The Islamic State Thread

Nanfeishen said:
It appears to be mix of reasons.

Undoing the thoughtless western worlds post WW1 middle east divisions from political to religious.
The old Ottoman Empire was partitioned with absolutley no regard for Religious or Ethnic divisions.
Therefore repartitioning along religious lines makes sense to many.
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sounds like a very convenient point in history to use as reference - but exactly how did the ottoman empire come about - what were the boundaries before the ottoman conquests - why should the region of the ottoman empire - little more than an invading army - even be considered as a reference as to how boundaries should lie ?
 
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IRAQI CHRISTIANS SUFFERING LIKE JEWS DID, POPE TELLS JEWISH LEADER

Pope Francis has warned that Christians in Iraq and Syria face persecution just as Jews have in the past, a prominent American Jewish leader said Thursday.

"You have suffered, now it's our turn," World Jewish Congress president Ronald Lauder said the pope told him in a private audience.

Francis also repeated his recent warning that the global rash of religious extremism may have sparked "a third world war", said Lauder, who met with the Roman Catholic leader late Wednesday at the Vatican.

Lauder, a prominent philanthropist and defender of Jewish cultural interests, denounced the international response to the suffering of Christians at the hands of extremists from the Islamic State and other groups.

"First the Jews suffered savage attacks, and the world remained in silence. Now it is the Christians who are being annihilated, and once more the world says little. Why does the world not react?" he said.

Lauder said reports described Islamic militants as tagging Christian houses with the letter N for "Nassarah" -- a term used for Christians in the Koran -- and said it was "no different from the yellow star of David which the Nazis obliged Jews to wear to separate them from the others."


Source : Sapa-AFP /gm
Date : 18 Sep 2014 14:34
 
grantza said:
sounds like a very convenient point in history to use as reference - but exactly how did the ottoman empire come about - what were the boundaries before the ottoman conquests
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Way too much history for a post

Prior to the Ottoman Empire were the Caliphs
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caliph

The Ottoman Empire began around 1299 and lasted to roughly 1920-22
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ottoman_Empire

grantza said:
why should the region of the ottoman empire - little more than an invading army - even be considered as a reference as to how boundaries should lie ?
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The reference is relevant due to what occured between 1916 and 1920.

First was the Arab Revolt backed by Britain

The Arab Revolt (1916–1918) (Arabic: الثورة العربية‎ Al-Thawra al-`Arabiyya) (Turkish: Arap İsyanı) was initiated by the Sherif Hussein bin Ali with the aim of securing independence from the ruling Ottoman Turks and creating a single unified Arab state spanning from Aleppo in Syria to Aden in Yemen.
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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arab_Revolt

The second was the Defeat and partition of the Ottoman Empire (1918–22)

When the Ottoman Empire was defeated by an Arab uprising and British Empire forces after the Sinai and Palestine Campaign in 1918, the Arab population was rewarded with British betrayal. British and French governments concluded a secret treaty (the Sykes–Picot Agreement) to partition the Middle East between them and, additionally, the British promised via the Balfour Declaration the international Zionist movement their support in creating a Jewish homeland in Palestine.

Historically known as the site of the ancient Jewish Kingdom of Israel and successor Jewish nations for 1,200 years between approximately 1100 BC–100 AD, the region now had a large Arab population also from the 7th century. When the Ottomans departed, the Arabs proclaimed an independent state in Damascus, but were too weak, militarily and economically, to resist the European powers for long, and Britain and France soon established control and re-arranged the Middle East to suit themselves.[11]

Syria became a French protectorate thinly disguised as a League of Nations mandate. The Christian coastal areas were split off to become Lebanon, another French protectorate. Iraq and Palestine became British mandated territories. Iraq became the "Kingdom of Iraq" and one of Sharif Hussein's sons, Faisal, was installed as the King of Iraq. Iraq incorporated large populations of Kurds, Assyrians and Turkmens, many of whom had been promised independent states of their own.

