Visual Studio 2017 RC

[[)roi(]]

Interesting. Having originally moved from eclipse Luna to IntelliJ, it was a huge step forward in reliability and performance, and have never found it wanting

Rider seems to be a mix of IntelliJ and resharper. I personally don't have a problem using different VS2015/2017 (maybe reshaper makes my life easier in that regard), but I could see why it might have appeal for new .net developers coming from their ecosystem

Yeah strange, guess it's probably the mix of languages I've thrown at it. Weird bit is I don't find Eclipse all that bad; I'll put it in the VS camp; meaning I think it's reliable on Code Completion, Refactoring, Documentation and generally ok to work in; but like VS the Instrumentation / Debugging tools are not as good as Xcode.

Guess I probably need to give Jetbrains a chance again.

 

[[)roi(]]

For me it was debugging, trying to step through code it would crash multiple times a day, drove me crazy.

Let me guess; you were writing Swift code? Yet Apple has pretty much always sucked with the general IDE editing bits; GUI design is great, so too other langauge debugging (e.g. C, C++) and the Instrumentations tools.

The Swift compiler team is really focused and friendly. The Xcode one is very unfriendly and also where the problem is; a lot of developers have been calling for it to open source, who knows maybe this WWDC.

 

[_kabal_]

One thing that annoys me about VS is that sometimes with code completion when i expect to be able to hit enter, you actually need to hit tab, else it just line breaks. I am not a heavy VS user however, and just have jetbrains muscle memory.

Having only used 2017 for the last 3 weeks or so, I do see a performance improvement over 2015, especially with opening solutions, but at the same time this was on a fresh install of windows from HDD to SSD

 

[[)roi(]]

One thing that annoys me about VS is that sometimes with code completion when i expect to be able to hit enter, you actually need to hit tab, else it just line breaks. I am not a heavy VS user however, and just have jetbrains muscle memory.

Having only used 2017 for the last 3 weeks or so, I do see a performance improvement over 2015, especially with opening solutions, but at the same time this was on a fresh install of windows from HDD to SSD

Yip I agree re VS code completion niggles.

Ps. best you avoid Xcode like the plague; it has some of the worse code completion I've ever experienced; find I'm always wishing they would build in an option to just switch it off.

 

[semaphore]

One thing that annoys me about VS is that sometimes with code completion when i expect to be able to hit enter, you actually need to hit tab, else it just line breaks. I am not a heavy VS user however, and just have jetbrains muscle memory.

Having only used 2017 for the last 3 weeks or so, I do see a performance improvement over 2015, especially with opening solutions, but at the same time this was on a fresh install of windows from HDD to SSD

You wanna kill VS? Install that horse p.o.e.s known as resharper. Now you'll have a slow VS.

 

[[)roi(]]

You wanna kill VS? Install that horse p.o.e.s known as resharper. Now you'll have a slow VS.

Lol... not sure why that's still a thing.

 

[semaphore]

Lol... not sure why that's still a thing.

Yeah god forbid you don't use the 'var' keyword with it.

 

[Bryn]

Yip I agree re VS code completion niggles.

Ps. best you avoid Xcode like the plague; it has some of the worse code completion I've ever experienced; find I'm always wishing they would build in an option to just switch it off.

Have you used/do you use AppCode? I'm only familiar with PyCharm from JetBrains and I really like it.

 

[[)roi(]]

Yeah god forbid you don't use the 'var' keyword with it.

Why specifically the 'var' keyword; does it not like type inference.

 

[semaphore]

Why specifically the 'var' keyword; does it not like type inference.

No opposite, it wants you to use it, i'm against using it all over the place.

 

[[)roi(]]

Have you used/do you use AppCode? I'm only familiar with PyCharm from JetBrains and I really like it.

Yes have used it; similarly CLion, IntelliJ and Android Studio; aside from Android Studio, the other I haven't used in a while. Still prefer Sublime; speed counts.

 

[[)roi(]]

No opposite, it wants you to use it, i'm against using it all over the place.

