US Election 2020 - Pt 2

[supersunbird]

Firstly, there is no threat of force for Trump to go. That's just twisting the words of Joe Biden. Stating that Trump can't fix the violence is just factual.

What's this about Biden? I am talking to you and what you said. Of course he can't fix it if he is not the one instigating it or if it's not done by his supporters.

 

[cerebus]

What's this about Biden? I am talking to you and what you said. Of course he can't fix it if he is not the one instigating it or if it's not done by his supporters.

Who's threatening violence? Me? I'm doing no such thing.

 

[Sl8er]

Are we at all in disagreement about the meaning of the 10th amendment? So maybe you could tell me what you're getting at, as if it wasn't obvious. State rights mean that all the violence is Democrats' fault and ... they're holding the country hostage or something?

Great, but please explain the 10th amendment. (Why do you refuse to explain it?)
Can you tell me why trump isn't going in and "cleaning up".
(And as mentioned, make sure that you quote these posts before the explanation.)

I think the messaging is more, vote Biden because Trump is incapable of doing anything about the violence on the streets. And yes it seems like a good message to push. This is Trump's presidency, after all.

Read slowly. The violence is happening under TRUMP'S PRESIDENCY. Imagining that it will get better under Trump when it's actually getting worse under him is pure bootlicking delusion.

Trump: I alone can fix it.

...but the democrats won't allow me to go in and do it.

Also Trump: Democrats are refusing my aid, it's not my fault.
/shrug

I mean...it's literally right there.
Trump: I alone can fix it, but Democrats are refusing my aid, it's not my fault.
I mean...

But I did already point out that none of this makes a case for WHY anybody should reelect Trump. Emjay admitted it would only get worse. More violence on the streets is not a reason to vote for anybody.

Yes, because the left has already said:
If trump is re-elected we'll be more violent.
Vote for biden...or else....

It goes a little something like this:
*Left does violence non-stop for 100 days -and counting*

trump from day 1: The violence must stop. I can fix it.
Left: Go out and riot! We'll support you by not prosecuting you and setting up funds to bail you out! We'll let you out, don't worry!

* unsurprisingly, Left does more burn, loot, murder, violence*

trump: the riots and violence must stop. Lemme in, I can fix it.
Left: You stay out of our cities!
Left: Give 'em hell in the streets! Don't let up!
trump: the violence must stop. Just say the word and I'm in.
Left supporters: Look at all the violence.
trump: Allow me access, I'll sort it out.
Left: No! You can't come in! Constitution this and constitution that! (AKA 10th Amendment )

* trump does exactly what the constitution dictates and stays out of states (except for federal property, which falls under federal law and protection) *

Left: All this violence, this is all trump's fault.
Left: Why isn't trump doing anything about this?
trump: Cool, lemme in and I'll fix it.
Left: You stay the fck away!
Left: trump is useless, he's not doing anything about the violence!
Left: Why isn't trump condemning all this violence?
trump: What? I've been saying this from the start?
trump: I alone can fix it, just gimme a chance.
Left: You better stay the fck out.
Left supporters: Why isn't trump stopping the violence?! This is trump's America!
Left: If trump is voted in, oh boy, then we'll really fck shlt up!
Non-partisan, moderate, right supporters: Seriously, this shlt needs to stop now.
Left supporters: If you vote for trump, we'll be escalating the violence. You better not...or we'll burn the country to the ground!
Also left supporters: Emjay admitted it would only get worse. More violence on the streets is not a reason to vote for anybody.

So basically, "If you vote for trump we'll come after you."
Then, in the same breath, "Do you deny that there will be more violence? Do you want us to do more violence? You're making us do more violence.
Is this the America you want to live in?
This is trump's America, where we blame you for our violence. You can make us stop, just vote for biden."

Don't tell me what Trump can't do, Trump needs to make a case to the American people for how their lives will get better. And he can't because he doesn't have one.

Maybe if the democrats let the trumpfen-fuhrer in, I wouldn't have to tell you what he can't do. I can tell you what he could do -and has done AFAIK, where they did eventually allow him in.
(Chicago and now Kenosha -if I'm not mistaken.)

Everyone in the country can see the case he's making.
Everyone -except maybe some of the extreme / bordering on extreme leftists, that is.

 

[cerebus]

Great, but please explain the 10th amendment. (Why do you refuse to explain it?)

I already explained it. State rights vs federal rights.

I mean...it's literally right there.
Trump: I alone can fix it, but Democrats are refusing my aid, it's not my fault.
I mean...