Palestine became the "British Mandate of Palestine" and was split in half. The eastern half of Palestine became the "Emirate of Transjordan" to provide a throne for another of Husayn's sons, Abdullah. The western half of Palestine was placed under direct British administration. The Jewish population of Palestine which numbered less than 8 percent in 1918 was given free rein to immigrate, buy land from absentee landlords, set up a shadow government in waiting and establish the nucleus of a state under the protection of the British Army which suppressed a Palestinian revolt in 1936.[12] Most of the Arabian peninsula fell to another British ally, Ibn Saud. Saud created the Kingdom of Saudi Arabia in 1932.

During the 1920s, 1930s, and 1940s, Syria and Egypt made moves towards independence. In 1919, Saad Zaghloul orchestrated mass demonstrations in Egypt known as the First Revolution. While Zaghloul would later become Prime Minister, the British repression of the anticolonial riots led to the death of some 800 people. In 1920, Syrian forces were defeated by the French in the Battle of Maysalun and Iraqi forces were defeated by the British when they revolted. In 1922, the (nominally) independent Kingdom of Egypt was created following the British government's issuance of the Unilateral Declaration of Egyptian Independence.

Although the Kingdom of Egypt was technically "neutral" during World War II, Cairo soon became a major military base for the British forces and the country was occupied. The British were able to do this because of a 1936 treaty by which the United Kingdom maintained that it had the right to station troops on Egyptian soil to protect the Suez Canal. In 1941, the Rashīd `Alī al-Gaylānī coup in Iraq led to the British invasion of the country during the Anglo-Iraqi War. The British invasion of Iraq was followed by the Allied invasion of Syria–Lebanon and the Anglo-Soviet invasion of Iran.

In Palestine, conflicting forces of Arab nationalism and Zionism created a situation the British could neither resolve nor extricate themselves from. The rise to power of German dictator Adolf Hitler had created a new urgency in the Zionist quest to immigrate to Palestine and create a Jewish state. A Palestinian state was also an attractive alternative to the Arab and Persian leaders, instead of the de facto British, French, and perceived Jewish colonialism or imperialism, under the logic of "the enemy of my enemy is my friend".[13]
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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_the_Middle_East
 
IS JIHADISTS SMALLER GLOBAL THREAT THAN AL-QAEDA: ANALYSTS

The Islamic State group poses a smaller global threat than Al-Qaeda despite its recent beheadings of three Westerners, although battle-hardened fighters returning home remain a concern, analysts said on Thursday.

US President Barack Obama is gathering an international coalition to fight the jihadist group based across Syria and Iraq following the release of videos showing the murders of two US journalists and a British aid worker.

But analysts at the International Institute for Strategic Studies (IISS) think-tank in London warned against overestimating the threat.

"Despite its spectacular acts of violence, including against Westerners, (IS's) short- and medium-term objectives appear to be local and transnational rather than global," the institute said in its annual report.

Middle East expert Emile Hokayem told a press conference that the IS organisation's "very ambitious" goal to create a fully-functioning Islamic state may be at odds with its ability to continue fighting on a number of different fronts.

"We shouldn't exaggerate its potency. It is a very serious security threat to the region -- as a global threat it's still limited," he said.

"I think the various Al-Qaeda affiliates are probably the more potent ones in terms of global ambitions."

Nigel Inkster, the think-tank's director of transnational threats and political risk, confirmed that IS fighters were focused on the "near enemy" unlike Al-Qaeda's "far enemy".

"It's not obviously the case that you would see orchestrated attacks against a Western state by the leadership of Islamic State," he said.

However, Inkster cautioned that individual and small groups of extremists might launch attacks, highlighting the Frenchman Mehdi Nemmouche who fought in Syria and is the sole suspect in the killing of four people at the Jewish Museum in Brussels in May.

Western governments have voiced strong concern about the risks of returning fighters and the IISS report concurred that "galvanised Western jihadis could pose a serious security threat on their return".

Inkster added that unlike Western fighters who trained with Al-Qaeda in Pakistan, who had "very little hands-on experience", those returning from Iraq and Syria were "well-trained, disciplined, battle-hardened".

Other analysts raised doubts about how the US-led coalition against the IS organisation could work.

"It's difficult to overstate the disappointment and distrust of Middle Eastern states towards the Obama administration, which springs directly from the failure to back up the red line over the use of chemical weapons in Syria," said Middle East expert Toby Dodge.

