Advice needed : Setting up wifi repeater 11km

[rbarryza]

My parents live on a farm about 11 km outside town (as the crow flies), in a valley where there's no line of sight to town. So they don't even have cell phone reception. About 2 km from their house (and about 12 km from town) there's a mountain from where you can see the town, and their house. I want to set up a wifi bridge on the mountain so they can get internet via an ADSL line in town. I'm guessing I need the following:

- Wifi router & directional antenna in town
- Router in bridge mode, with antenna that that sees both of end points (end points are separated by about 80 degrees). Solar panel & battery to give power to the bridge router
- router and directional antenna at their house on the farm

Any advice on how to do this the cheapest way?

 

[zamicro]

) I think we are going to see a lot more requests like this ^^^^

 

[SirFooK'nG]

you gonna need some nice microtik router boards and cards for this. The solar pannel for charging the battery isn't cheap. I'd guess you will spend 15K on the whole setup!


edit: idea - Why not try that sattelite internet that was posted a couple of days ago ???

 

[The_Unbeliever]

Contact the guys at the WUG's

Ryder_JHB and Protzkrog for starters.

 

[rbarryza]

Jeez, R15k is a bit steep. I was hoping for around R5k. I'll contact those two, and ask the question on the ctwug forum as well, thanks.

 

[Ryder_JHB]

One of our guys has recently purchased a solar panel setup, and has successfully powered his Mikrotik RB433 from it, so I'm sure it can be done!

I would be worried about the equipment being stolen though, especially being on top of a mountain/koppie... Any chance of being able to lay a slab, and bolt/chain some stuff down?

I'll send the solar-panel chappie in here asap!

 

[SirFooK'nG]

Jeez, R15k is a bit steep. I was hoping for around R5k. I'll contact those two, and ask the question on the ctwug forum as well, thanks.

google prices for solar panels boet ... shocking. Then you need an inverter too handle the power off the panel, plus the battery. Then a solid base that is earthed properly, waterproofed ..... eish not so easy

 

[rbarryza]

Excellent! Getting stolen is not a problem, it's too remote and mountainous for anyone to get there. The wild animals will scare them off (it's a game farm). Will probably have to put a fence around it to keep the baboons out though.

 

[Atti2de]

Hi,

Thanks for the invite Ryder. I've recently acquired a solar panel, regulator, and battery to power up a RB 433 as a test.

Quick thing - you will need to calculate the uptime required and the wattage of the solar panel.

Safe wattage to assume is 30W - so you would need 30W of the new solar panels. The problem is that the output voltage from the solar panel is variable and you need a regulator of sorts. I got one from the solar guy. Can handle 6A - about R 350.

So, now you've got solar <> regulator. This regulator is quite clever and has a charge output and a load output. The load output also cuts off below 11.8V. (Very necessary)
The only other thing you'll have to think about is the size of the battery - you would need a 15Ah at least. I tried a 7Ah and it didn't last the whole night.

I simply plugged into the POE and power the RB as per normal. Shout if you need more info.

PS. Pricing on solar panels is approximately R 55/W

 

[rebel998]

Any chance of being able to lay a slab, and bolt/chain some stuff down?

He'll have to, otherwise his setup won't last long.

 

[I am Penguin]

Excellent! Getting stolen is not a problem, it's too remote and mountainous for anyone to get there. The wild animals will scare them off (it's a game farm). Will probably have to put a fence around it to keep the baboons out though.

A "Pet" electric fence will do.

http://docs.nemtek.com/nemdocs/Electric Fencing products/Fido-Stop installation manual.pdf

About R525.00 for a complete set with low output energiser, wire, fibreglass rods, springs, etc to cover about 50 meters depending on setup.

Also look here.

http://www.mepsef.com/pet_stop.htm

 

[I am Penguin]

........!.............