What you mean is, he can't fix it and he will not fix it, and it will continue to get worse if he is reelected. It just seems like a pretty weak argument for reelection for me. Even if you want to blame Dems, it doesn't matter. It's not going to get better.

Yes, because the left has already said:
If trump is re-elected we'll be more violent.
Vote for biden...or else....

They haven't said any such thing.

 

[Sl8er]

Who's threatening violence? Me? I'm doing no such thing.

You just seem to support it.

I already explained it. State rights vs federal rights.
What you mean is, he can't fix it and he will not fix it, and it will continue to get worse if he is reelected. It's very simple.

No you haven't, actually.
"State rights vs federal rights" doesn't explain anything.

 

[cerebus]

You just seem to support it.

I don't support it one bit. And I'm certainly not threatening anything. My view is that the escalation of peaceful protests into violent protests is massively counterproductive for the cause. It helps Trump and he knows it, and he actively incites it because he's desperate and he has nothing else to offer.

No you haven't, actually.
"State rights vs federal rights" doesn't explain anything.

For fks sake this is the most moronic line of argument I've ever seen.

The 10th Amendment says that any power or right not specifically listed in the Constitution as belonging to the federal government belongs to individual states or the American people themselves.


The 10th Amendment makes sure that our country keeps working through federalism. Federalism in the United States means the country is governed through two different groups: the federal government and individual state governments. In federalism, the federal government is in charge and is given many powers. It has authority over the individual state governments; however, because of the 10th Amendment, there are some powers that still belong to the states.

The powers and rights protected by the 10th Amendment are called reserved powers, because they are not specifically assigned to the federal government. For example, the Constitution doesn't give the federal government power over driver's licenses. This is a reserved power for each state. The state governments can each determine who gets a license, at what age, and how they can get one.

On the other hand, the Constitution directly states that only the federal government, specifically Congress, can declare war. This means that the state of Minnesota can not declare war on a neighboring state or country. Sorry Minnesota, but you have to take a deep breath and count to 10!

States have separated rights from the Federal government. That is the essence of the 10th amendment.

Now, back to the original point - why should anyone vote to reelect Trump?

 

[cerebus]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1300401521893408768

Trump retweets white nationalist video (that has nothing to do with the current unrest)

 

[Emjay]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1301461968784633856

 

[Tokolotshe]

Reporting people who don't agree with you, classy.

That's a bit dishonest and you know it. He posts cr@p continuously and making it about agreeing/disagreeing is definitely not the point. There is a word for it: trolling.

/Edit: Apologies - I thought this was Tyson.

 

[cerebus]

That's a bit dishonest and you know it. He posts cr@p continuously and making it about agreeing/disagreeing is definitely not the point. There is a word for it: trolling.

OrbitalDawn is not a troll. He posts good content and engages in debates. You don't know what a troll is

 

[Tokolotshe]

OrbitalDawn is not a troll. He posts good content and engages in debates. You don't know what a troll is

The jury is out ...
Sorry, I thought that was Tyson. What happens when you read too quick. Post edited.

 

[Cray]

That's a bit dishonest and you know it. He posts cr@p continuously and making it about agreeing/disagreeing is definitely not the point. There is a word for it: trolling.

Lots of people post stuff I don't agree with , what makes it trolling is if that person simply link drops and doesn't engage - last I checked Orbital still does... If you disagree with what he posts call him on it. If everyone reported everything we regard as cr@p, this forum would be dead.

 

[alanB]

The attached document attempts to reset our thinking on the way elections should be run, suggesting that the normal rule of law should perhaps be overridden. They blame Trump for everything, but hey, the Democrats are the ones publishing this and making these suggestions.

It seems that the narrative is being developed already, to normalise "alternative" methods of winning (stealing?) a democratic election!

Bloomberg is reporting that a Democrat analytics firm is predicting a landslide win to Trump on election night, but hastens to add not to worry, that will be reversed later on - is this what they seem to be relying on?

 

[Sl8er]

I don't support it one bit.

Do support the democratic party, who have been supporting and have supported the rioting?

[I ask, because democrats support(ed) the rioting, right up until when they saw that it was hurting them in the polls. (That's the only reason for their sudden condemnation. The. Only. Reason.)
Actually, I'd wager they're still supporting rioters by letting them go free in Portland -not prosecuting. And I bet the funds set up to post bail for rioters are still operating in that capacity.]

And I'm certainly not threatening anything. My view is that the escalation of peaceful protests into violent protests is massively counterproductive for the cause. It helps Trump and he knows it, and he actively incites it because he's desperate and he has nothing else to offer.