He added: "The solution to this lies in empowering and reintegrating the Sunni communities in Iraq and giving some hope to Sunni communities in Syria that change is around the corner."


Source : Sapa-AFP /gm
Date : 18 Sep 2014 15:51
 
Cray said:
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/alan-henning-british-muslim-leaders-unite-to-call-on-isis-to-release-hostage-9739047.html



Good to see some Islamic condemnation of ISIS.
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Why do people assume that Mosques and other Islamic organisations are not critical of ISIS?For at least a month now we've been hearing lots of anti-IS talk in mainstream Islamic mosques and from the scholars.

What the non muslims should realise is that you wont get the mosques/scholars/muslims bodies messages because you are not the target audience,its something which they specifically propagate to Muslims so that we are not lured into supporting Isis propaganda,which is very sly if you think about how they are calling themselves a "caliphate" lol.

I'm guessing the minute percentage of followers they have gathered thus far are people that are not knowledgeable enough to know that they are crooked.

The local Muslim bodies have all condemned ISIS.
 
marine1 said:
Really? Did you even read what you quoted ???
Expel the ****ers
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Cray said:
Too bad the terrorist is actually an Australian citizen, where would you expel him to?
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Cray is right.... the idiot got here at 12, went to school here and is an 'apprentice mechanic' now....he is not still a citizen of Afghanistan, not according to reports anyway
 
AUSTRALIA TIGHTENS SECURITY AT PARLIAMENT AFTER TERRORISM RAIDS
BY BENITA VAN EYSSEN, DPA

Security around Australia's federal parliament was being tightened Friday, a day after police said they had foiled a terrorist plot to carry out attacks in Australia.

Prime Minister Tony Abbott told Nine News television that supporters of the fundamentalist militant Islamic State group in the Middle East had identified his government as a target.

"There is chatter. There has been chatter amongst these networks of targeting government people. There's no doubt about that," he said.

"That's why we're in the process of upgrading security at parliament house in Canberra."

Australia saw its largest ever counter-terrorism operation Thursday, with 15 suspected Islamist extremists detained in raids on Sydney and Brisbane.

One suspect, Sydney resident Omarjan Azari, was charged with terrorism offences over an alleged plot to behead members of the public and capture the act on camera.

Police said the order for the attack came from an Australian senior member of Islamic State, Mohammad Ali Baryalei.

The acting commissioner of the Australian Federal Police, Andrew Colvin, told reporters more search warrants were executed overnight but declined to give details on Friday.

Some 200 Muslims took part in a protest in Sydney on Thursday over the raids, media reported. Community leaders called for calm and said Muslim Australians want peace and security like everyone else.

Australia raised its national security threat level last week from medium to high.

Parliament is due to debate new stricter anti-terrorism measures put forward by the Abbott government last month, with the aim of preventing Australians from taking part in jihadist conflicts abroad or providing support.

Australia is part of the US-led military intervention against Islamic State, which has taken over large areas of territory in Iraq and Syria. Brisbane will host world leaders at the G20 summit in November.


Source : Sapa-dpa /gm
Date : 19 Sep 2014 09:05
 
HOSTAGE VIDEO SHOWS IS 'FEARS ISOLATION AND ATTACK'

A dramatic change of tone in the latest hostage video released by the Islamic State has convinced experts that the jihadist group is isolated and fearful of a US assault.

Where three previous clips ended with a masked militant slitting the throat of a kneeling hostage, the new release Thursday -- a teaser trailer for a promised series of documentaries -- takes a different tack.

The hostage, British photojournalist John Cantlie, sits behind a desk and in a measured tone makes the case for Western powers to drop the threat of military intervention against his captors.

He admits he is speaking as a prisoner and that he may yet follow his former cellmates to the grave, but urges viewers to tune in to a series of films that will reveal another side of the Islamic State group, which has rampaged across large areas of Iraq and Syria.

The video shares the polished production values of its predecessors but none of the blood-soaked savagery, a telling detail for analysts.

Professor Peter Neumann, director of the International Centre for the Study of Radicalisation and Political Violence at King's College London, said the militants had provoked a backlash.

