Afrihost Business Uncapped Feedback

[AfriMan]

I hear you, but wasn't there some discount passed on to Afrihost and other ISPs from Telkom that we were supposed to get as well? No sign of these "discounts" yet either..

Remember that we purchase from MTN - so we didn't automatically receive discounts. So there was a period when we needed to confirm exactly how much would be passed onto us, and I can promise that every cent was passed on via Capped discounts. So when we run mystery bonuses and discounts - that's coming at our own costs, not out of profits.

We're actually pricing so close to our cost that it's crazy. But we believe in our clients and we know that whenever we put our faith in them, they always come through for us. We know that Uncapped clients didn't get a price reduction, but it's not a saving that was pocketed, because in real terms increased demand means we're paying more than ever for the bandwidth being used. But we're backing our clients again by adding more capacity and we believe our clients will have a better experience, get more bandwidth and value for their money and that will be better for us in the long run.

 

[jeanres]

Remember that we purchase from MTN - so we didn't automatically receive discounts. So there was a period when we needed to confirm exactly how much would be passed onto us, and I can promise that every cent was passed on via Capped discounts. So when we run mystery bonuses and discounts - that's coming at our own costs, not out of profits.

We're actually pricing so close to our cost that it's crazy. But we believe in our clients and we know that whenever we put our faith in them, they always come through for us. We know that Uncapped clients didn't get a price reduction, but it's not a saving that was pocketed, because in real terms increased demand means we're paying more than ever for the bandwidth being used. But we're backing our clients again by adding more capacity and we believe our clients will have a better experience, get more bandwidth and value for their money and that will be better for us in the long run.

I don't mind paying what I am paying now, I just want the damn service to work, or get a refund for the time it does not work

 

[Type RSA]

Remember that we purchase from MTN - so we didn't automatically receive discounts. So there was a period when we needed to confirm exactly how much would be passed onto us, and I can promise that every cent was passed on via Capped discounts. So when we run mystery bonuses and discounts - that's coming at our own costs, not out of profits.

We're actually pricing so close to our cost that it's crazy. But we believe in our clients and we know that whenever we put our faith in them, they always come through for us. We know that Uncapped clients didn't get a price reduction, but it's not a saving that was pocketed, because in real terms increased demand means we're paying more than ever for the bandwidth being used. But we're backing our clients again by adding more capacity and we believe our clients will have a better experience, get more bandwidth and value for their money and that will be better for us in the long run.

No worries, I just remember an article on MyBB a while back about the savings being passed on to clients. Just saying

 

[Looney]

I think you do misunderstand. Nothing about my job is damage control. I'm here to talk to our clients and listen to what they're saying and answer from a company perspective. Sometimes that means saying "We screwed up, and I'm sorry". Other times it't about explaining the complexity of events that lead up to an incident or a decision. My job is to try to communicate what's happening in our minds so that we reach some kind of understanding. I'm not a spin doctor, I'm not a marketer. In fact, I think it's because I never learned how to lie convincingly that Gian asked me to do this job

Trust goes both ways. You also need to show faith in us that we're a) doing everything possible to resolve the problem and are sincere when we say that; and b) that we're going to find a way that makes sense to us and you to show you that we value you as a client. Everyone digging their heels in doesn't take anyone forward. Only open interactions, transparency and trust will get us forward and onto the next milestone - which is important to all of us. As we grow, we've always passed those benefits to our clients first, and we won't ever stop doing that.

Ok lets dissect this a little shall we?

1) I have never heard not once "We screwed up, I'm sorry" coming from Afrihost. It has always been, "Telkom...Flux-Capacitor..."

2) Would that have been the case, then I as a customer would expect the following, "We are sorry, we screwed up. Can we make it up to you by giving you a discount for the next month?"

3) You are certainly correct, trust goes both ways. However, I am continuing to pay my monthly fee of R700pm for my account even though it sucks. I haven't moved (just yet), I am "waiting it out" and showing "faith" in Afrihost. There is nothing more that you need from me in order to trust me. You are getting my R700pm and I am stilll being loyal. My trust is not in question.

