Broadband over Power Lines under pressure

There's a missing link in this article - I can only guess that it must be referring to radio spectrum interference as a result of using radio spectrum for the last mile connectivity and BPL as the backhaul, although it might be about electromagnetic interference from the use of power lines for broadband - which IMO is unlikely bcos there is already electromagnetic radiation from power lines that aren't being used for broadband...

:confused:
 
Probably what you say ... the interference when running on the power lines.

I thought this was going to be the future of broadband in SA at one stage, just don't see it happening ever now.
 
ic said:
There's a missing link in this article - I can only guess that it must be referring to radio spectrum interference as a result of using radio spectrum for the last mile connectivity and BPL as the backhaul
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No - the actual BPL signals actually cause radio interference. RoDent mentioned it in his presentation at the conference.

The frequency that the BPL signals run at on the line is similar to some of the radio bands and the power lines tend to act like giant antennas (since they were never designed to contain rf frequency signals and prevent them from escaping.
ic said:
although it might be about electromagnetic interference from the use of power lines for broadbandwhich IMO is unlikely bcos there is already electromagnetic radiation from power lines that aren't being used for broadband...
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EM radiation is already a problem on power lines - ask anyone in sound engineering about 50Hz hum. However the current EM interferance is restricted to 50Hz and apart from a handful of baritone's, no one is using 50Hz to communicate. ;) BPL however produces interference that is far more wideband and will affect considerably more communication services.
 
I don't believe that trying to bend a solution into an infrastructure not designed for it is ever a good idea. This kind of solution usually looks good in the short term, but solution designed technology usually surpasses it both in performance and cost effectiveness.

In the case of using power-lines for data transmission, fibre is a better solution and, with the more efficient ways of laying and producing fibre, is a better solution all round.
 
bekdik said:
I don't believe that trying to bend a solution into an infrastructure not designed for it is ever a good idea. This kind of solution usually looks good in the short term, but solution designed technology usually surpasses it both in performance and cost effectiveness.

In the case of using power-lines for data transmission, fibre is a better solution and, with the more efficient ways of laying and producing fibre, is a better solution all round.
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Can't we transmit electricity via fiber as well, it will solve Eskom's problem of cable theft and the new trend of stealing support lattices (pylon support).:D
 
The_Librarian said:
Why would they steal support lattices? :confused:
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Telkom, Eskom and Iscor (whatever its name is now). Thank the latter for the steal shortages due to SA being exploited like a backward colony with our steal being shipped east, the resultant high steal price, and ultimately the resultant hike in the scrap metal business all ='s theft of cable and steel pylons
 
ambo said:
No - the actual BPL signals actually cause radio interference. RoDent mentioned it in his presentation at the conference.

The frequency that the BPL signals run at on the line is similar to some of the radio bands and the power lines tend to act like giant antennas (since they were never designed to contain rf frequency signals and prevent them from escaping.EM radiation is already a problem on power lines - ask anyone in sound engineering about 50Hz hum. However the current EM interferance is restricted to 50Hz and apart from a handful of baritone's, no one is using 50Hz to communicate. ;) BPL however produces interference that is far more wideband and will affect considerably more communication services.
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I do remember that TheRoDent briefly mentioned BPL and problems with the technology, maybe TheRoDent can explain in a bit more detail here...

EMR is a fact from existing power lines - any electrical current running through any piece of unshielded wire will produce some degree of EMR, my questions is, how far will that EMR radiate out and will the potential interference from broadband transmissions in previously unused frequency ranges through power lines not just be localised to the areas where the power lines run through.

I guess it depends on the frequency being used for broadband transmissions which will determine how far the interference travels...
Saule said:
I would have thought that Eskom's power shedding would also have an impact on the viability of this technology.
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BPL has been a concept that has been around for quite a few years, I doubt that load-shedding was much of an issue internationally when BPL was first conceived.
bekdik said:
I don't believe that trying to bend a solution into an infrastructure not designed for it is ever a good idea. This kind of solution usually looks good in the short term, but solution designed technology usually surpasses it both in performance and cost effectiveness.

In the case of using power-lines for data transmission, fibre is a better solution and, with the more efficient ways of laying and producing fibre, is a better solution all round.
Click to expand...
I can understand how BPL might be a solution worth considering in the absence of fibre optic infrastructure, e.g. 3rd world countries, but I don't understand why the USA would be interested in BPL, how much bandwidth is required for transmitting several hundred million meter readings over a 24hr period...
 
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ic said:
EMR is a fact from existing power lines - any electrical current running through any piece of unshielded wire will produce some degree of EMR, my questions is, how far will that EMR radiate out and will the potential interference from broadband transmissions in previously unused frequency ranges through power lines not just be localised to the areas where the power lines run through.

I guess it depends on the frequency being used for broadband transmissions which will determine how far the interference travels.....
Click to expand...

Two factors:

- The frequencies seems to sit in the same range as commercial systems, including radio hams.
- The length (and positioning) of the power lines results in very efficient antennas broadcasting across the country as these lines criss-cross everywhere.

They probably use a fair amount of power to get the S/N ratios right in such a harsh environment.

So, a fair amount of power, over an antenna kilometers long, and you'll probably pick it up on the moon....
 
It (at this point) would be better suited for use (as per in the USA) in Rural areas as a Means of transmission were other systems are not available

AFAIK most ESKOM supply Transmission cables have a optical fibre core... makes you think
 
umkay, I didn't understand this article at all :confused:

what does internet over power lines have to do with radio frequencies?

I thought we were talking about a device which connects physically to your power grid and gets it's internet feed from that physical link?

Why is a radio frequency necessary for a fixed line technology?
 
Garyvdh said:
umkay, I didn't understand this article at all :confused:

what does internet over power lines have to do with radio frequencies?

I thought we were talking about a device which connects physically to your power grid and gets it's internet feed from that physical link?

Why is a radio frequency necessary for a fixed line technology?
Click to expand...
Best to read the other posts - I also had a problem understanding where the article was coming from.
 
Garyvdh said:
umkay, I didn't understand this article at all :confused:

what does internet over power lines have to do with radio frequencies?

I thought we were talking about a device which connects physically to your power grid and gets it's internet feed from that physical link?

Why is a radio frequency necessary for a fixed line technology?
Click to expand...

Grrr...

Just typed a long response about data rates, frequencies, modulation, spectrum, etc. and it did not post....:mad:
 
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