Tracert (2nd hop)

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adsl2

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Hi guys,

If one is pinging the second hop on a healthy line an exchange. How should the results look like? Should it be constant at, for example 9ms or can it vary? And if, how much?

Thanks
 
Healthy
Tracing route to google.com [74.125.233.37]
over a maximum of 30 hops:

1 <1 ms <1 ms <1 ms TheJesusRouter.localdomain [192.168.0.1]
2 6 ms 6 ms 7 ms 196-210-144-1.dynamic.isadsl.co.za [196.210.144.
1]
3 9 ms 9 ms 9 ms cdsl1-rba-vl2153.ip.isnet.net [196.38.73.169]
4 9 ms 10 ms 9 ms cdsl1-rba-vl150.ip.isnet.net [196.38.73.17]
5 10 ms 10 ms 9 ms core1a-pkl-te-1-2.ip.isnet.net [168.209.1.139]
6 9 ms 9 ms 9 ms 168.209.1.179
7 11 ms 10 ms 10 ms 74.125.49.66
8 13 ms 15 ms 13 ms 64.233.174.21
9 10 ms 10 ms 9 ms jnb01s01-in-f5.1e100.net [74.125.233.37]

Trace complete.
Click to expand...


Unhealthy
Tracing route to google.com [74.125.233.37]
over a maximum of 30 hops:

1 <1 ms <1 ms <1 ms TheJesusRouter.localdomain [192.168.0.1]
2 81 ms 63 ms 76 ms 196-210-144-1.dynamic.isadsl.co.za [196.210.144.
1]
3 25 ms 12 ms 16 ms cdsl1-rba-vl2153.ip.isnet.net [196.38.73.169]
4 9 ms 9 ms 9 ms cdsl1-rba-vl150.ip.isnet.net [196.38.73.17]
5 12 ms 14 ms 10 ms core1a-pkl-te-1-2.ip.isnet.net [168.209.1.139]
6 11 ms 25 ms 10 ms 168.209.1.179
7 24 ms 30 ms 23 ms 74.125.49.66
8 64 ms * 58 ms 64.233.174.21
9 31 ms 22 ms 13 ms jnb01s01-in-f5.1e100.net [74.125.233.37]

Trace complete.
Click to expand...
 
adsl2 said:
Hi guys,

If one is pinging the second hop on a healthy line an exchange. How should the results look like? Should it be constant at, for example 9ms or can it vary? And if, how much?

Thanks
Click to expand...

If your line is completely idle the second hop should ideally always be sub 10ms or in the low teens. It shouldn't have a variation of more than 1 or 2 ms.

Just remember that if you're running these tests over a wifi connection your results will probably be influenced by the wireless connection more than anything else, always check over a direct wired connection to the router if possible.
 
Thanks for the replies guys.

Line was on idle. Tested with Openweb, Afrihost and Telkom guest and all delivered more or less the same result.
I will take this up with Telkom:

