 million real signatures. The signatures have to include either the EU electronic ID number or the local national ID number of the country represented by the person signing the petition.
 
Not going to go into this in detail, but the pushback against Stop Killing Games has started. I am seeing this on all social media. There are people with unrealistic expectations; there are people who are trolling; there are people who are being disruptive.

EULAs are broad on purpose, and anything contained therein can be tested. It should, in legal terms, protect both the user and the owner.

The initiative should be taken step by step. It is a process:


Step 6 also needs to be understood:

Step 6: Get an answer​

Once you’ve submitted your initiative, the examination of your initiative starts:
  • Within 1 month

    You will meet with representatives of the Commission so you can explain the issues raised in your initiative in detail.
  • Within 3 months

    You will have the opportunity to present your initiative at a public hearing at the European Parliament. Parliament may also hold a debate in a full (plenary) session, which could lead to it adopting a resolution related to your issue.
  • Within 6 months

    The Commission will spell out what action (if any) it will propose in response to your initiative, and its reasons for taking (or not taking) action. This response will be in the form of a communication formally adopted by the College of Commissioners and published in all official EU languages. You will meet with the representatives of the Commission who will explain in more detail its decision regarding your initiative.

I have no idea, other than by their names, who the EU citizen's initiative representatives are. Ross Scott may be the Stop Killing Games "spokesperson," but he isn't involved in the EU process. They do have an X and Bluesky account:

X: https://x.com/stopkilinggames
Bluesky: https://bsky.app/profile/stopkillinggames.bsky.social

This thing could end with Step 4, or it could get interesting with Step 6. Once Step 6 is completed, it is again either the end or another process that involves legislation. The commission is also under no obligation to propose legislation, but may propose more suitable measures.

I have read some things today... some mixed reactions.
 
As long as digital games can be preserved, and that through preservation a user has continued access to the videogame, it shouldn't be a big issue doing away with physical media. It is what it is: installation media.

There is an attempt to pivot all gaming to subscription services. The problem is that the pool is only that big, and that not every game can be sustained via subscription. It is then inevitable that game access will lapse in such a model, in particular those that are third-party.

Regardless, MS has built massive mindshare around Game Pass. I won't be surprised that questions related to this will be asked by the commission: Will gamers rather choose a subscription to a gaming service over a perpetual license to access and play a game? I know this is coming. In the future, it will be a push for cloud (or virtual) gaming.

It is good to still cherish physical media. People could potentially trade it or sell it, too, so there is that intrinsic value. I, who still own a quite large physical gaming library containing mostly pre-2010 PC games, don't have a place to store them. Digitisation does play its part.

Interesting times ahead.

I am discussing this whole topic in another place, but I'm not going to link to it. There are some good arguments being made by community members. It would be great to see Steam provide installers, but I remain of the mind that Steam should play its part as a digital game custodian, too. This isn't only applicable to Steam, but it is the biggest player in the space.

I saw Running with Scissors post this on X:


The platform currently has all the tools for good practices, the EULA means nothing when you can back the games onto a hard drive and call it yours.

Literaly the only thing Steam needed to be perfect is to offer the ability to create offline installers like GoG does.

They are wrong about the EULA, but they are rebellious. But yes, having the installer, you could sidestep the rules. Also, I see it is now deleted, but someone related was very much against my idea of custodianship. Maybe they misunderstood the idea thereof. Nobody will ever own a copy of a game; all you own is the right to access and play it. Even Running with Scissors has an exclusive ownership clause.

At the end of the day, this is what should be achieved, copied from one of my own documents:

The right to use and play video games should be a protected consumer right, ensuring reasonable access without equating it to full ownership.

The right to use itself should be a form of ownership that needs protection. Reasonable access can be guaranteed via a protected copy being kept available for use. There are, at this time, numerous online game stores that already have copies available for distribution that are archived within repositories. Just like hoarding physical media, a user would also need to hoard their digital games library; this is not reasonable. There is a whole lot more to this, also covering modifications, and also who gets granted access upon "sunsetting". It is a broad discussion, with far too many technicalities. I am not going to touch on it all.

From everything I read, the proposed action that gets the most clout is that for open-sourcing... You are going to have a really difficult time if you want access to IP, and IP that is connected to or built upon other IP, etc. Never mind bad actors wanting to exploit code and make it available for training, etc. The last thing gamers would want is erosion of digital property.

