Vaal Dam levels

Unhappy438 said:
Havent had your coffee yet?
Click to expand...

No, I guess you haven't either, any one else including my self would have being crucified, chopped up in little chunks and offered as a sacrificial offering to the pagan grammar nazi gods for one miss step.So why should I be any different to him, yeah sure he made a mistake, however it is inexcusable with access to the internet and specially google to make sure of the facts before posting any thing.

Especially when you start questioning and pointing out what the previous government or this government had a hand in doing or not doing at all.Secondly because ACSA isn't just some obscure company operating in a small little office in some back water town, while they are definitely less in the news then sanral for example you can't miss ACSA whenever you go to any of the airports they manage, whether you visit or fly, phone for fly information or contact their call center for general information, it's right there in their name.

And lastly fact checking....
 
ToxicBunny said:
Given the political pressure applied to ACSA for the King Shaka project, the government did have a hand in it in quite a big way.

ACSA would not have done it so soon without the pressure being applied to them.
Click to expand...
What political pressure may I ask. ? The Minster of transport intervening with regards to disputes with dube trade port, I am not aware of any pressure being applied it wasn't constructed exclusively for 2010 world cup, the actual airport and land was already under some development since the early 1970's when the project ceased in the 1980's.
 
wizardofid said:
What political pressure may I ask. ? The Minster of transport intervening with regards to disputes with dube trade port, I am not aware of any pressure being applied it wasn't constructed exclusively for 2010 world cup, the actual airport and land was already under some development since the early 1970's when the project ceased in the 1980's.
Click to expand...

The whole thing has always been a political hot potato even back in the bad old days.

There was political pressure to get it built, when it was not the most cost effective option at the time to cater for the increased volumes of traffic that were expected.
 
ToxicBunny said:
The whole thing has always been a political hot potato even back in the bad old days.

There was political pressure to get it built, when it was not the most cost effective option at the time to cater for the increased volumes of traffic that were expected.
Click to expand...


Similar to all large infrastructure projects. It is not correct to assume that politics did not play a role in the old days either. It is equally incorrect to assume that all projects completed after 1994 were because of the ANC. There are always a number of carry over projects started previously that are completed or not. We should be thankful that those projects were completed and not summarily dumped by the new regime.

Equally, it is not correct to assume that all new projects started after 1994 can be credited to the new regime. They may very well be projects planned long before implementation started. Frankly this debate is a complete waste of everyone's time and effort.
 
Geoff.D said:
Similar to all large infrastructure projects. It is not correct to assume that politics did not play a role in the old days either. It is equally incorrect to assume that all projects completed after 1994 were because of the ANC. There are always a number of carry over projects started previously that are completed or not We should be thankful that those projects were completed and not summarily dumped by the new regime.

Equally, it is not correct to assume that all new projects started after 1994 can be credited to the new regime. They may very well be projects planned long before implementation started. Frankly this debate is a complete waste of everyone's time and effort.
Click to expand...

Completely agree...

The ANC had a hand in making it happen, the NP had a hand in slowing it down when it was conceived, and economics etc had hands in both as well.

I personally think at the end of the day something like King Shaka was a good move, but part of the justification was not necessarily right, and there are issues with the design as well from what I know which came from a lack of consultation with airlines due to the speed at which decisions seem to be made at ACSA at the time.
 
I guess telling him to Google where ACSA got those loans from will be too big an ask.
 
The decision to have King Shaka where it is was definitely political. The logical choice was Cato Ridge but political connections did away with that.

The same thing is currently happening with the dry port at Cato Ridge. Municipality refuses to rezone the land and instead wants to move development to Hammersdale.

Guess who has land there, none other than the previous mayor.
 
The only knowledge I have about King Shaka airport is that I know someone that was badly injured on the stupidly long and high escalator installed at the airport.
 
Hamster said:
I guess telling him to Google where ACSA got those loans from will be too big an ask.
Click to expand...

