SabreWolfy
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Clearly the clarification you so desperately crave is not forthcoming. How many more times are you going to plead for it?
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Question of the Day: Will you be subscribing to the new Disney+ R49 streaming package?
24/7 downloading
- Thread starter milomak
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Clearly the clarification you so desperately crave is not forthcoming. How many more times are you going to plead for it?
SabreWolfy
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He plays the 24/7 strawman. You say one thing he'll say you wanna do 24/7 so you are an evil network congester.
I'll comment for myself thanks
Is there some sort of legal definition of 'active' use? What's the opposite then, passive use? If he had to initiate a download, it's active use, if MWEB just streamed stuff to his PC without any action from him, it's passive.
nanonyous
Expert Member
Which would be funny, considering since I got unto uncapped I haven't even achieved 50% of my potential usage per month, and the bulk of that has only been while I was awake and able to manage the connection to ensure it didn't bother my mom's usage, since we're on 384kbps.
But yeah, that he felt the need to respond to a post he didn't read at all with something that had nothing to do with it shows he may not have the best argumentative capabilities.
Read it again; you don't seem to understand what I was talking about yet.
Carefully this time.
But yeah, that he felt the need to respond to a post he didn't read at all with something that had nothing to do with it shows he may not have the best argumentative capabilities.
Read it again; you don't seem to understand what I was talking about yet.
Carefully this time.
SabreWolfy
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Nah, lost interest in these circular T&C/ban/bypassing/active/uncapped discussions. Good luck though.
nanonyous
Expert Member
Oh, and as for "using the connection the whole month", let me illustrate my own scenario and then another example.
I live with my mom, we both work from home. We both have erratic sleeping patterns. We both make use of our ADSL connection.
In any given month, I may be awake while my mom is asleep; during this time, since she won't be using the connection, I will be using it, and I may be downloading large files during that time so as not to interrupt her usage of the connection. As we're on 384kbps, I'll use a realistic example such as the 2gb redux mod (Qarl's retexture pack for Oblivion in this case). This file, in addition to another 1.5gb or so total of other files for Oblivion, has thusfar taken over 24 hours to download.
Now, let's say I go to bed shortly after my mom wakes up. I could very well stop my download, or simply rate limit it so that it continues downloading while I'm asleep without having a significant impact on her usage.
She begins working, and occasionally plays some Farmville (which, if you've tried playing it with a loaded farm on 384kbps lately, and benchmarked its usage, will realise that it actually needs somewhere in the region of 1mbps+ for optimal 'gameplay'), Fishville and Mafiawars, many of which she allows to load in the background while she's working, knowing that it's going to take a few minutes before it's usable.
Considering she is making active usage of the connection, my downloads are fine, because they are in essence being 'attended'.
Now the crux of the issue comes in the form of what they constitute abuse against their T&C and what they don't.
If they had to cancel our services because we were 'abusing' our connection by making use of it essentially 24/7, then they would be in the wrong, because it's two people paying for the same connection that are using it at different times; not because we are necessarily downloading incredibly large files, but because whatever we do is so incredibly slow on 384kbps that we have to literally wait anywhere between minutes to hours to days for one item to finish loading.
Let's take one 10 minute 1080p video on Youtube as an example; you'd like to experience what those on the faster connections get to experience, even if it means you have to wait a matter of hours for that one 10 minute (ten minute) video to load. So you get it to start loading then ignore the tab while you go about your business or make use of other sites on the net; that video is still going to load in the background.
Then you may be listening to some inet radio, a 5kb/s stream. That's something you have going on your computer whether you're actually at the keyboard or not, because you can 'use' that music even while elsewhere in the room. Heck, I know I have inet radio going whenever I'm awake unless I want that extra 5kb/s for a download.
So now we have the 384kbps family that's essentially using their connection 24/7. What can they achieve during this time?
A maximum of approximately 95gb. That's Ninety-Five Gigabytes (97,280 megabytes or 99,614,720 kilobytes).
That's if they go at it 24/7, full speed.
4srs.
Now let's look at the lone guy on his 4mbps connection.
He fires up Youtube to go check out a 1080p Music Video - it streams.
He watches a few more 1080p music videos from the same band, they all stream.