I was referring the the democrats -who you support.

For fks sake this is the most moronic line of argument I've ever seen.

Now you know how I feel every time you say it's trump's fault, when he clearly -according to the 10th Amendment- can't do anything until the democrats allow him.

States have separated rights from the Federal government. That is the essence of the 10th amendment.

Could you maybe not copy and paste, but just quickly explain in your own words?

Now, back to the original point - why should anyone vote to reelect Trump?

JOBS

• Create 10 Million New Jobs in 10 Months
• Create 1 Million New Small Businesses
• Cut Taxes to Boost Take-Home Pay and Keep Jobs in America
• Enact Fair Trade Deals that Protect American Jobs
• “Made in America” Tax Credits
• Expand Opportunity Zones
• Continue Deregulatory Agenda for Energy Independence

ERADICATE COVID-19

• Develop a Vaccine by The End Of 2020
• Return to Normal in 2021
• Make All Critical Medicines and Supplies for Healthcare Workers in The United States
• Refill Stockpiles and Prepare for Future Pandemics

END OUR RELIANCE ON CHINA

• Bring Back 1 Million Manufacturing Jobs from China
• Tax Credits for Companies that Bring Back Jobs from China
• Allow 100% Expensing Deductions for Essential Industries like Pharmaceuticals and Robotics who Bring Back their Manufacturing to the United States
• No Federal Contracts for Companies who Outsource to China
• Hold China Fully Accountable for Allowing the Virus to Spread around the World

HEALTHCARE

• Cut Prescription Drug Prices
• Put Patients and Doctors Back in Charge of our Healthcare System
• Lower Healthcare Insurance Premiums
• End Surprise Billing
• Cover All Pre-Existing Conditions
• Protect Social Security and Medicare
• Protect Our Veterans and Provide World-Class Healthcare and Services

EDUCATION

• Provide School Choice to Every Child in America
• Teach American Exceptionalism

DRAIN THE SWAMP

• Pass Congressional Term Limits
• End Bureaucratic Government Bullying of U.S. Citizens and Small Businesses
• Expose Washington’s Money Trail and Delegate Powers Back to People and States
• Drain the Globalist Swamp by Taking on International Organizations That Hurt American Citizens

DEFEND OUR POLICE

• Fully Fund and Hire More Police and Law Enforcement Officers
• Increase Criminal Penalties for Assaults on Law Enforcement Officers
• Prosecute Drive-By Shootings as Acts of Domestic Terrorism
• Bring Violent Extremist Groups Like ANTIFA to Justice
• End Cashless Bail and Keep Dangerous Criminals Locked Up until Trial

END ILLEGAL IMMIGRATION AND PROTECT AMERICAN WORKERS

• Block Illegal Immigrants from Becoming Eligible for Taxpayer-Funded Welfare, Healthcare, and Free College Tuition
• Mandatory Deportation for Non-Citizen Gang Members
• Dismantle Human Trafficking Networks
• End Sanctuary Cities to Restore our Neighborhoods and Protect our Families
• Prohibit American Companies from Replacing United States Citizens with Lower-Cost Foreign Workers
• Require New Immigrants to Be Able to Support Themselves Financially

INNOVATE FOR THE FUTURE

• Launch Space Force, Establish Permanent Manned Presence on The Moon and Send the First Manned Mission to Mars
• Build the World’s Greatest Infrastructure System
• Win the Race to 5G and Establish a National High-Speed Wireless Internet Network
• Continue to Lead the World in Access to the Cleanest Drinking Water and Cleanest Air
• Partner with Other Nations to Clean Up our Planet’s Oceans

AMERICA FIRST FOREIGN POLICY

• Stop Endless Wars and Bring Our Troops Home
• Get Allies to Pay their Fair Share
• Maintain and Expand America’s Unrivaled Military Strength
• Wipe Out Global Terrorists Who Threaten to Harm Americans (This is just a convenient excuse to keep the war machine churning)
• Build a Great Cybersecurity Defense System and Missile Defense System

That actually sounds pretty good to me.
I've highlighted what I really don't agree with.

What in that agenda don't you agree with?

 

[buka001]

Show me the law that states you can't do both types of voting. I'd like to see it, to know if he actually did suggest doing something illegal.

Double Voting

www.ncsl.org

 

[lumeer]

Back to straight up lying. You spend a lot of time projecting.

Go ahead and prove that even one claim I have made is wrong. You can't do it, so instead you just lie and deny. You have really made a fool out of yourself.

