US Election 2020

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cerebus said:
Reckless and stupid. People living in the townships don't have the luxury of getting hooked onto a ventilator when they're dying of pneumonia, and they certainly don't have the information to 'judge the risk for themselves'. My wife contacted our former domestic worker and asked how she was doing, and she informed her that she was totally safe from the virus, even though she is living in a shack community.
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Stupid poor people. They need rich progressives like myself to make the decisions for them. Be good little peasants and stay in your shacks and starve to death whilst we watch the news about it on eNCA and tell people on the internet how privileged they are. After all, it is for their own good.

Reminds me this:
 
konfab said:
Has is occurred to you that maybe people who are living in the townships don't have the luxury of worrying about something that has a 4% chance of getting them sick?

Horrible evil, racist, people like me think that they are capable of judging this risk for themselves rather than having some half-baked communist in government do it for them.
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What is the chance of mortality when you have AIDS or TB?

The fact that people in townships have no other choice in regards to their livelihood, but to risk exposure, regardless of whether they have AIDS or TB means the government has to lock them down.

And that is where the privilege concept comes. You won't see it. You won't agree with it. You subconciously recognise it and acknowledge it, but you won't admit to it.

The government is very aware of that problem, where people will be forced to make that decision of economic livelihood versus health. It is in the unenviable position of carrying out,what is essentially an experiment.

It is the Faustian Bargain that is at the heart of this policy.
 
konfab said:
Stupid poor people. They need rich progressives like myself to make the decisions for them. Be good little peasants and stay in your shacks and starve to death whilst we watch the news about it on eNCA and tell people on the internet how privileged they are. After all, it is for their own good.

Reminds me this:
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Whatever you say

picturemessage_ke1e4tkl.e52.png
 
buka001 said:
What is the chance of mortality when you have AIDS or TB?

The fact that people in townships have no other choice in regards to their livelihood, but to risk exposure, regardless of whether they have AIDS or TB means the government has to lock them down.
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Lock them down and then what? That doesn't improve the choices they have, it just takes away what you called their only choice.
 
buka001 said:
What is the chance of mortality when you have AIDS or TB?

The fact that people in townships have no other choice in regards to their livelihood, but to risk exposure, regardless of whether they have AIDS or TB means the government has to lock them down.
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And you think people with almost nothing left to lose are going to listen to a government that is fundamentally incapable of looking after them?

What would you do if you were a carguard, barely eeking out a life for yourself and your family, now being told you have to stay at home and wait for a government that has zero track record in delivery to come and help you? The poor in this country know more about the government's inability than the rich. If that were me, I wouldn't listen to the government, they have no other option, even if it means getting shot by one of the badly trained soldiers.

buka001 said:
And that is where the privilege concept comes. You won't see it. You won't agree with it. You subconciously recognise it and acknowledge it, but you won't admit to it.
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So you want me to believe in something that:
1) Can't be seen unless you believe
2) Can't be agreed with unless you believe
3) But is still subconsciously recognised.

Onus is on you to prove that your religion exists, not me.



buka001 said:
The government is very aware of that problem, where people will be forced to make that decision of economic livelihood versus health. It is in the unenviable position of carrying out,what is essentially an experiment.

It is the Faustian Bargain that is at the heart of this policy.
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That is assuming that the government has the capability to make that decision. They don't have that capability if you look at how they approach other areas of policy. Simple example is property rights. There is documented evidence from around the world that diminishing property rights will destroy economic growth, the experts in the government are going along with it anyway. And remember that this is the same government that prescribed beetroot and garlic for HIV/Aids.

Everyone is going to get infected in this country anyway as people will not sit in their homes whist their family is starving. So the choice you have is this:
1) Broken economy (because SOCIALISM and EQUALITY YAY) and infected.
2) No economy and infected.

Malnutrition is already a problem here. Shut down the economy and more people go to bed without any food. What do you think their prognosis will be in getting any disease?
 
People here often pontificate on the sycophantic support for Trump.

If there was ever a post that illustrates how people can be blinded by their ideology and their blind support for everything and anything Trump says and does, without bothering to pause and reflect and apply your own personal critical reasoning, then this post from Ann Coulter is it.

Cognitive Dissonance on a plate.