Lol... Agreed, there's nothing worse than something pestering you all the time. Personally I like type inference, but the IDE / Plugin should just as easy accept when I specify a type. Are there still dev shops where this is the default?

 

[semaphore]

Lol... Agreed, there's nothing worse than something pestering you all the time. Personally I like type inference, but the IDE / Plugin should just as easy accept when I specify a type. Are there still dev shops where this is the default?

By default you mean forcing people to use jet brains or 'var'? Not sure about either. Where I currently work we get given the choice if we want to use it. The only benefit I get from it is the test runner.

 

[[)roi(]]

By default you mean forcing people to use jet brains or 'var'? Not sure about either. Where I currently work we get given the choice if we want to use it. The only benefit I get from it is the test runner.

I guess even horse p..s has its use.

 

[Spacerat]

I must be honest, there isn't really a decent alternative to VS if you're *serious* about .NET dev, I've had limited experience with Sharp Develop (on Windows) and have used MonoDevelop on Linux. But they aren't really as powerful as VS, particularly the debugger. I just don't like how bloated it is, very heavy on resources, can be slow at times (even on decent machines with SSDs) etc. I think if you're in the industry going with .NET and related technologies (i.e. .NET full stack) then VS is the way to go. Otherwise, smaller, lightweight alternatives could be adequate. Just my opinion Hopefully VS 17 can address some of these issues.

IMHO you cannot beat VS for a great IDE. Never used anything better. VS is super stable and everything is integrated. I do normal windows apps, mobile apps as well as Azure apps/APIs. I mean, attaching your debugger to an app running on a mobile device or even a live Azure WebAPI is mind-bogglingly helpful.

You wanna kill VS? Install that horse p.o.e.s known as resharper. Now you'll have a slow VS.

I have VS2005->VS2015 with R# and I have no speed issues whatsoever.... RAM is cheap in relation to the productivity boost R# gives you.

Yeah god forbid you don't use the 'var' keyword with it.

FFS I you don't like it, switch it off.... Code Inspection/Inspection Severity/Code Style/Use preferred 'var' style

By default you mean forcing people to use jet brains or 'var'? Not sure about either. Where I currently work we get given the choice if we want to use it. The only benefit I get from it is the test runner.

I prefer to use explicit types. Let the compiler enforce type safety

 

[[)roi(]]

I prefer to use explicit types. Let the compiler enforce type safety

Huh? Letting the compiler enforce type safety and type inference usually go hand in hand.

What's in your opinion the problem with liberal use of type inference? IMO very useful with the newer features e.g. Lisp, or even the Tuple syntax in C# 7

 

[bridgeburner]

Complains about slow IDE, uses Atom. :crylaugh: Not entirely sure what you're doing but VS runs perfectly fine and fast on my laptop, and the solution has over 200 projects.

Hence I said occasionally.. also can't really compare VS and Atom in terms of performance. Atom isn't an IDE. I've had pretty rotten performance with VS with a solution with around 100 or so projects and 1000+ unit tests on a machine with an SSD.. but that could've just been the set up at the time. That was a while ago... VS obviously likes you

 

[DA-LION-619]

Remember VS is 32bit. A boat load of RAM isn't going to help, fastest SSD possible is the best way forward.

Also been looking into RAM drives.

 

[semaphore]

I have VS2005->VS2015 with R# and I have no speed issues whatsoever.... RAM is cheap in relation to the productivity boost R# gives you.

As already stated RAM has nothing to do with a 32bit process, but in any case I have 32gb.

FFS I you don't like it, switch it off.... Code Inspection/Inspection Severity/Code Style/Use preferred 'var' style

I did switch it off, I uninstalled it :crylaugh:

 

[Spacerat]

As already stated RAM has nothing to do with a 32bit process, but in any case I have 32gb.

Valid point... I have SSD so that likely makes the diff, but I cant say that I have perf issues with R#

I did switch it off, I uninstalled it :crylaugh:

Seriously? I cant live without it...