Windows 8 gets Start button

To the sad sad bunch hoping for the return of the start menu, try again, it isn't coming back. I used Windows 8 when it was still a customer preview, and hated it. I hated it so much, I decided to stop supporting Microsoft, and went to Fedora. After using fedora for a month I sucked it up, and accepted the changes. The changes are not that bad after all.
 
Sinofsky at the D11 conference was to in any way hostile towards Microsoft. It didn't sound like there was sour grapes or a grudge held. Maybe Sinofsky is just a really good actor that knows how not to show his true feelings ... but i got the idea he was okay with MS.

What I did however find interesting was that he uses the HTC One ANDROID phone ... and not as one might have expected ... a Windows Phone. He stated that the One is the one everyone is carrying. Interesting.

Despite Sinofsky's good manners towards MS I also believe he was worked out by Baldmer who manages to cut any tree down that spoils his view. When will the MS Board get it? The company needs a new CEO with real charisma ... not the fake "practise in front of the mirror" kind Baldy is famous for. The passion must come from deep within and electrify an audience.

I also watched Tim Cook at D11 and he didn't impress me at all. Not the right person either imo. Bland like hell. Also missing the natural charisma.

These guys all get coached to improve their charisma, but one can never beat the real thing that comes naturally with some.

Sinofsky has that charisma. He will be snatched-up by one of MS's competitors sooner rather than later.
 
BeVonk! said:
I also watched Tim Cook at D11 and he didn't impress me at all. Not the right person either imo. Bland like hell. Also missing the natural charisma.

These guys all get coached to improve their charisma, but one can never beat the real thing that comes naturally with some.

Sinofsky has that charisma. He will be snatched-up by one of MS's competitors sooner rather than later.
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Tim Cook is good with distribution and products, but the drive to make new products happen, and whip up John Ive in a designer frenzy, is just not there.

I was actually getting excited with Sinofsky coming more and more to the foreground and being seen as the natural next in line to take over as CEO at Microsoft. Well, Ballmer had other plans. How I wish he would retire and hand over to someone more competent!

Like they say, you can fool everyone else, but you can't fool yourself. If you know you haven't in you to get people excited about your products again, make room for a new guy or girl.
 
You can lead a horse to water...

I've explained that you can turn Windows 8 into an improved Windows 7 with just five minutes of your time. If you can't manage this then I just don't know.

I'm not saying that anyone should upgrade Windows 7, but I am saying that if you're buying a new PC with Windows 8 preinstalled or buying a standalone copy of Windows, you have no reason to fear Windows 8.
 
What MS is doing with 8.1 is what should have been in 8.0 if they were not so aggressively desperate to catch up with a moving train who's speed and momentum they overestimated. That there will be a large shift to tablets goes without saying ... it is the super cool thing to have right now ... but the pendulum will swing back to come to a more realistic position. People want tablet now but as they use them they will realise (like all of us heavy tablet users did) that it just cannot replace your PC. There are things that just works far better on PC. Yes, and there are things that work far better on tablets. We need both. A lot less PC yes, as the sales figures show, but the PC market will show some recovery in time. The tablet is a brilliant extension to a PC but for many it will never be the only device. MS must just calm down and do things slower and with less panic. Panic and a knee-jerk reaction resulted in 8.0.
 
Garyvdh said:
Why couldn't they make two versions?

One with Metro for Touch Screens and one without Metro for normal desktops.

This is Microsoft we are talking about, they have run multiple operating systems many time before.
Instead of only giving 50% of the users what they want, why not give 100% what they want.
They keep telling us that metro is just sitting on top of the old Win7 os, so then why not just give us a Win7 desktop that looks like Win8 and has the same new features.
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Gary you see without metro windows 8 is windows 7 dude. So there would have been nothing to sell.

I know you can't see it and i do fully agree with you, they should have had the option to run metro or normal but who would have upgraded if it was going to be windows 7 basically?

As much as people don't want to see it the tablet and touch market is massive and will only get bigger, this was microsoft forcing it on us to prepare for their devices. Honestly if you have windows 7 there is no reason to get windows 8 on a desktop, i just love new OS's so i enjoy it but i could swear it was windows 7 as i don't use most features and everything is pinned so i never use metro actually. Well the tiles system i don't know what it is called in honesty but metro sounds good :D.

Microsoft cocked up, they missed the opportunity, windows 8 is two year later sadly. Virtually impossible to rival and apple in the respective markets now. Add to the fact that microsoft have expensive gear windows 8 has not only failed to impress people it has failed to deliver a product that will rival android and mac on tablets/smart phones although smart phones might still have a shot.

So in all windows 8 has been a failure but they had to try i guess. Rather try and burn than not try at all.
 
Yes the biggest problem people have with Win8 has and will always be an irrational hatred for Metro. What both you and MS forget is the people that buy Mac's won't buy Windows PC's and the Windows people won't buy Mac's. There is no real encroachment from Mac on Windows because the two different groups will always stay in their two different camps, partially because of social reasons... the whole "Mac's are for woman and other effeminate's" thing. What everyone is over-focussing on now is the fluffy middle-group of tweens and other casual users who have no need for a proper PC at all, that's why tablets seem to be dominating.
 
killadoob said:
Dude can i ask how on earth you got to that? it is so flippin true hahaha, vista was not much different to windows 7 apart from the speed aspect yet people hated it but loved windows 7 when it was so similar haha, now they hate windows 8 which is also so similar yet slightly different haha.
Click to expand...

