Twice the length of its half.
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Question of the Day: Main reasons you wouldn't get an EV?
What is up With Web Designers
- Thread starter frikkie6000
- Start date
Twice the length of its half.
news24
Expert Member
Dude?:wtf:
R1500 for 55 hours? That's toughly R27.3 per hour
While we are still on the per hour subject. What's the rate for prostitutes these days?
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Interesting... But true.. SA businesses are scared of the Internet. We ran into a few of these cheepy clients. We nicely turn them away and run. They not worth the effort. If you want premium and quality you need to pay premium and quality moola. Intellectual property and creativity don't come cheep!
But I do agree there is a market for these cheepy websites. But these ****ers should stipulate that it's low budget. They shouldn't compete with high-end designers by over-promising their clients. That's not cool!
But I do agree there is a market for these cheepy websites. But these ****ers should stipulate that it's low budget. They shouldn't compete with high-end designers by over-promising their clients. That's not cool!
Dude?:wtf:
R1500 for 55 hours? That's toughly R27.3 per hour
While we are still on the per hour subject. What's the rate for prostitutes these days?
Like I said, I do this as a hobby. I'm a decent designer but I'm really bad at HTML and CSS. If I were good I could do the CSS in a lot less time. I wouldn't rip someone of because of my incompetence.
Here's my current project: http://img99.imageshack.us/img99/5759/blade2k16.png
I finished the design yesterday, that took from about 10am - 5pm.
I'm sure it wouldn't take an experienced developer longer than 15 hours to turn that into real layout. So the actual time it should take me is around 25 hours which is R60 an hour which is a good wage.
AntiThesis
Executive Member
To an extent, this is part of the reason why the R350 website stuff does so well. People often want simple. They don't actually want a full e-commerce solution with cutting edge graphics, some fancy flash work and social network integration. Sometimes they really do just want a place for Pete's Plumbers to show how to phone them.
I know one of the guys who does the R350 websites (Probably who the OP is talking about actually) and he does good quality stuff. He does do massive developments but this line has the potential to earn tons from more people paying less. There are some dodgy folks out there who make crap and that sucks - but it does push people back to good devs.
czc
Honorary Master
My company paid around R6000
AntiThesis
Executive Member
From scratch, interface, logo, cutting, coding, content, 7 pages.......and didn't charge a cent. 1 day's work.
http://i54.tinypic.com/nec8l0.jpg
but like I said, was for my cuzzie.
http://i54.tinypic.com/nec8l0.jpg
but like I said, was for my cuzzie.
czc
Honorary Master
Admittedly it was 12 pages and there was a lot of copyrighting involved. The company was Fusion Software
AntiThesis
Executive Member
I don't know about that hey - I tend to charge depending on what the client's budget is and what I think my time is worth for a particular job. If I'm just doing straight HTML and there's no effort involved - I won't charge R6k even if I can, it's just as bad as charging R350 and doing a crap job.
As an aside, site loads fairly slowly - you may want to think about resizing those huge blue banners (starter, plus, premium) as they're pretty big.
Don't take this the wrong way (because it really isn't that way) but your site (yougottohaveit) would make me not use you for web design.
@czc: I can kinda understand if there were a lot of additional services involved - most clients provide their own copy (which makes things much simpler). At the end of the day if that's what a client is comfortable paying and they're happy then that's all that really counts.
Out of interest - 12 plain html pages?
Like I said, I do this as a hobby. I'm a decent designer but I'm really bad at HTML and CSS. If I were good I could do the CSS in a lot less time. I wouldn't rip someone of because of my incompetence.
Here's my current project: http://img99.imageshack.us/img99/5759/blade2k16.png
I finished the design yesterday, that took from about 10am - 5pm.
I'm sure it wouldn't take an experienced developer longer than 15 hours to turn that into real layout. So the actual time it should take me is around 25 hours which is R60 an hour which is a good wage.
I pay my domestic worker more, how good are you at ironing?
czc
Honorary Master
Plain, Its got some sort of flash on top that changes pictures. I think it was built on some sort of cms. I don't really know the details, but my boss is happy with it. Engineering company by the way.
The first company website was built by his partners friend. The title of every page was new blank page and the entire site was flash even the text, so I can see why he went the route of the company I posted.
EDIT: I also remember talk about SEO.
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AntiThesis
Executive Member
Heheh - over use of flash is going to kill us all one day.
Like I say - as long as the client is happy, it's all good.
Like I say - as long as the client is happy, it's all good.
Depends on the brief. Logo required? Special images? Photography? Dynamics? Static?
I personally feel it's unfair to designers to give a price without a decent brief first.
