2007/2008 WI tour to SA thread

the only difference between SA and the Windies in the first test, is that the Windies batted well in their first innings.
 
The same 14 picked for the PE test(includes J. Botha, M. Morkel & SM Pollock) won't be changed, so someone has to go to make way for Pollock. I don't care whether its Smith himself or any other batsman cos they ain't scoring.
 
I meant the squad picked for PE test is going to be the same as the one in CT, no additional people called up.
 
I meant the squad picked for PE test is going to be the same as the one in CT, no additional people called up.
 
McKenzie has been added to the squad. Most likely a replacement for Gibbs.
 
Very good article in the Business Day today about why Gibbs should be dropped and various options that we have. (Unfortunately article doesn't seem to be on the BD website). The article suggested that Gibbs' continued failings at the top of the order put too much pressure on Kallis and Amla by bringing them in too early.

If I was a selector, which I'm not, this is what I'd suggest:

1. Drop Gibbs. He will be back, but for now he needs to catch a wake-up.
2. Unsure about what to do about AB, maybe move him back to 3?
3. Bring in Mackenzie.
4. Replace Nel/Ntini with Pollock. Yeah, he's not what he used to be but he is still one of our most reliable bowlers and a reasonable batsman, and means that our tail is just a little shorter.
 
it's a very good article that chiskop.

something else that i think will have to be considered fairly shortly is boucher's role in the team. if AB continues in the batting form he is in, we will have to ask ourselves the question of whether boucher should be dropped. thus possibly bring polly in or some other all rounder.

it's probably too early to think of it as a serious option, but i think soon it will.
 
Yeah, we need to persevere with AB. His batting is good and getting better. Boucher is the best wicketkeeper we've ever had, but it is inevitable that he will be injured/rested at some stage and will eventually retire. I'd like to have AB there as a replacement whenever that happens.
 
chiskop said:
4. Replace Nel/Ntini with Pollock. Yeah, he's not what he used to be but he is still one of our most reliable bowlers and a reasonable batsman, and means that our tail is just a little shorter.
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I would replace Harris with Pollock, Ntini is all class, can't drop him, he's been our most effective strike bowler for a number of seasons now and to drop him over his current lack of form is ludicrous. Nel brings a bit of niggle to what is otherwise a very tame and pc protea team so I would keep him too. Harris is the one I would drop simply because he is not world class and therefore not worthy, his fielding is average too. sorry Paul.

I agree Gibbs for now should be dropped from the test team but not OD side.

So the team could look like this:
Smith, Kallis, Mckenzie, AB, Amla, Pollock, Boucher, Ntini, Nel, Steyn, Zondeki or Prince for Zondeki if we go for extra batsman.
 
sandmanm34 said:
Ntini is all class, can't drop him, he's been our most effective strike bowler for a number of seasons now and to drop him over his current lack of form is ludicrous.
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Ntini Stats, last 12 months:

Matches: 9
Batting Avg: 4.80
Wickets: 35 at an average of 28.28

Thats not good for a premier strike bowler. For the last 12 months Polly has a batting average of 36.75 and a bowling average of 22. He has only played in 4 matches but even if you look at the last 9 matches he has averaged 38.41 with the bat and 26.06 with the ball. While the bowling stats are off his best, there is something really screwy with a selection comittee that drops Polly and keeps Ntini with those stats.
 
Abe said:
Ntini Stats, last 12 months:

Matches: 9
Batting Avg: 4.80
Wickets: 35 at an average of 28.28

Thats not good for a premier strike bowler. For the last 12 months Polly has a batting average of 36.75 and a bowling average of 22. He has only played in 4 matches but even if you look at the last 9 matches he has averaged 38.41 with the bat and 26.06 with the ball. While the bowling stats are off his best, there is something really screwy with a selection comittee that drops Polly and keeps Ntini with those stats.
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Yeah quite right, can't argue with those stats...
 
28.28 certainly much better than Nel's 47.38 in the same period. How screwy is that.
 
milomak said:
28.28 certainly much better than Nel's 47.38 in the same period. How screwy is that.
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Definitely not good enough although his batting is getting on :)

Perhaps someone can explain to me how you can drop the number 3 rankerd bowler in the world who is also the second best all rounder in the world (Polly) and who has the figures I listed above and yet hold on to Nel with his stats.

I am still not sure about Amla either. He has so much talent but aside from his two hundreds (he was dropped on 0 on the way to one of them), he continuiously under performs. The commentators seem to be saying how both he and Kallis have been carrying the side for the last year but the problem is that he has only had two decent scores.
 
sandmanm34 said:
I would replace Harris with Pollock, Ntini is all class, can't drop him, he's been our most effective strike bowler for a number of seasons now and to drop him over his current lack of form is ludicrous. Nel brings a bit of niggle to what is otherwise a very tame and pc protea team so I would keep him too. Harris is the one I would drop simply because he is not world class and therefore not worthy, his fielding is average too. sorry Paul.

I agree Gibbs for now should be dropped from the test team but not OD side.

So the team could look like this:
Smith, Kallis, Mckenzie, AB, Amla, Pollock, Boucher, Ntini, Nel, Steyn, Zondeki or Prince for Zondeki if we go for extra batsman.
Click to expand...


Sorry but not sure I agree with your verdict on Harris... here are his stats:

M R HS BAv 100 50 W BB BowlAv 5w Ct St
9 86 46 7.16 0 0 29 5/73 23.86 1 5 0

And his bowling in the last test match:
O M R W Econ
30 9 69 1 2.30
15 5 35 4 2.23

How can you drop him now? And we do need variation. You saw this when Chris Gayle was climbing into our quicks!

EDIT : Damn battling with formatting but I'm sure you get the idea!
 
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Its sad(shame really) when genuine out and out bowlers are now judged on their batting abilities because of the pathetic top order. Get proper batsmen and leave the bowlers to do their bowling.
 
stepper said:
Its sad(shame really) when genuine out and out bowlers are now judged on their batting abilities because of the pathetic top order. Get proper batsmen and leave the bowlers to do their bowling.
Click to expand...

The point others are trying to make is that now with the new selection (x number of batsmen and y number of bowlers) when the opposition get through out top order there isn't much resistance in the tail. Previously when we fielded more all rounders we had a much longer batting line up which provided a plan b in the event that our top order didn't perform. That in my opinion is why India got thumped as well - more out and out bowlers as you call them compared to Australia.
 
From cricinfo:

WI won the toss and will bat.

SA = And South Africa drop Gibbs in place of Neil McKenzie: Smith, McKenzie, Amla, Kallis, Prince, AB de Villiers, Boucher, Harris, Nel, Steyn, Ntini.


I hope that taking Gibbs out of the top order (for now) will put less pressure on number 3 and down, and I hope that Gibbs can get his stuff together and will soon be performing back in the team.

Still not convinced about leaving Pollock out. I would have incuded him at the expense of Prince/Ntini or Nel, but that's just me.
 
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