"They were so brutal and made it so easy for Western governments to portray their enemy as completely barbaric people that need to be destroyed," he told AFP.

"And now they are doing the exact opposite. Now they are saying: 'We are reasonable people, if Western governments would just talk to us, then everything could be resolved quite easily.'"

Neumann doubts the change in tactics will damage Western resolve, with US President Barack Obama vowing to crush the jihadists.

Previous hostage videos and the jihadists' brutal behavior in the patch of Iraq and Syria they control have cemented their image.

But Neumann said the change in tone appeared to be a calculated attempt to sow seeds of doubt in the minds of those in the West and the Muslim world who opposed previous US-led interventions in the Middle East.

"There's not as much opposition against striking ISIS as there was, for example, against the Iraq war in 2003, and that's because we look at ISIS and think they are crazy," he said, using an alternate acronym for the IS group.

"I see perhaps how this video perhaps appeals to some people on the anti-war left, people who are suspicious of war and military intervention," he added.

"They will be saying: 'Look! They are not completely crazy. We can give talking, negotiation a chance before going in bombing.' And I think that's exactly what they want to achieve."

Cantlie says the upcoming films will show how the decision of European governments to negotiate with the IS group led to their nationals being released.

British and American hostages have not been released and three have been murdered. A fourth, British taxi driver Alan Henning, was threatened with death in the last execution video.

London and Washington have a policy of not paying ransoms to those they regard as terrorists, and the latest video appears to be aimed at driving a wedge between Western capitals.

Henning was a driver for an aid convoy to Syria supported by Islamist groups, and many Muslims have appealed to his captors to release him, including some that might otherwise back the group.

Neumann said the convoy included a "lot of guys who basically support Al-Qaeda" and that IS may be concerned that its reckless brutality has cost it support even in such quarters.

But if the Cantlie video is one sign of IS perhaps adopting a new tone to avoid isolation, the key will be Henning's fate.

"All these executions have happened on a 10- to 14-day rhythm. If there's no execution of Alan Henning in a week's time, I think we can be almost certain it has caused them to think," Neumann said.

"He's kind of like the least likely imperialist that you could possibly think of. If they execute him, then I think that's the sign that they really don't care, and all this is a big charade," he said.

Rita Katz, director of the SITE Intelligence Group -- which monitors extremist activity online -- said the video showed that the IS group is terrified of US intervention.

She said the change in tone in the latest IS video recalled a similar transition in Al-Qaeda's portrayal of its late leader Osama bin Laden.

Before 2007, bin Laden often appeared dressed in combat fatigues and toting a gun, threatening the West with violent revenge.

Later, as US forces and allies targeted Al-Qaeda safe havens, he appeared unarmed, speaking gently in civilian garb "like a head of state."

"There's no doubt in my mind that ISIS is very afraid of a US-led military operation against it," Katz said.

"First they tried to terrorize with beheadings, now they want to create the perception in the international community at large, both Western countries and Muslims, that they are not incapable of civilized behavior."

Katz also dismisses claims from some commentators that the videos are an attempt to goad Washington to attack, and argues that they are instead a crude attempt to deter strikes.

"From the first days after they captured Mosul (in Iraq), as the calls and threats of intervention were heard in Washington, IS issued videos straight away threatening Obama," she said.

"When that did not work, they moved on to the execution videos. Only a US-led coalition can stop them, and that is something that they want to stop in any shape or form."


Source : Sapa-AFP /kd
Date : 19 Sep 2014 04:07
 
FRANCE TO JOIN IRAQ AIRSTRIKES; US CONGRESS OKS SYRIAN REBEL TRAINING

France agreed Thursday to conduct airstrikes alongside the United States against the Islamic State in Iraq, as the US Congress approved plans to arm and train moderate Syrian rebels to go after the terrorist group.

President Francois Hollande said France would join the US-led air campaign in Iraq, ruling out any involvement in Syria where the militant group controls large territories.

"I have decided to respond to the request of Iraqi authorities to provide aerial support," said Hollande, who visited last week in Baghdad.

"We won't go any further. There won't be any ground troops, and we will only intervene in Iraq."