Actually if you bother reading the post I said it doesn't receive a budget allocation, nor is it receiving loans directly from the government either it gets it from the development bank or international loans, is it a big ask not too glaze over important things mentioned ;). While ACSA took a big chunk from their own money some thing like 3 billion they still took out a loan, to retain a positive bank balance with the upgrades of OR tambo.
 
FoXtroT said:
The decision to have King Shaka where it is was definitely political. The logical choice was Cato Ridge but political connections did away with that.
Click to expand...

I remember reading the study on the Cato Ridge site -- if I recall correctly, it was abandoned because the topography (Duzi/Umgeni valleys) would have meant the runway could not be aligned with the prevailing winds, hence significant crosswind issues. I believe that there were also windshear concerns around the escarpment edge where the runway threshold would have been located (see St. Helena as an example of what happens when windshear isn't properly taken into consideration).

Don't know if those studies can still be found online.
 
FoXtroT said:
The decision to have King Shaka where it is was definitely political. The logical choice was Cato Ridge but political connections did away with that.

The same thing is currently happening with the dry port at Cato Ridge. Municipality refuses to rezone the land and instead wants to move development to Hammersdale.

Guess who has land there, none other than the previous mayor.
Click to expand...
No it was not a political issue, the development of grounds where the airport was build was already designated for the airport and some construction already took place, Dube trade port just made things easier, as well as the ageing airport was incapable of handling the modern larger aircraft, as well as the amount of passengers moving through the airport yearly and limited aircraft space as well limit international terminal. JHB airport is still under a massive amount of stress with traffic movement it has over a 1000 traffic movements a day nearly double the amount CPT has.

Aircraft movements entails, push back, arrivals, bay changes and departures it was hoping to alleviate some international arrivals to sister airports like CPT and Durban especially for the world cup.The problem is the uptake for international arrivals to durban airport didn't exactly take off, as most often international travelers had inter connecting domestic and regional flights, durban and CPT airports don't really offer the same type of regional and domestic prowess OR tambo offers.So it didn't exactly take off as planned.

It wasn't a political motivated plot for king shaka it was a logical step specifically in handling year on year increase of passenger and aircraft load the spot where the airport was build was at one point under construction in 70's and 80's.If definitely would link to see links where this was one massive political plot to build the airport.
 
wizardofid said:
No it was not a political issue, the development of grounds where the airport was build was already designated for the airport and some construction already took place, Dube trade port just made things easier, as well as the ageing airport was incapable of handling the modern larger aircraft, as well as the amount of passengers moving through the airport yearly and limited aircraft space as well limit international terminal. JHB airport is still under a massive amount of stress with traffic movement it has over a 1000 traffic movements a day nearly double the amount CPT has.

Aircraft movements entails, push back, arrivals, bay changes and departures it was hoping to alleviate some international arrivals to sister airports like CPT and Durban especially for the world cup.The problem is the uptake for international arrivals to durban airport didn't exactly take off, as most often international travelers had inter connecting domestic and regional flights, durban and CPT airports don't really offer the same type of regional and domestic prowess OR tambo offers.So it didn't exactly take off as planned.

It wasn't a political motivated plot for king shaka it was a logical step specifically in handling year on year increase of passenger and aircraft load the spot where the airport was build was at one point under construction in 70's and 80's.If definitely would link to see links where this was one massive political plot to build the airport.
Click to expand...

Easy there buddy boy. Where did I say that the upgrade itself was politically motivated?
 
wizardofid said:
No it was not a political issue, the development of grounds where the airport was build was already designated for the airport and some construction already took place, Dube trade port just made things easier, as well as the ageing airport was incapable of handling the modern larger aircraft, as well as the amount of passengers moving through the airport yearly and limited aircraft space as well limit international terminal. JHB airport is still under a massive amount of stress with traffic movement it has over a 1000 traffic movements a day nearly double the amount CPT has.