He does this for about half an hour, and given that the amount of bw he is using amounts to a minimum of 5x that which a 384kbps user would achieve for that same timespan, he effectively uses 2h30min or more worth of a 384kbps user's bandwidth in that half an hour.
Now he goes to download the Oblivion mods, 3gb worth. This takes him two hours to complete. That same amount of data would take the 384kbps user 22 hours or so to complete. So our 4mbps user has now, in 2h30min of real-world time, used up approximately 24h30min of a 384kbps user's bandwidth.
Now, this guy doesn't quite feel like playing Oblivion right at that moment, and instead goes to get a few Steam game updates. Turns out Alien Swarm is awesome, so he'll grab that at 1.5gb as well as its 1gb patch. He gets this in about two hours, but that's another 18h30min for the 384kbps guy, so our 4mbps user has now essentially used up 43 hours worth of 384kbps usage.
He plays some Alien Swarm with voice comms on, averaging up to around what a 384kbps user would need to utilize to maintain a stable data throughput; he does this for about an hour - 44 hours of 384kbps user's world.
Now he's bored with Alien Swarm, closes that, but still doesn't really feel like playing Oblivion, and instead goes to watch some Discovery videos online (in 1080p, of course - only losers would watch at any lower quality, pfffft). He does so for about an hour, another 5 hours or more of the 384kbps user's world - we're up to 49 now.
Now he sees he has a total of 3gb worth of patches that need to download for various games in Steam, such as Portal, Team Fortress 2, Counter-Strike:Source etc, and figures he'll leave those going while he's playing Oblivion. Tada! Another 22 hours of the 384kbps user's world slapped on! Man, we're all the way up to 71 hours of a 384kbps user's world already! That's almost three whole days non-stop!
For this, he used at least 8gb of obvious bandwidth in the form of downloads and patches, all while at the keyboard, in a timespan of roughly 7 hours. 7 hours he was able to be behind his keyboard, actively enjoying his ADSL connection or the usage of his computer.
For the same guy on the 384kbps, he would likely have had to set up the patches and game downloads to run at night if he wanted to be able to make any use of his connection during the day, and it will have taken him a minimum of those 72 hours to complete all of that loading and downloading.
This is one day, of say, a weekend; the Friday perhaps. On Saturday and Sunday the 4mbps user does similar things, but this time he spends 12 hours on his computer, because like many people with 4mbps out there in South Africa, the internet is significantly more interesting to him during the day then going out with friends - he'll rather leave that for the evening (hint: that remaining 4 hours of a 'normal' day). That means that he will use roughly 15gb minimum per day as opposed to the previous 8gb; if there are four weekends in a month, that amounts to 152gb total usage for a month just on weekends.
In case you're too dense to figure that out, that's approximately 50% more than what a 384kbps user could achieve doing things 24/7, and this guy's only doing them on weekends, while actively behind the keyboard, while actively, periodically, making use of his connection.
Who do you think they're going to throw off, and why?
I live with my mom, we both work from home. We both have erratic sleeping patterns. We both make use of our ADSL connection.
In any given month, I may be awake while my mom is asleep; during this time, since she won't be using the connection, I will be using it, and I may be downloading large files during that time so as not to interrupt her usage of the connection. As we're on 384kbps, I'll use a realistic example such as the 2gb redux mod (Qarl's retexture pack for Oblivion in this case). This file, in addition to another 1.5gb or so total of other files for Oblivion, has thusfar taken over 24 hours to download.
Now, let's say I go to bed shortly after my mom wakes up. I could very well stop my download, or simply rate limit it so that it continues downloading while I'm asleep without having a significant impact on her usage.
She begins working, and occasionally plays some Farmville (which, if you've tried playing it with a loaded farm on 384kbps lately, and benchmarked its usage, will realise that it actually needs somewhere in the region of 1mbps+ for optimal 'gameplay'), Fishville and Mafiawars, many of which she allows to load in the background while she's working, knowing that it's going to take a few minutes before it's usable.
Considering she is making active usage of the connection, my downloads are fine, because they are in essence being 'attended'.
Now the crux of the issue comes in the form of what they constitute abuse against their T&C and what they don't.
If they had to cancel our services because we were 'abusing' our connection by making use of it essentially 24/7, then they would be in the wrong, because it's two people paying for the same connection that are using it at different times; not because we are necessarily downloading incredibly large files, but because whatever we do is so incredibly slow on 384kbps that we have to literally wait anywhere between minutes to hours to days for one item to finish loading.