France, which refused to be part of the US-led war in Iraq in 2003, has said Baghdad's request for aid to fight Islamic State justifies intervention 11 years later. Syrian President Bashar al-Assad has said any intervention would be an act of aggression.

The US Senate approved a measure 78-22 to fund the government until December that included a request by President Barack Obama authorizing the arming and training of members of the moderate Syrian opposition.

"This is the last, best chance we have to put ISIL back in a box so that can't wreak havoc in the Middle East," Republican Senator Lindsey Graham said.

Republican Senator Rand Paul, known for his anti-interventionist views, was among the legislation's most outspoken opponents.

"We must now defend ourselves from these barbarous jihadists, but let's not compound the problem by arming feckless rebels in Syria who seem to be merely a pit stop for the arms that are inevitably scarfed up by ISIS," he said.

Defence Secretary Chuck Hagel said it would cost 500 million dollars to train and equip 5,000 Syrian opposition fighters for a year at facilities in Saudi Arabia. At first, the US would provide small arms, vehicles and basic equipment, and more advanced weaponry would be provided as forces proved themselves, he told lawmakers.

"The goal is not to achieve numerical parity with ISIL but to ensure that moderate Syrian forces are superior fighters," Hagel said, noting that Islamic State should be pushed into a "three-front battle" against the Iraqi military, Kurdish forces and Syrian moderate rebels.

Many US lawmakers have called for a vote authorizing Obama to use force against Islamic State, and Senate leaders said they would consider a proposal after November congressional elections.

Obama welcomed both France's move and the vote in Congress as proof of unity in the fight against Islamic State: "As Americans, we do not give in to fear. And when you harm our citizens, when you threaten the United States, when you threaten our allies - it doesn't divide us, it unites us."

Meanwhile, Islamic State advanced on a Kurdish enclave in northern Syria, sending thousands of civilians fleeing.

The jihadist group seized 21 villages around the town of Kobane in 24 hours, the Britain-based Syrian Observatory for Human Rights said.

Turkey's Dogan News Agency showed footage of dozens of people walking near a railway line along the Turkish-Syrian border and gathering under the gaze of Turkish troops.

The report said 3,000 civilians were trying to cross the border.

The Syrian Kurdish militia in control of Kobane said its forces were resisting an assault by Islamic State fighters using heavy weapons, tanks and mortars.

Islamic State has made territorial gains in northern and eastern Syria over several months, in parallel with lightning offensives that saw the jihadists seize parts of neighbouring Iraq.

The al-Qaeda splinter group has been accused of numerous abuses, massacres and beheadings.

On Thursday, Islamic State released a new video showing a man who identified himself as a British journalist, being held by the radical group after he had arrived in November 2012 in Syria. Wearing an orange uniform, he looked in good health as he apparently addressed the Western public.

"After two disastrous and hugely unpopular wars in Afghanistan and Iraq, why is it that our governments appear so keen to get involved in yet another unwinnable conflict?" he asked.

He said the video would be the first of many to "show the truth behind the systems and motivation of the Islamic State."

In Iraq, a series of suicide and rocket attacks killed at least 17 people and wounded 40 late Thursday north of Baghdad, news website al-Sumaria reported.

The attacks targeted Kadhimiya and Qureiat districts, both mainly Shiite areas. The Iraqi National News Agency reported that the death toll could rise, with many of the wounded in critical condition.

Earlier, US warplanes targeted an Islamic State training camp near the northern Iraqi city of Mosul, killing at least 25 insurgents, local residents said.

The US is seeking to build a broad international coalition to fight the Islamic State in Iraq and Syria.


Source : Sapa-dpa /kd
Date : 19 Sep 2014 03:32
 
FRANCE STRIKES ISLAMIC STATE GROUP'S DEPOT IN IRAQ

France says it has conducted its first airstrike in Iraq and has destroyed a logistics depot held by the Islamic State group.

The office of President Francois Hollande's office said Rafale fighter jets struck the depot in northeastern Iraq on Friday morning and the target was "entirely destroyed."

Hollande's office said other operations will continue in the coming days.


Source : Sapa-AP /gm
Date : 19 Sep 2014 11:43
 
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