 

[Wackyza]

I have to agree. When ppl are shaped 75% or 90% of their line speed that means the service is basically dead in the water. No point in charging someone money for something like this.

Even Telkom has a thing called 'Service interruption discount' on their invoice, where they discount your monthly invoice with a pro-rata amount based on how much the line was down. And I have to give them credit here, because u dont even need to ask them for it. They calculate this themselves.

I don't see why other service providers cant do the same.

I don't mind paying what I am paying now, I just want the damn service to work, or get a refund for the time it does not work

 

[Gatecrasher]

To summarize why business clients are aggrieved (particularly here in the South):

1) Telkom cut IPC wholesale prices.

2) Most ISPs including Afrihost promised to pass these benefits onto their customers, either in the form of price cuts or added value.

3) Afrihost awarded double your cap (to unbundled capped clients) and mystery bonuses (to bundled capped clients) and promised to relax further the shaping of regular uncapped clients.

4) No benefits were awarded to, or announced for Business Uncapped clients.

5) A further effect of (3) is that a lack of IPC capacity has further impacted and degraded the business uncapped service.

6) The result is that not only have business clients received no benefit from IPC prices cuts, but their service has been severely degraded as a result. Its a double whammy.

No amount of communicating "Afrihost business values" is going to suffice here. Actions always speaks louder than words. It is time for Afrihost to take action.

 

[AfriMan]

Ok lets dissect this a little shall we?

1) I have never heard not once "We screwed up, I'm sorry" coming from Afrihost. It has always been, "Telkom...Flux-Capacitor..."

2) Would that have been the case, then I as a customer would expect the following, "We are sorry, we screwed up. Can we make it up to you by giving you a discount for the next month?"

3) You are certainly correct, trust goes both ways. However, I am continuing to pay my monthly fee of R700pm for my account even though it sucks. I haven't moved (just yet), I am "waiting it out" and showing "faith" in Afrihost. There is nothing more that you need from me in order to trust me. You are getting my R700pm and I am stilll being loyal. My trust is not in question.

I can work with this

I know that this has been an open discussion since last year, and I honestly don't believe we could have done anything different here. We ordered capacity well in advance of clients experiencing this level of contention, we received some before the end of the year, and the balance was due early in the New Year. No-one could have predicted that we'd wait going on six months - but we're now seeing reports of other ISPs having similar problems with IPC orders.

The question of trust is still valid, I think. Right now we're in a poor position, but we're giving you all the information we have, we're giving you all the options if front of us, and it doesn't seem like you're happy with this or that you trust the information you're receiving. The fact that you're paying us and not moving is definitely not insignificant, but it seems like you're doing so begrudgingly at this stage, and thats something we need to work on. If we can improve our relationship and build that trust between us, then I think it would be more assuring to you to know that a company you trust is doing everything that they can to address and issue, and that they will make sure that what you have suffered is not ignored - even if you don't have to ask or complain about.

I dunno, am I kinda making sense here?

 

[AfriMan]

To summarize why business clients are aggrieved (particularly here in the South):

1) Telkom cut IPC wholesale prices.

2) Most ISPs including Afrihost promised to pass these benefits onto their customers, either in the form of price cuts or added value.

3) Afrihost awarded double your cap (to unbundled capped clients) and mystery bonuses (to bundled capped clients) and promised to relax further the shaping of regular uncapped clients.

4) No benefits were awarded to, or announced for Business Uncapped clients.

5) A further effect of (3) is that a lack of IPC capacity has further impacted and degraded the business uncapped service.

6) The result is that not only have business clients received no benefit from IPC prices cuts, but their service has been severely degraded as a result. Its a double whammy.

No amount of communicating "Afrihost business values" is going to suffice here. Actions always speaks louder than words. It is time for Afrihost to take action.

I hear what you are saying. Value was definitely promised in the form of increased network capacity, once we confirmed the amount of saving which would be passed onto us - but that is an additional capacity order which we placed this year.

I also think you're talking about Business accounts as a whole, but it's specifically users in the South (cape) where this is an issue. To my knowledge Business as a product is still performing well in areas where there is less demand on the available network resources.