Aircraft movements entails, push back, arrivals, bay changes and departures it was hoping to alleviate some international arrivals to sister airports like CPT and Durban especially for the world cup.The problem is the uptake for international arrivals to durban airport didn't exactly take off, as most often international travelers had inter connecting domestic and regional flights, durban and CPT airports don't really offer the same type of regional and domestic prowess OR tambo offers.So it didn't exactly take off as planned.

It wasn't a political motivated plot for king shaka it was a logical step specifically in handling year on year increase of passenger and aircraft load the spot where the airport was build was at one point under construction in 70's and 80's.If definitely would link to see links where this was one massive political plot to build the airport.
Click to expand...

Keerist, you don't seem to get it do you?

Nobody is saying it was solely politcally motivated, but political pressure had a hand in it happening when it did and in the fashion it did.
 
The level of airport chatter in this dam thread is too damn high....someone open a sluice gate.
 
supersunbird said:
You said the location was, so what would have been the non politically motivated location/s?
Click to expand...

Like I said in my original post, Cato Ridge. If Kelerei is right though than other factors make the location choice of La Mercy more understandable.
 
FoXtroT said:
Like I said in my original post, Cato Ridge. If Kelerei is right though than other factors make the location choice of La Mercy more understandable.
Click to expand...

Cato Ridge was the "B" site for the new airport, it was not ideal due to the issues Kelerei mentioned, but it was workable if La Mercy was a non starter.
 
ToxicBunny said:
Cato Ridge was the "B" site for the new airport, it was not ideal due to the issues Kelerei mentioned, but it was workable if La Mercy was a non starter.
Click to expand...

Cato Ridge just makes a whole lot more sense (save for the aforemention issue): almost equidistant to DBN & PMB, in an up and coming industrial area, closer to most of DBNs population center, on the N3, would be close to the now soon to be finalised dry port.

While La Mercy is otherwise completely out of the way, isn't anywhere near any logistical hubs or industrial areas (Dube Trade Port is a joke) and far away from pretty much everyone unless you live in Umlhanga or Ballito. Pretty much messing up prime residential areas.
 
FoXtroT said:
Cato Ridge just makes a whole lot more sense (save for the aforemention issue): almost equidistant to DBN & PMB, in an up and coming industrial area, closer to most of DBNs population center, on the N3, would be close to the now soon to be finalised dry port.

While La Mercy is otherwise completely out of the way, isn't anywhere near any logistical hubs or industrial areas (Dube Trade Port is a joke) and far away from pretty much everyone unless you live in Umlhanga or Ballito. Pretty much messing up prime residential areas.
Click to expand...

You may need to re-evaluate those statements.

The cities growth "plan" for the next 30 years is up the north coast, not inland. From a long term planning perspective, La Mercy was the preferred choice. It could get the required space to expand as needed, it is in the right area to work with the growth plan and Dube TradePort is hardly a joke, there has been many billions of private investment in the area in the last 4 or 5 years.
 
ToxicBunny said:
You may need to re-evaluate those statements.

The cities growth "plan" for the next 30 years is up the north coast, not inland. From a long term planning perspective, La Mercy was the preferred choice. It could get the required space to expand as needed, it is in the right area to work with the growth plan and Dube TradePort is hardly a joke, there has been many billions of private investment in the area in the last 4 or 5 years.
Click to expand...

TBH the plan to go North is stupid. They should be focusing on going up and sorting out the CBD than trying to expand North (where the municipality's boundary ends practically the other side of the KSIA'S runway) where the infrastructure is already starting to struggle. Plus if they go any further they will arrive at Kwa-Dukuza's town planning mess of Ballito and surrounds.

They have approved the massive development around Sibya without any thought of how the M4 and N2 are going to cope. There are already traffic jams on those roads past Umdloti in the mornings.I mean is the M4 even expandable? There are no plans that I'm aware of to put more lanes on the crucial N2 section between Umdloti and Umlhanga?

There clearly don't seem to be very good at planning, and seem intent on turning the beautiful North Coast into a giant urban sprawl.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top
Sign up to the MyBroadband newsletter
X