Anyhow, I hope that the right arguments are made, and I have read some good propositions from others.
 
...so who is going to start Stop Destroying Betamax

The right to repair will cover that. Some people are already dumbstruck with things like vinyl and compact cassettes returning. If there is a market for it, there is continuity for the medium. It is not only the format and the storage medium, but also the bespoke hardware for them that needs to be supported, and all of this has layers. This is also in the context of physical property.
 


BeamNG is a member of Video Games Europe. VGE didn't ask BeamNG concerning their response to Stop Killing Videogames. As far i know there wasn't a vote on this too. We do NOT agree with their statement, this is not how a representative group should be behaving.
 

lmao "poor people will struggle more" games are a luxury. A thief struggles more by not stealing my wallet, too

:unsure:

Yoh, that is a bad take in response to RWS. Within what economics term are digital video games considered a luxury? Video games are neither luxury goods, per se, nor necessity goods. Now, this said, a video game would be best positioned as a normal good. However, the luxury term is applicable to collector's video game editions.

There are other terms that can be applied to in-game monetization, but that is a whole other topic.
 



:unsure:

Yoh, that is a bad take in response to RWS. Within what economics term are digital video games considered a luxury? Video games are neither luxury goods, per se, nor necessity goods. Now, this said, a video game would be best positioned as a normal good. However, the luxury term is applicable to collector's video game editions.

There are other terms that can be applied to in-game monetization, but that is a whole other topic.
Not every opinion on X needs to be taken seriously. Video games have always been part of culture so they missed the mark here.
 
The right to repair will cover that. Some people are already dumbstruck with things like vinyl and compact cassettes returning. If there is a market for it, there is continuity for the medium. It is not only the format and the storage medium, but also the bespoke hardware for them that needs to be supported, and all of this has layers. This is also in the context of physical property.
Can't wait for 'Stop Destroying Volvo' when volvo pulls from south africa.

Which reminds me, I need to make as sticky note somewhere to play division 1 in 2050.
 
Can't wait for 'Stop Destroying Volvo' when volvo pulls from south africa.

Which reminds me, I need to make as sticky note somewhere to play division 1 in 2050.

The Division will be dead by then. That game is heavily server-sided. Since Ubi is pulling some things, I see they are putting more into The Division 2. They are auditing their cows.
 
There will always be games like The Division. These are games designed as live services on which the logic resides server-side. Stop Killing Games won't be stopping these unless players keep playing them, pushing money into their ecosystems. The Division has interesting roots; this design path was chosen to accommodate the console base.

Who knows, perhaps Ubi is willing to decouple its logic, update the client with all the needed logic, and introduce LAN.

People want games like these to live on, then LAN must be brought back. LAN wasn't killed by the internet, as some believe, but removed because it stood in DRM's way. Marketing (and PR) did the rest. It would be nice to have local servers again... It could be cool to introduce it as a mechanism with a sunset clause. The ecosystem would have to be pulled, so bye-bye new cosmetics.
 
Language like this makes no sense.


"I stand with the people who started this citizen initiative. I signed and will continue to help them. A game, once sold, belongs to the customer, not the company."

It is the wrong clout to put out there. You aren't acquiring another company's property. IP laws will cut such sentiment at its throat, quick. Now, this said, I have had a look at EU laws, especially in concern to digital license ownership. They do have protection rights, but it is conditional. I am not going to dive into that here.

What these advocates in Europe should communicate is examining an ownership model within the licensing structure that covers the IP owners, stewards, and custodians, and the licensees, to preserve and provide access to play. They need to meet in the middle. Getting greedy gets you nowhere.

I am not surprised to see politicians get in on this. It happened to the "click-to-cancel" rule too; they rushed it and were rolled by lobbyists.
 
I actually saw LTT touch on this, and it is a good example. It is exactly what I would envision to ensure game continuity. This isn't a live-service title; it is an ordinary RTS. The Supreme Commander: Forged Alliance multiplayer servers have been sunset a long time ago, but the game does have LAN. They also have a community that is ensuring its continuity, called "Forged Alliance Forever," or "FAF."

The IP owners remain Gas Powered Games and Square Enix. The game's stewards are FAF. Its custodians are Steam and GOG. You still have to buy the game on Steam or GOG and link it to FAF. For local multiplayer or single player, you don't need this, but this is a suitable structure to incorporate to save video games. I can expand on this, but this is good practice.
 
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