At the moment, action is not within our purview. We've already committed the financial resources to the network upgrades we've promised, so that action is underway. Until Telkom lights up that capacity our hands are tied. It's not the ideal answer, but it the truth and the transparent answer.

So what's left? Assuring you that our values as a company mean that we're not lying, we're not running away from our commitment to our clients, and we're going to continue to communicate and interact with our clients through this problem until it gets resolved. I think it's very important at times like this to realise that we as a company share the same goals as our clients. Becuase to say that we're ripping off clients, stealing their money, ignoring their experiences and the like is to essentially say that our values are not aligned. That's not the case here

 

[Chevron]

To summarize why business clients are aggrieved (particularly here in the South):

1) Telkom cut IPC wholesale prices.

2) Most ISPs including Afrihost promised to pass these benefits onto their customers, either in the form of price cuts or added value.

3) Afrihost awarded double your cap (to unbundled capped clients) and mystery bonuses (to bundled capped clients) and promised to relax further the shaping of regular uncapped clients.

4) No benefits were awarded to, or announced for Business Uncapped clients.

5) A further effect of (3) is that a lack of IPC capacity has further impacted and degraded the business uncapped service.

6) The result is that not only have business clients received no benefit from IPC prices cuts, but their service has been severely degraded as a result. Its a double whammy.

No amount of communicating "Afrihost business values" is going to suffice here. Actions always speaks louder than words. It is time for Afrihost to take action.

Just on your points 1 and 2. AH already have the cheapest business accounts in the country. Without throttling either. Till now of course. Dropping price further would be counter productive.

 

[Mypro-D]

I cancelled my account.
I will be back once everything is up and running again as I really do enjoy Afrihost but I cannot pay full price for something that only works at 1/4.

So, I have left for now. BUT, if on the 10th or the 11th or whenever everything is back up to scratch. I will be back.

 

[AfriMan]

I have to agree. When ppl are shaped 75% or 90% of their line speed that means the service is basically dead in the water. No point in charging someone money for something like this.

Even Telkom has a thing called 'Service interruption discount' on their invoice, where they discount your monthly invoice with a pro-rata amount based on how much the line was down. And I have to give them credit here, because u dont even need to ask them for it. They calculate this themselves.

I don't see why other service providers cant do the same.

On lines, Telkom discount clients directly, we essentially continue to pay for those lines whether they are operational or not until the client either moves away or cancels.

We do try to do what we feel is fair and reasonable for our clients, given then nature of what they experience and the degree that this is in our control to do so. In terms of blanket policy this is a management decision, and I trust our management team that they do so in line with our core values, and I will support whatever decision they make 100%. I have seen time and time again that when we make a mistake, or our clients suffer for one reason or another, that we always find a way to uplift our client's experience in one way or another. I know that this has been a trying period, but I'm asking that you trust us that we will continue to do so - as we have always done in the past.

 

[pXius]

Aside from other issues I've posted in this thread and in the meantime resolved without the help thereof;

Here's my issue, I pmed Afriman on
22-03-2014
11:21 PM

And have to this day not received a reply.

For the last 3 months I've been experiencing HORRIBLE p2p traffic and live streaming, spending hours with Afrihost and Telkom on the phone. Eventually I got to talk to a techie with half a brain which noticed shaping policies we're being enforced on my business line. Even though it did not show it client zone. No explanation as to how it happened. Shaping policies removed and line is back to full speed. Aside from the horrible latencies.

Payed 3 months worth business prices for home dsl. Awesome.


Another problem I have is a separate line a transferred to Afrihost from Telkom. I've done this 3 times with this specific line and every time Afrihost says they can't get the line as its being managed by another ISP. (It has only EVER been managed by Telkom). Telkom can now clearly see that the line is now being managed by a 3rd party ISP on their system. According to Afrihost its not them, however a few days ago I got hold a an Afrihost techie whom could see that the line IS indeed managed by Afrihost, he could even recreate my port and stabilize my line, however it doesn't show on my "client profile" as I understand nor my Clientzone.