Care to comment here? http://mybroadband.co.za/vb/showthread.php?t=17690

 

[I am Penguin]

My parents live on a farm about 11 km outside town (as the crow flies), in a valley where there's no line of sight to town. So they don't even have cell phone reception. About 2 km from their house (and about 12 km from town) there's a mountain from where you can see the town, and their house. I want to set up a wifi bridge on the mountain so they can get internet via an ADSL line in town. I'm guessing I need the following:

- Wifi router & directional antenna in town
- Router in bridge mode, with antenna that that sees both of end points (end points are separated by about 80 degrees). Solar panel & battery to give power to the bridge router
- router and directional antenna at their house on the farm

Any advice on how to do this the cheapest way?

The Jwug guys here knows all about it. mabe looking here for ready kits may help. Discuss your need with them too.

http://www.dbg.co.za/catalog/index.php?cPath=74_40

http://www.scoopdistribution.co.za/product_info.php?cPath=49_78&products_id=783

http://mailer.miro.co.za/miro_add_4_wireless_kit.jpg

 

[rbarryza]

Great, thank you very much. Now I'm making progress! More questions then.

Wifi:

I gather something like this is needed for the end points:
http://www.scoopdistribution.co.za/product_info.php?cPath=49_78&products_id=783

- Do I have to add another R52 for the repeater point? (ie 433 Routerboard + 2 x R52 radios)?

- What if I want to add 1 or 2 more clients in the valley? Will I have to add more R52s to the router? If I can get 1 or 2 more farmers to help pay, the costs might just be reasonable.

Solar :
So with About R1800 worth of panels, a R500 battery and a R350 regulator (let's say around R2700) I've got power at the router point? The alternative is a cell repeater which MTN wants R200 000 to install.

VoIP :
So let's say I get everything working. Now I want them to be able to make and receive calls. Do I just get a 021 DID number from http://www.connection-telecom.com/ (R90 a month), connect a VoIP phone to their router and away they go?

 

[rbarryza]

Will something like this work at the end-points?
http://www.dbg.co.za/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=92&products_id=224

 

[Nerfherder]

THis looks like a cool project... keep us posted with pictures !

 

[rbarryza]

If I actually get to doing this (depends on the final costs and if the parents will bite), I'll definitely put up a blog and a detailed howto. It's fun already, I'm learning a lot of new stuff, and that's my definition of fun.

 

[Gaz{M}]

The suggestion so far is a 30W panel and smallish battery. This will only be sustainable if every single day is bright and sunny. You need to design your solution for at least a week of grim, rainy weather.

From the datasheets, a routerboard will draw between 6-10W. So design for 10W. Over 24 hours you will need 10Wx24h = 240 Watt.Hours of power.

For 7 days, you need 7x240Wh = 1680 Watt.Hours. A single, large deep cycle 110Ah 12V battery gives you about 1320 Watt.Hours of power, almost meeting the requirement.

Now, to look at the solar panels:

A good rule of thumb is to install 6 times the wattage that is drawn by the device. This is because only about 8 hours a day in sunny weather gives you maximum power output from a solar panel. So the other 16 hours you need to draw from the battery. (So already you need 3 times the wattage drawn by the device to break even each day) To generate 1 full day of extra battery power per sunny day, you need another 3 times the wattage. This is how we arrive at 6 times.

6 x 10W = 60W. So at a minimum I would recommend 60W of solar panels.

These figures and recommendations are from reading some forums on solar installations. I would suggest you google for some similar projects as there is some very good advice out there.

But this is a very interesting project, so please keep us updated as I would love to do something similar!

 

[rbarryza]

Maybe I should look at wind power as well. That might reduce the requirements on battery life and therefore cost.

 

[Gaz{M}]

The battery is the 'cheap' part - About R1100 for a 110Ah deep cycle. The panels are about R300-R400 per 10W. I reckon you could still get near your R5k budget.

Wind power might give you some addition power since it is usually windy when it is rainy especially on mountain sides. A Wind turbine on ebay is around R700 for a small 40W unit, but you need at least 13 km/h winds to get a meaningful amount of power out of it.