I've reported you for all the propaganda spam and lies. I doubt MyBB mods will care, but maybe they are actually rational good people, since they did ban Tyson already.

That's ironic, considering all the conspiracy theories that you post from non-credible sources.

 

[Grant]

ANALYSIS: YOUNG BLACK AMERICANS NOT SOLD ON BIDEN, THE DEMOCRATS OR VOTING

Most political analysts define “swing voters” as those who swing their support from one party to the other between election cycles – determining winners and losers in the process.

According to this conventional wisdom, the “swingiest” voters are working-class whites in the Midwest, who supposedly hold the keys to the White House.

Meanwhile, by contrast, pundits often portray black Americans as an undifferentiated mass – loyal Democrat-supporting foot soldiers who will execute their mission for The Team on Tuesday as long as some preacher provides the right marching orders on Sunday.


If these depictions have not already expired, they are certainly growing stale. Having studied electoral trends for decades, we can tell you that those undecided voters of the past are an endangered species – in the Midwest and elsewhere. These days, the only choice that most Americans make – indeed, the choice that typically “swings” the election outcome - is whether to vote at all.


That brings us to the characterisation of black Americans as Democratic loyalists.

Our new survey of 1,215 African Americans in battleground states – Wisconsin, Pennsylvania, Michigan, Florida, North Carolina and Georgia – reveals that while those over 60 remain among the most reliable of Democratic voters, and those between 40-59 are still pretty locked in as well, those under 30 (whom we oversampled to comprise half of our sample) are anything but.


NOT SOLD ON BIDEN

Only 47% of those black Americans under 30 years old that we surveyed plan to vote for the Democratic presidential nominee, Joe Biden. That’s roughly the same percentage who have anything positive to say when asked what “one or two words come to mind” about the former vice president.

Cathy Cohen, a professor of political science at the University of Chicago who studies black youths’ political views, summed up this attitude in a recent podcast: “They’ve seen the election of black mayors, they’ve seen the election of the first black president, and they’ve also seen that their lives have not changed.”


NOT SOLD ON VOTING

These young black Americans may well sit things out in November, just as many of them did in 2016 when their behaviour swung that election to Trump as much as anything else did.

In our poll, 31% of black Americans under 30 say they probably won’t vote in this election. That may sound pretty good, given the average US voter turnout of around 60% in recent elections.


But survey respondents of all stripes tend to wildly overestimate their intention to vote. Indeed, about half of our black survey respondents under 30 say they don’t often vote because it “doesn’t make a difference,” providing a somewhat more realistic estimate of the percentage who will probably just stay home – and not search for a stamp to mail in their ballot, either.




NOT SOLD ON THE DEMOCRATIC PARTY
Such cynicism on the part of young black Americans is reflected in the lukewarm feelings they tend to have toward the Democratic Party more generally.

Only 47% of them say that the party is welcoming to black Americans, and only 43% say they trust Democrats in Congress to do what’s best for the black community. Perhaps most strikingly, unlike their older counterparts, only half of those under 30 view the Democrats as any better than the Republicans on these scores.


In both the survey responses and in the focus groups we conducted of young black Americans in these same states, we heard repeated frustration toward what they view as a Democratic Party that expects their vote but doesn’t really do anything to deserve it other than claim to be “less racist” than the alternative.

As one of our focus group respondents put it, “I think at the end of the day, they all have the same agenda.”

ANALYSIS: Young black Americans not sold on Biden, the Democrats or voting

Many young black Americans may well sit things out in November, just as many of them did in 2016 when their behaviour swung that election to Donald Trump as much as anything else did.

ewn.co.za

 

[lumeer]

I'm angry with DavidFreeman for having TysonRoux banned. He seems to even be gloating about it. He posts in this thread all day long from literally 7 AM in the mornings until 2 AM at night. He has made hundreds of posts in this thread over the last week. Now he's reporting posts and getting people banned. He is a toxic presence in this thread.

 

[scudsucker]

Double Voting

www.ncsl.org

Will Davey-boy admit he was wrong about this?

I wait with bated breath....

 

[Sl8er]

I'm angry with DavidFreeman for having TysonRoux banned. He seems to even be gloating about it. He posts in this thread all day long from literally 7 AM in the mornings until 2 AM at night. He has made hundreds of posts in this thread over the last week. Now he's reporting posts and getting people banned. He is a toxic presence in this thread.

I think he's only been banned from this thread.
(I have him on ignore, but I see people replying to him in other threads.)