US politics general thread

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cerebus said:
That is simply my response to your own statement above:



After which you tried to shift blame from Kavanaugh (if he is guilty) to the Dems:



And my point is, if he is guilty, the Dems are not to blame. Actually the Democrats have had very little to do with this whole unfolding process of accusations against Kavanaugh. It's been led by media figures like Ronan Farrow. The Democrats could and should have been more assertive to obstruct Kavanaugh until the truth can be elicited from a legitimate inquiry at state or FBI level.



So you don't want a hearing then?
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Should I do an interpretive dance for you? I am neutral on Kavanaugh, as I do not believe hearsay. The fact that a second person has come forth gives a bit of credibility to their accusations. I however am looking at Kavanaugh's history and character references, and they balance out. There should be a hearing to prove the allegations, with the burden of proof on Ford and his other accuser.

Now you are changing your tune. "if he is guilty". Lol. How would Kavanaugh defend these accusations if he is not guilty when the accusers cannot provide any verifiable evidence? Or, he has come up with hearsay evidence from many women that he would not do these things, but you clearly are not considering this. I don't believe he will ever be able to, hence the reason for a hearing (for you or any of his other detractors) is fruitless.

The fact that Feinstein sat on the letter for 6 weeks and then someone in the Democrats leaked it talks to politicking. The fact that Ford got a lie detector test before this came out (even though she claimed she didn't want this to come out) is proof of a partisan agenda. The fact that she scrubbed her social media before it came out is further proof. Then, she demands that Kavanaugh testify first (in what world does the Defendant ever testify first?), and that she is not allowed to be interviewed by someone other than Republican Senators so that the whole outrage like the Anita Hill hearings can play out again.

Lets agree to disagree.
 
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konfab said:
Sending it to the FBI does not require 2 months...
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Ford explicitly asked her not to release it. I guess that Feinstein was adhering to Ford's requests. Did she act correctly? I'm not sure, I tend to think not. But even so, the feigned outrage about politicization is ludicrous because the Republicans have made this nomination process 100% partisan, which has been the case since Obama was filibustered on Garland.
 
cerebus said:
Ford explicitly asked her not to release it. I guess that Feinstein was adhering to Ford's requests.
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Sending a document to the FBI is not releasing it publically.

But even so, the feigned outrage about politicization is ludicrous because the Republicans have made this nomination process 100% partisan, which has been the case since Obama was filibustered on Garland.
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Actually no. The cause of the problem is far older:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Living_Constitution#Background
The reason why this has become politicised is because of the way the US judges are interpreting the constitution. If you start taking liberties of how it should be read and interpreted, you politicise the process of the interpretation. This is the problem of having people use the "living document interpretation to force an issue on a 50% majority rather than using a 2/3 majority.

If you look at how the constitutional court functions in this country, they always use the evil and racist originalist way of interpreting the constitution.
 
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konfab said:
Sending a document to the FBI is not releasing it publically.
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It would still have been acting against the wishes of Ford. Look, I don't know maybe it was politically timed - so friggin what? As I said, the whole process has already become overtly politicized by the GOP and Democrats don't have a whole lot of leverage to prevent Republicans from steamrolling the confirmation. The GOP are still in full swing to push through this hearing and get him confirmed no matter what happens in any case.
 
cerebus said:
because the Republicans have made this nomination process 100% partisan, which has been the case since Obama was filibustered on Garland.
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*cough* whataboutism *cough*

not that it means anything, your fellow echo chamber hostages just hate it though, I expect one of them to complain any second now
/s
 
NarrowBandFtw said:
*cough* whataboutism *cough*

not that it means anything, your fellow echo chamber hostages just hate it though, I expect one of them to complain any second now
/s
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More like whostarteditism. My kids do that so I'm a bit of an expert :p. But yeah, unfortunately it's become a bitterly partisan process and Trump is transparently desperate to ignore any obstacles to Kavanaugh's confirmation.
 
cerebus said:
More like whostarteditism. My kids do that so I'm a bit of an expert :p. But yeah, unfortunately it's become a bitterly partisan process and Trump is transparently desperate to ignore any obstacles to Kavanaugh's confirmation.
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Or one could present the flipside of it: democrats are transparently desperate to introduce any obstacles to his confirmation
 
NarrowBandFtw said:
Or one could present the flipside of it: democrats are transparently desperate to introduce any obstacles to his confirmation
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Like say, another credible witness who can take a polygraph and testify of Kavanaugh's involvement in drunken gang rape? That would certainly be an obstacle to confirmation I'd guess.

https://thehill.com/homenews/senate...-public-with-kavanaugh-accusations-in-next-48

This is going to be interesting to watch. I wonder if Avenatti's more of a hat man or a cattle man? His batting average is 1000 so far.
 
cerebus said:
Like say, another credible witness who can take a polygraph and testify of Kavanaugh's involvement in drunken gang rape? That would certainly be an obstacle to confirmation I'd guess.
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Exactly the kind of obstacle they're desperate to throw into the mix yes, regardless of evidence, of which I expect there to be none.

and yet again, why the delay? why the constant barrage of "revelations" with time delays attached? Ford will testify, oh no she won't, oh yes she will but only after blahblahblah, this new accuser will come forward, but not yet ...

It is all clearly intended to delay, delay, delay. When it is all said and done the outcome could very likely remain exactly the same, only the timeline changes and it being mid-term season makes one wonder if that isn't the only goal: delay.
 
NarrowBandFtw said:
Exactly the kind of obstacle they're desperate to throw into the mix yes, regardless of evidence, of which I expect there to be none.
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We'll see. Enough corroborating testimonies does actually equal evidence. See: Bill Cosby.

and yet again, why the delay? why the constant barrage of "revelations" with time delays attached?
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Each successive revelation has been independent of the Democratic party. Ford was delayed, then Ramirez came forward via Ronan Farrow, and now that the sluices are open the revelations are coming in faster than a line of frat boys outside a dorm room.
 
NarrowBandFtw said:
Cliffnotes version linked somewhere perhaps? I didn't follow that story particularly closely, but multiple allegations each of distinct incidents don't fit the definition of corroborating: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corroborating_evidence
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No, that is true in the case of Bill Cosby. But Avenatti does claim to have corroborating witnesses to his primary client. And there are at least two second-hand witnesses to Ramirez.
 
cerebus said:
No, that is true in the case of Bill Cosby. But Avenatti does claim to have corroborating witnesses to his primary client. And there are at least two second-hand witnesses to Ramirez.
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Whilst Avenatti may or may not have something i wouldnt put too much faith in him. The guy is a showman, a very good one at that with his own political ambitions.
 
A tragedy in two acts:

Ted Cruz on a flight from DC
4507570812ce02d06e136f062f4f2db2.jpg


Beto living in his head, rent free
40613fe44c947241d3b8b5f363612570.jpg
 
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