Code: 
C:\Users\C>ping 165.145.94.1 -t

Pinging 165.145.94.1 with 32 bytes of data:
Reply from 165.145.94.1: bytes=32 time=29ms TTL=255
Reply from 165.145.94.1: bytes=32 time=13ms TTL=255
Reply from 165.145.94.1: bytes=32 time=15ms TTL=255
Reply from 165.145.94.1: bytes=32 time=25ms TTL=255
Reply from 165.145.94.1: bytes=32 time=26ms TTL=255
Reply from 165.145.94.1: bytes=32 time=14ms TTL=255
Reply from 165.145.94.1: bytes=32 time=11ms TTL=255
Reply from 165.145.94.1: bytes=32 time=18ms TTL=255
Reply from 165.145.94.1: bytes=32 time=116ms TTL=255
Reply from 165.145.94.1: bytes=32 time=39ms TTL=255
Reply from 165.145.94.1: bytes=32 time=12ms TTL=255
Reply from 165.145.94.1: bytes=32 time=93ms TTL=255
Reply from 165.145.94.1: bytes=32 time=66ms TTL=255
Reply from 165.145.94.1: bytes=32 time=27ms TTL=255
Reply from 165.145.94.1: bytes=32 time=17ms TTL=255
Reply from 165.145.94.1: bytes=32 time=12ms TTL=255
Reply from 165.145.94.1: bytes=32 time=14ms TTL=255
Reply from 165.145.94.1: bytes=32 time=26ms TTL=255
Reply from 165.145.94.1: bytes=32 time=12ms TTL=255
Reply from 165.145.94.1: bytes=32 time=64ms TTL=255
...
Reply from 165.145.94.1: bytes=32 time=16ms TTL=255
Reply from 165.145.94.1: bytes=32 time=38ms TTL=255
Reply from 165.145.94.1: bytes=32 time=56ms TTL=255
Reply from 165.145.94.1: bytes=32 time=16ms TTL=255
Reply from 165.145.94.1: bytes=32 time=34ms TTL=255
Reply from 165.145.94.1: bytes=32 time=45ms TTL=255
Reply from 165.145.94.1: bytes=32 time=29ms TTL=255
Reply from 165.145.94.1: bytes=32 time=37ms TTL=255
Reply from 165.145.94.1: bytes=32 time=12ms TTL=255
Reply from 165.145.94.1: bytes=32 time=28ms TTL=255
Reply from 165.145.94.1: bytes=32 time=20ms TTL=255
Reply from 165.145.94.1: bytes=32 time=24ms TTL=255
Reply from 165.145.94.1: bytes=32 time=31ms TTL=255
Reply from 165.145.94.1: bytes=32 time=16ms TTL=255
Reply from 165.145.94.1: bytes=32 time=35ms TTL=255
Reply from 165.145.94.1: bytes=32 time=13ms TTL=255
Reply from 165.145.94.1: bytes=32 time=15ms TTL=255
Reply from 165.145.94.1: bytes=32 time=29ms TTL=255

Ping statistics for 165.145.94.1:
    Packets: Sent = 170, Received = 170, Lost = 0 (0% loss),
Reply from 165.145.94.1: Approximate round trip times in milli-seconds:
    Minimum = 11ms, Maximum = 213ms, Average = 32ms
bytes=32 Control-C

The first graph is the second hop for the last 48 hours. The above trace was done just after 6 today in the area with no data as I paused to connect to the telkom guest account.

www.Openweb.co.za.jpg

EDIT: Larger pic
 
Last edited:
DrJohnZoidberg said:
If your line is completely idle the second hop should ideally always be sub 10ms or in the low teens. It shouldn't have a variation of more than 1 or 2 ms.

Just remember that if you're running these tests over a wifi connection your results will probably be influenced by the wireless connection more than anything else, always check over a direct wired connection to the router if possible.
Click to expand...

Correct what DrJohn said, best is to log into your router and do a test from there onwards eliminating the lan overhead, WiFi etc.

Code: 
Traceroute output: www.google.com

 1  196-210-142-129.dynamic.isadsl.co.za (196.210.142.129)  8.669 ms  8.739 ms  8.590 ms
 2  cdsl2-rba-vl2663.ip.isnet.net (196.38.73.25)  11.811 ms  11.437 ms  11.576 ms
 3  cdsl2-rba-vl150.ip.isnet.net (196.38.73.9)  11.333 ms  11.432 ms  11.111 ms
 4  196.26.0.61 (196.26.0.61)  12.281 ms  11.467 ms  12.052 ms
 5  196.26.0.130 (196.26.0.130)  11.067 ms  11.746 ms  11.550 ms
 6  74.125.49.66 (74.125.49.66)  12.078 ms  12.165 ms  13.055 ms
 7  64.233.174.21 (64.233.174.21)  12.084 ms  12.871 ms  12.308 ms
 8  jnb01s01-in-f6.1e100.net (74.125.233.38)  12.564 ms  12.236 ms  12.547 ms

Regards,
 
Last edited:
Basically should stay under 20ms, at a stretch. Anything really healthy would be under 12ms :)

Z
 
sorry for the bump guys, but what does it mean if it times out on the 2nd hop

the the router 1ms 1ms 1ms.....
then it just * * * time out

rest after that looks normal
 
sybertiger said:
sorry for the bump guys, but what does it mean if it times out on the 2nd hop

the the router 1ms 1ms 1ms.....
then it just * * * time out

rest after that looks normal
Click to expand...

ever since Telkom rolled out its new "dynamic SNR / line syncing" system, I don't get a ping from hop 2. Times out.
 
sybertiger said:
sorry for the bump guys, but what does it mean if it times out on the 2nd hop

the the router 1ms 1ms 1ms.....
then it just * * * time out

rest after that looks normal
Click to expand...