Let's take one 10 minute 1080p video on Youtube as an example; you'd like to experience what those on the faster connections get to experience, even if it means you have to wait a matter of hours for that one 10 minute (ten minute) video to load. So you get it to start loading then ignore the tab while you go about your business or make use of other sites on the net; that video is still going to load in the background.
Then you may be listening to some inet radio, a 5kb/s stream. That's something you have going on your computer whether you're actually at the keyboard or not, because you can 'use' that music even while elsewhere in the room. Heck, I know I have inet radio going whenever I'm awake unless I want that extra 5kb/s for a download.
So now we have the 384kbps family that's essentially using their connection 24/7. What can they achieve during this time?
A maximum of approximately 95gb. That's Ninety-Five Gigabytes (97,280 megabytes or 99,614,720 kilobytes).
That's if they go at it 24/7, full speed.
4srs.
Now let's look at the lone guy on his 4mbps connection.
He fires up Youtube to go check out a 1080p Music Video - it streams.
He watches a few more 1080p music videos from the same band, they all stream.
He does this for about half an hour, and given that the amount of bw he is using amounts to a minimum of 5x that which a 384kbps user would achieve for that same timespan, he effectively uses 2h30min or more worth of a 384kbps user's bandwidth in that half an hour.
Now he goes to download the Oblivion mods, 3gb worth. This takes him two hours to complete. That same amount of data would take the 384kbps user 22 hours or so to complete. So our 4mbps user has now, in 2h30min of real-world time, used up approximately 24h30min of a 384kbps user's bandwidth.
Now, this guy doesn't quite feel like playing Oblivion right at that moment, and instead goes to get a few Steam game updates. Turns out Alien Swarm is awesome, so he'll grab that at 1.5gb as well as its 1gb patch. He gets this in about two hours, but that's another 18h30min for the 384kbps guy, so our 4mbps user has now essentially used up 43 hours worth of 384kbps usage.
He plays some Alien Swarm with voice comms on, averaging up to around what a 384kbps user would need to utilize to maintain a stable data throughput; he does this for about an hour - 44 hours of 384kbps user's world.
Now he's bored with Alien Swarm, closes that, but still doesn't really feel like playing Oblivion, and instead goes to watch some Discovery videos online (in 1080p, of course - only losers would watch at any lower quality, pfffft). He does so for about an hour, another 5 hours or more of the 384kbps user's world - we're up to 49 now.
Now he sees he has a total of 3gb worth of patches that need to download for various games in Steam, such as Portal, Team Fortress 2, Counter-Strike:Source etc, and figures he'll leave those going while he's playing Oblivion. Tada! Another 22 hours of the 384kbps user's world slapped on! Man, we're all the way up to 71 hours of a 384kbps user's world already! That's almost three whole days non-stop!
For this, he used at least 8gb of obvious bandwidth in the form of downloads and patches, all while at the keyboard, in a timespan of roughly 7 hours. 7 hours he was able to be behind his keyboard, actively enjoying his ADSL connection or the usage of his computer.
For the same guy on the 384kbps, he would likely have had to set up the patches and game downloads to run at night if he wanted to be able to make any use of his connection during the day, and it will have taken him a minimum of those 72 hours to complete all of that loading and downloading.
This is one day, of say, a weekend; the Friday perhaps. On Saturday and Sunday the 4mbps user does similar things, but this time he spends 12 hours on his computer, because like many people with 4mbps out there in South Africa, the internet is significantly more interesting to him during the day then going out with friends - he'll rather leave that for the evening (hint: that remaining 4 hours of a 'normal' day). That means that he will use roughly 15gb minimum per day as opposed to the previous 8gb; if there are four weekends in a month, that amounts to 152gb total usage for a month just on weekends.
In case you're too dense to figure that out, that's approximately 50% more than what a 384kbps user could achieve doing things 24/7, and this guy's only doing them on weekends, while actively behind the keyboard, while actively, periodically, making use of his connection.
Who do you think they're going to throw off, and why?
ajules
Expert Member
Wow...I thought I had seen it all
racer
Senior Member
talking about speed bumps, i was at a client today and noticed his router was syncing at 640 down, 384 up. This on what was always a 512k line... not sure what to make of that....