To all designers request a full brief first from potential clients before quoting. Or sit down with your client first. Get to know them. And don't be shy to ask what their budget is.
And most importantly never start a job without a contract and a deposit. Safeguard yourself and the client.
AntiThesis
Executive Member
Oh hell yes - get a brief, get a scope document, get everything in writing.
And yes, I learned the hard way to get deposits. No deposit, no work. My standard for new clients is 50%, returning clients get the benefit of 35%. Nobody has ever moaned about it and frankly, if they do I will direct them to another company I know who don't require any of those things.
I speak 3 languages and have a culinary diploma. I think I'd make a good domestic worker. How much you offering?
I run one of the cheap website jobbies in SA and can say this:
- I started this to try and get as many tiny companies (pet shops, plumbers, small b&b's etc) online with basic info (name of company, contact info, etc).
- They do it all themselves so some don't look great and others are quite impressive.
- R350 is too little for 5 pages. I charge R350 for 1 page and R625 for a 5-page upgrade.
- I believe that I'm helping the SA market by getting businesses online for people who would otherwise never bother. (That's my market, not the net-savvy dudes. I don't care much for what the net-savvy dudes think of me unless, of course, they love me)
My end goal is to get 1,000+ new businesses online super affordably, quickly and easily. So that they can have professional-sounding domain names and email addresses and so that they can be found online if I'm Googling a specific LOCAL service. That means I'm doing enough. It's like selling maize-meal in poor communities. It's not what YOU want to eat but it's a helluva lot better than starving to death because you can't afford food. (Ofcourse, no, my product does not stop people from starving. Or at least I don't know of any cases where it has)
This product is basically like a cheapie cellphone. It gets you connected but you miss out on all the cool things my HTC Android phone (or your iPhone) can do. Them be the breaks. (My sister-in-law has a cheapie cellphone that looks like it comes out of the '90s. It cost her R200 and does calls and SMSes, that's it. And that's where I fit in.)
I also sell more expensive stuff (at www.maxiware.co.za - starting at R5k, topping out at R100k+) and have a small team of 5 professionals who help me build those sites. I've worked with the likes of HelloPeter.com, Here Be Dragons (Mark Shuttleworth) and CANSA. So it's not to say that okes offering cheap websites are clowns but folk who understand that there's a need in the market that no one else is servicing who also do the usual stuff that people consider good work.
Make no mistake, there's not much profit in this market but if you automate it 100% (I'm at about 95% automation), then there's a little fat to enjoy while providing what I believe to be a much-needed service.
I liken it to what Ford did for motor cars. People (of the time) said he made them too cheap and that he was screwing up the market when what he really did was streamline the process and bring the motor car to the public.
- I started this to try and get as many tiny companies (pet shops, plumbers, small b&b's etc) online with basic info (name of company, contact info, etc).
- They do it all themselves so some don't look great and others are quite impressive.
- R350 is too little for 5 pages. I charge R350 for 1 page and R625 for a 5-page upgrade.
- I believe that I'm helping the SA market by getting businesses online for people who would otherwise never bother. (That's my market, not the net-savvy dudes. I don't care much for what the net-savvy dudes think of me unless, of course, they love me
)My end goal is to get 1,000+ new businesses online super affordably, quickly and easily. So that they can have professional-sounding domain names and email addresses and so that they can be found online if I'm Googling a specific LOCAL service. That means I'm doing enough. It's like selling maize-meal in poor communities. It's not what YOU want to eat but it's a helluva lot better than starving to death because you can't afford food. (Ofcourse, no, my product does not stop people from starving. Or at least I don't know of any cases where it has
)This product is basically like a cheapie cellphone. It gets you connected but you miss out on all the cool things my HTC Android phone (or your iPhone) can do. Them be the breaks. (My sister-in-law has a cheapie cellphone that looks like it comes out of the '90s. It cost her R200 and does calls and SMSes, that's it. And that's where I fit in.)
I also sell more expensive stuff (at www.maxiware.co.za - starting at R5k, topping out at R100k+) and have a small team of 5 professionals who help me build those sites. I've worked with the likes of HelloPeter.com, Here Be Dragons (Mark Shuttleworth) and CANSA. So it's not to say that okes offering cheap websites are clowns but folk who understand that there's a need in the market that no one else is servicing who also do the usual stuff that people consider good work.
Make no mistake, there's not much profit in this market but if you automate it 100% (I'm at about 95% automation), then there's a little fat to enjoy while providing what I believe to be a much-needed service.
I liken it to what Ford did for motor cars. People (of the time) said he made them too cheap and that he was screwing up the market when what he really did was streamline the process and bring the motor car to the public.