The telkom gear no longer responds to icmp echo requests.
 
Some F-Wit at WebAfrica told me that timing out on the second hop is perfectly normal, no it's NOT !!!
What BS causes this ?? This explains why my premium gold capped "unthrottled" and "unshaped" line is so **** !!!

traceroute to cnn.com (157.166.226.25), 64 hops max, 52 byte packets
1 192.168.0.1 (192.168.0.1) 3.032 ms 2.671 ms 2.424 ms
2 * * *
3 cdsl2-rba-vl2563-ipc.ip.isnet.net (196.38.73.214) 120.733 ms 27.357 ms 26.128 ms
4 cdsl2-rba-vl2563.ip.isnet.net (196.38.73.213) 40.570 ms 32.312 ms 25.660 ms
5 cdsl2-rba-vl150.ip.isnet.net (196.38.73.9) 28.224 ms 27.432 ms 26.322 ms
6 core1b-pkl-te0-0-0-0.ip.isnet.net (196.26.0.62) 29.879 ms 37.535 ms 26.902 ms
7 core1b-dock-pos-0-3-4-0.ip.isnet.net (168.209.201.61) 205.023 ms 205.904 ms
 
threegee said:
Some F-Wit at WebAfrica told me that timing out on the second hop is perfectly normal, no it's NOT !!!
Click to expand...

The only F-Wit here is you, Telkom disabled ICMP echo requests which means you will get no ping response from their equipment. This behavior IS normal.

If you look at your traceroute results you will see you have a good thing up until hop 7, before that everything is normal.
 
Last edited:
ponder said:
The only F-Wit here is you, Telkom disabled ICMP echo requests which means you will get no ping response from their equipment. This behavior IS normal.
Click to expand...

The actual reason you won't get a response on the traceroute is that Telkom have disabled ICMP TTL Exceeded messages being sent from their equipment.
They may or may not have disabled echo request - without the IP address of that hop it's hard to say.
 
Sinbad said:
The actual reason you won't get a response on the traceroute is that Telkom have disabled ICMP TTL Exceeded messages being sent from their equipment.
They may or may not have disabled echo request - without the IP address of that hop it's hard to say.
Click to expand...

Either way the behavior is normal and WebAfrica is not bull****ting him.
 
I was recently upgraded to a new MSAN, after the "upgrade" / changeover my trace results are the same.
Yes, Telkom do switch off ICMP TTL messages on their newer equipment (reasoning still to be considered)
 
Okay so somewhere networking changed for this to now be normal behaviour ... accepted ... I am the f-wit here :) (not my first time) :D

Thanks for the feedback everyone.
 
My next question, if my trace seems fine to you, why then are simple things like just browsing a simple web page that takes GTMetrix 1.2 seconds to load, why is it taking me or any device on my lan anywhere from 10-30 seconds to load web pages ???

I have gone from an Uncapped 2Mbps Business ADSL package > Home Capped 200 Gb > Home Capped Premium 200 Gb package all in the space of 10 days to try and improve prioritisation of certain protocols.

I am now supposedly a Gold Level priority but in fact my speeds have worsened dramatically especially on simple protocols like HTTP, HTTPS, POP3, SMTP and IMAP .....

The weirdest thing is that I can be battling all day long to work on Wordpress web sites but when it is so slow I can open Netflix or Showmax and stream perfectly clear.

I am stumped right now and really do not know who is at fault My ISP or Telkom ???

EDIT:
I have also been through 3 different routers over the past year, nothing wrong with any of them, latest is brand new and not even 3 months old and still the same old problems with ADSL.
 
Your connection physically looks ok.
So look into things like - which DNS are you using, is it resolving quickly?
 
Thanks Sinbad, can you suggest really good fast local DNS servers to try ??
 
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