The F-35 thread

NarrowBandFtw said:
Laughable, where have you offered any? You point out a flaw experienced in testing, which happens to all development planes (as demonstrated by the much longer F-35 problem list).

You point out a disagreement over design choices between India and Russia as if it means anything, it is a Russian plane, of course they are going to insist on the final word in designing their own plane.

Lastly you offered a "duh", so I ask, how would you have any clue whether or not reason works with me when you haven't offered any?
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They rejected the Russian hardware because they said it was useless and the Russians had lied about their stealth abilities. They have since opten for EU hardware over the Russian hardware.
 
F35 more realistic operations. No, it will not go into a dog fight with cheap Russian hardware, though its missiles might ;)

[video=youtube_share;y44lftPGWvM]https://youtu.be/y44lftPGWvM[/video]
 
access said:
aah my bad, pentagon releasing fake news again. how could i forget.
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A dog fight is when a fighter goes toe to toe with another fighter normally at close range. The pentagon released such a video? The F35 was never designed for that so thats odd.
 
ghoti said:
They rejected the Russian hardware because they said it was useless and the Russians had lied about their stealth abilities.
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You need to research the situation a bit more if your conclusion is that far off the mark. fwiw they are STILL on track to sign the final agreement this year: http://thediplomat.com/2016/09/india-and-russia-reach-agreement-over-5th-generation-fighter-aircraft/

The disagreements you keep harping on about is, as I've already pointed out, about design decisions.
 
access said:
is the sound past the f-35 when it looses energy..

its obvious they want to promote their latest as the greatest.
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Weak troll is weak, i will await your post indicating where i said the pentagon is releasing fake news though.
 
ghoti said:
A dog fight is when a fighter goes toe to toe with another fighter normally at close range. The pentagon released such a video? The F35 was never designed for that so thats odd.
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do you assume a f-35 would never ever be intercepted and they would not test such things? stealth and range do not guarantee such things, only lessens the chance.
 
Unhappy438 said:
Weak troll is weak, i will await your post indicating where i said the pentagon is releasing fake news though.
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i said it must be fake news, pentagon said it sucks in a dog fight, you said it would not be in a dog fight.
 
access said:
do you assume a f-35 would never ever be intercepted and they would not test such things? stealth and range do not guarantee such things, only lessens the chance.
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The "F-35 will never see a dogfight" angle is a relatively new one AFAIK, the F-35A is certainly intended for some dogfighting: http://www.military-today.com/aircraft/lockheed_martin_f35.htm
F-35A conventional take-off and landing aircraft. It is a land-based model for the US Air Force. It is the smallest and lightest version of the F-35. Also it will be the most popular version of the F-35. The F-35A is the only version of the F-35 with a built-in GAU-22/A four-barrel 25-mm cannon. In the US Air Force service the F-35A will replace the A-10 and F-16 warplanes
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You don't fit a 25mm cannon to something and claim it will replace the F-16 if it isn't meant to be good at close quarter air combat.
 
access said:
do you assume a f-35 would never ever be intercepted and they would not test such things? stealth and range do not guarantee such things, only lessens the chance.
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Airforce 1 can be intercepted, that does not mean its designed to win a dogfight.


The cheap Russian hardware will go up against air to air fighters like the F-15 if there is a fight. These would normally be not far behind in F35s escorting bombers. The F35s would be aiming for the SAM sites. By the time the enemy know they are there they are already leaving. So if by "interception" could a Russian jet randomly come across a F35 by chance and a fight start? It might, but thats not the scenario the hardware was designed for.

A normal air to air fight between a F35 and Russian hardware would be something like:

US Command : We pick up two fighters 9 km East
F-35: firing missiles once you have a lock on them.
Russian Fighter pilot : I wonder where everybody is...
The end.
 
No mention of the the F35C requiring a landing gear redesign due to it hurting the carrier pilots during catapult launches? Oh it also throws the helmet head tracker calibration out of whack while doing so meaning the pilots helmet queuing and HUD are unreliable.

The airplane seems to be able to take the hammering, but the pilot sitting over the strut can be severely affected by the ordeal. The movement sends their already-heavy advanced helmet mounted display and oxygen mask flopping up and down, applying pressure to the pilot’s jaw. The erratic oscillations also keep the pilot from being able to read critical info on their helmet-mounted display, an anomaly that can persist sometime after the jet has departed the deck and entered smooth air.
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Source
 
ghoti said:
You are spot on. Its not a single solution, its part of a much bigger platform. Thats why when I see those lame russian propaganda videos on youtube with a sukoi vs a f35 in a dog fight I laugh. The f-35 does not get into a dog fight.... it shoots from over the horizon.
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Another thing: The F-35 was never designed to be an air superiority fighter. It's really silly to compare it to older aircraft that are. It has a rather different mission, as exhausitively discussed in other F-35 threads.

Also, the development cycle of the plane breaks completely with traditional methods. "Concurrent Development" is intentional, so critising the F-35 for "not being ready" or ongoing subsystem redesigns is based on ignorance. It's gonna take time, but that's the price of doing something that's a game-changer. It's also why the RAF, RAAF and other partners are staying with the F-35.

Two former F-22 pilots, Maj. Gen. Jeff Harrigian and Col. Max Marosko III, recently published a paper with the Mitchell Institute about the F-35A that they hoped would “demystify things that have been written in publications,” said Harrigian, who directs the F-35A integration office:

The years between when the F-35 was conceived and today were ones of rapid technological advancement. To have frozen the requirements in place in 2001 would have resulted in a fighter that was outdated as soon as it was fielded, he argued in his report. The Royal Air Force’s Tornado F-3 is one example. The technology that went into it was mature, there were no technological risks, and therefore no technological leaps. It was virtually obsolete as soon as it was fielded. The Defense Department had that program in mind when it chose concurrency.“The risks of developmental delays and cost overruns were accepted to mitigate an even bigger risk: that the United States would field its own version of the Tornado F-3,” he wrote.

That “riskier acquisition strategy had to pay off dividends … and what the payoff is — from what the pilots told me — is an extraordinary fighter,” he said.
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RT and other foes will do all they can to get the F-35 stopped, including hundreds of seeded "fake news" stories. They're terrified by it.
 
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Arthur said:
Another thing: The F-35 was never designed to be an air superiority fighter. It's really silly to compare it to older aircraft that are.
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Thats exactly what I am trying to tell people here, but they dont understand this.

Also, the development cycle of the plane breaks completely with traditional methods. "Concurrent Development" is intentional, so critising the F-35 for "not being ready" is based on ignorance.
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Yip, totally spot on.
 
ghoti said:
A normal air to air fight between a F35 and Russian hardware would be something like /snip
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Seeing as the technology on both sides have no track record at all yet, that is pure speculation. Here's a fun question for you though: in the history of USA vs Russia (or USSR) air combat, who has been the most successful in terms of downing the planes of the other?
 
access said:
i said it must be fake news, pentagon said it sucks in a dog fight, you said it would not be in a dog fight.
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And that makes it fake news? You're talking nonsense.

The F35 is not designed to be your traditional dog fighter. It has capabilities that keep it from doing such dirty work.
 
NarrowBandFtw said:
Seeing as the technology on both sides have no track record at all yet, that is pure speculation. Here's a fun question for you though: in the history of USA vs Russia (or USSR) air combat, who has been the most successful in terms of downing the planes of the other?
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Tell that to the pilot in Turkey. Poor chap didnt even know an F15 was shooting at him. Guess those Walmart bought GPS`s didnt work as advertised.
 
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