Here she is saying the exact opposite of what her data shows, just to signal boost and support Trump's message.


https://twitter.com/x/status/1242484117373100037
 
konfab said:
And you think people with almost nothing left to lose are going to listen to a government that is fundamentally incapable of looking after them?

What would you do if you were a carguard, barely eeking out a life for yourself and your family, now being told you have to stay at home and wait for a government that has zero track record in delivery to come and help you? The poor in this country know more about the government's inability than the rich. If that were me, I wouldn't listen to the government, they have no other option, even if it means getting shot by one of the badly trained soldiers.


So you want me to believe in something that:
1) Can't be seen unless you believe
2) Can't be agreed with unless you believe
3) But is still subconsciously recognised.

Onus is on you to prove that your religion exists, not me.




That is assuming that the government has the capability to make that decision. They don't have that capability if you look at how they approach other areas of policy. Simple example is property rights. There is documented evidence from around the world that diminishing property rights will destroy economic growth, the experts in the government are going along with it anyway. And remember that this is the same government that prescribed beetroot and garlic for HIV/Aids.

Everyone is going to get infected in this country anyway as people will not sit in their homes whist their family is starving. So the choice you have is this:
1) Broken economy (because SOCIALISM and EQUALITY YAY) and infected.
2) No economy and infected.

Malnutrition is already a problem here. Shut down the economy and more people go to bed without any food. What do you think their prognosis will be in getting any disease?
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I am not arguing that it is easy. All I am saying is given the predicament, based on the efficacy of lockdowns to reduce infection rates and deaths, is the best option they have at trying to reduce the deaths, because of the socio-economic conditions faced by a large majority of the population.

Yes the economic effects will be dire.

Yes the secondary health effects will be dire.

That is where further unknowns kick in and where the government can be the most influential and will attempt to.
 
OrbitalDawn said:
The lockdowns all over the world are being done while keeping essential supplies and services (and associated supply chains) open. Why can't the US do the same?
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For now, they cant cant do it indefinitely. Italy will start having shortages in the next few weeks, you just haven't heard about it on the new yet ;)

OrbitalDawn said:
And what do you think will happen to those supply chains if restrictions are loosened prematurely and the virus isn't contained? If it spreads into the very factories and services you're talking about.
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The same thing that will happen if there is no supply chains, you get to the point where you've gotta roll the dice anyway.
 
rietrot said:
Lol what a life of privilege you live.

As someone who has lost a few family members in our public hospitals, I can tell you that the right to life is certainly not a very high priority.
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You're talking about the public hospitals of a 3rd world country? You know there are private hospitals here as well?
 
konfab said:
2) They have to get poor vulnerable people isolated from the population at large. I would almost go insofar as something like a UN refugee camp that has strict access control. You make it voluntary so if someone feels like they are at risk from dying from it, they have somewhere to go.
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Looks like I was right:
“We appeal to our people to recognise that the threat posed by Coronavirus in our informal settlements is real. It is, therefore, in their best interest to avoid this risk by cooperating with government as we relocate them to healthier and safer homes.
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https://mybroadband.co.za/forum/thr...-densification-to-combat-coronavirus.1076055/

They didn't need a state of emergency to start with this.
 
rietrot said:
It would appear that not all my white family members had white privilege.
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Why are you putting things in racial terms? Very "progressive" of you.

My father's life got saved at an SA public hospital. He got beaten and left on the side of the road in downtown Johannesburg. He woke up in a Soweto hospital...with a shattered knee, broken ribs, etc.

What is the point you're trying to make exactly? That SA public hospitals are schit?
 
Hamish McPanji said:
Why are you putting things in racial terms? Very "progressive" of you.

My father's life got saved at an SA public hospital. He got beaten and left on the side of the road in downtown Johannesburg. He woke up in a Soweto hospital...with a shattered knee, broken ribs, etc.

What is the point you're trying to make exactly? That SA public hospitals are schit?
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I didn't and you just jumped in in the middle of nowhere.

I have also never claimed to be progressive.
 
buka001 said:
They need to, so that the military can intervene and enforce this.
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They didn't need the military to start with it. They could have started construction a few weeks ago, and asked people in high risk areas to move. The fact that you believe that force should be the first way the government should do this is telling.
 
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