Just years of observation and applied logic. Most view this pattern more as one of MS tries something stupid but pretty then brings out a version that fixes their screw-up. win98=bad win98se=good winme=bad winxp=good etc. Essentially the second version is exactly the same as the first but with all the stupid things taken out or fixed... MS's greedy little way of getting you to pay twice for the same thing.
 
Arthur said:
A sort-of Start button. And quite a lot more, as Paul Thurrott reveals here: http://m.winsupersite.com/windows-8/microsoft-provides-first-look-windows-81
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I am sorry, looking at the screenshots still doesn't entice me to switching to Windows 8. I have a number of copies here and I just don't see the point. If I need to test anything in it I just start it up in a VM. Metro is still all over the show. I understand their predicament and their reasons for pushing it onto people and it has everything to do with trying to gain traction for their tablet version. I just wish they would keep the tablet stuff off PC's. It's not needed there and actually not wanted.
 
Abe said:
I am sorry, looking at the screenshots still doesn't entice me to switching to Windows 8. I have a number of copies here and I just don't see the point. If I need to test anything in it I just start it up in a VM. Metro is still all over the show. I understand their predicament and their reasons for pushing it onto people and it has everything to do with trying to gain traction for their tablet version. I just wish they would keep the tablet stuff off PC's. It's not needed there and actually not wanted.
Click to expand...

I haven't laid eyes on the Modern UI in my Windows 8 for months. It has no part in my life. I have a fully functional start button and menu and I boot to desktop. As I've repeated a number of times, Windows 8 can be whatever you want.
 
Abe said:
I am sorry, looking at the screenshots still doesn't entice me to switching to Windows 8. I have a number of copies here and I just don't see the point. If I need to test anything in it I just start it up in a VM. Metro is still all over the show. I understand their predicament and their reasons for pushing it onto people and it has everything to do with trying to gain traction for their tablet version. I just wish they would keep the tablet stuff off PC's. It's not needed there and actually not wanted.
Click to expand...

So if this was the desktop- which it booted straight into.

http://mybroadband.co.za/vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=53315&d=1370039100

And this is the start menu

http://mybroadband.co.za/vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=53313&d=1370039086

You still wouldn't move to metro?

I think most peoples gripe isn't the live tiles. In fact I think it is one of Metro's saving graces. What most people don't like is a) the fragmentation between Metro apps and desktop apps and b) the fact that not only has the UI changed but so has the way we navigate it. If MS had given us Metro, with a normal start menu and taskbar I think it would have been massive. Those are the 2 things that always made me suspect of W8.
 
There is also the slightly embarrassing confession most would like to sidestep that.... just like with Mac, Metro is just plain too cutesy and masculine ego demands a more spartan and/or neutral UI. Aero is soft as f*&^ perhaps but it has solid enough edges and so on, Aero is for me personally as cutesy as a UI can go without calling my manhood into question.

Somewhat silly I admit.
 
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rambo919 said:
There is also the slightly embarrassing confession most would like to sidestep that.... just like with Mac, Metro is just plain too cutesy and masculine ego demands a more spartan and/or neutral UI. Aero is soft as f*&^ perhaps but it has solid enough edges and so on, Aero is for me personally as cutesy as a UI can go without calling my manhood into question.
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Really?
 
rambo919 said:
There is also the slightly embarrassing confession most would like to sidestep that.... just like with Mac, Metro is just plain too cutesy and masculine ego demands a more spartan and/or neutral UI. Aero is soft as f*&^ perhaps but it has solid enough edges and so on, Aero is for me personally as cutesy as a UI can go without calling my manhood into question.

Somewhat silly I admit.
Click to expand...

No worries. Your username already gave away your insecurity in your masculinity.
 
Bryn26 said:
I haven't laid eyes on the Modern UI in my Windows 8 for months. It has no part in my life. I have a fully functional start button and menu and I boot to desktop. As I've repeated a number of times, Windows 8 can be whatever you want.
Click to expand...

I can understand that and have no problem with it. The problem is that it's about value. What more do I get out of Windows 8 that I don't already have with Windows 7. If it's just going to be like Windows 7 then what is the point? There is effort involved in moving across and there has to be a justification for doing so. Don't tell me about the increased speed because the tests that I have seen put it about 1% faster, if that (boot aside), and in some cases (e.g. games) slower.
 
Guantanamo said:
So if this was the desktop- which it booted straight into.

http://mybroadband.co.za/vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=53315&d=1370039100

And this is the start menu

http://mybroadband.co.za/vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=53313&d=1370039086

You still wouldn't move to metro?

I think most peoples gripe isn't the live tiles. In fact I think it is one of Metro's saving graces. What most people don't like is a) the fragmentation between Metro apps and desktop apps and b) the fact that not only has the UI changed but so has the way we navigate it. If MS had given us Metro, with a normal start menu and taskbar I think it would have been massive. Those are the 2 things that always made me suspect of W8.
Click to expand...

I like the live tiles idea for a tablet or phone. I think it work remarkably well in a phone or tablet. I don't see the point for a PC. I disliked active desktop when MS released that and this falls into the same bracket. Things like moving the mouse to the corner of the screens screams bad design for a desktop OS. It's not about not moving with the times but rather about what is practical and MS shouldn't have stuffed their desktop clients around just to try and get their foot in the tablet door. They could have, as someone indicated earlier, have metro as an add on that installed by default and then, after they found a sweet spot in the future, set that sweet spot as the default in Windows 9. Instead, they got themselves into panic stations with the tablet market and tried to muscle their way in at the expense of their customers.
 
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