Unfortunately I got cut off before we could discuss a solution to the problem any further, I call back and end up with a new person swearing on their grave that Afrihost does not manage the line, regardless of me explaining that it doesn't show on the default client profile, but does show on whatever database the other techie was referring to.

I'm tired of spending hours on hold trying to resolve issues. I've even resorted to the forum here without any feedback.

I'm sure Afrihost has many happy customers, I used to be one of them, but it seems that when things start to go wrong you're left dead in the water. This is my last month with AH, hoping to join an ISP with actual customer support.

 

[Gatecrasher]

I hear what you are saying. Value was definitely promised in the form of increased network capacity, once we confirmed the amount of saving which would be passed onto us - but that is an additional capacity order which we placed this year.

But Business Uncapped is an unshaped service, so additional network capacity is not an added benefit at all. It is an expectation that sufficient capacity already exists (or you should not be selling these accounts). So additional value was not promised to Business Uncapped clients at all. It was only offered to capped and regular uncapped clients only.

 

[Looney]

I can work with this

I know that this has been an open discussion since last year, and I honestly don't believe we could have done anything different here. We ordered capacity well in advance of clients experiencing this level of contention, we received some before the end of the year, and the balance was due early in the New Year. No-one could have predicted that we'd wait going on six months - but we're now seeing reports of other ISPs having similar problems with IPC orders.

The question of trust is still valid, I think. Right now we're in a poor position, but we're giving you all the information we have, we're giving you all the options if front of us, and it doesn't seem like you're happy with this or that you trust the information you're receiving. The fact that you're paying us and not moving is definitely not insignificant, but it seems like you're doing so begrudgingly at this stage, and thats something we need to work on. If we can improve our relationship and build that trust between us, then I think it would be more assuring to you to know that a company you trust is doing everything that they can to address and issue, and that they will make sure that what you have suffered is not ignored - even if you don't have to ask or complain about.

I dunno, am I kinda making sense here?

No, not really and heres why:

1) I can understand that the issues Afrihost is facing now was completely unpredictable. I am not questioning this.

2) Telling us "We're waiting for Telkom.... Flux-Capacitor delayed...." is not good enough I am sorry to say. As said earlier, actions speak louder than words. I appreciate that you are being open and honest and passing all the info you have to us, believe me I do. Unfortunately for you, I don't care what the issues are, I just want to get my monies worth, thats all.

3) I along with every other loyal customer expects to be compensated for the level of service we have received lately. It's THAT simple.

4) I along with every other business customer are paying a lot of money for our accounts, and we happily do this because we expect to get the performance.

5) Of course I am not happy with the options you are giving me, you have only given me 1 option and that is, "wait it out". That is not an appropriate response.

6) I am not paying you begrudgingly, I am paying because when your accounts work, they work fantastically and its exactly what I want from my account.

7) When your network fails and I have lost out on R700 for an account that cannot even browse or stream, I expect to be compensated.

It's really THAT simple.

 

[AfriMan]

No, not really and heres why:

1) I can understand that the issues Afrihost is facing now was completely unpredictable. I am not questioning this.

2) Telling us "We're waiting for Telkom.... Flux-Capacitor delayed...." is not good enough I am sorry to say. As said earlier, actions speak louder than words. I appreciate that you are being open and honest and passing all the info you have to us, believe me I do. Unfortunately for you, I don't care what the issues are, I just want to get my monies worth, thats all.

3) I along with every other loyal customer expects to be compensated for the level of service we have received lately. It's THAT simple.

4) I along with every other business customer are paying a lot of money for our accounts, and we happily do this because we expect to get the performance.

5) Of course I am not happy with the options you are giving me, you have only given me 1 option and that is, "wait it out". That is not an appropriate response.

6) I am not paying you begrudgingly, I am paying because when your accounts work, they work fantastically and its exactly what I want from my account.

7) When your network fails and I have lost out on R700 for an account that cannot even browse or stream, I expect to be compensated.

It's really THAT simple.

I think the first issue is that you seem to be speaking on behalf of all Business clients, and that's not necessary the case. Some business clients are still reporting good speeds, even in the South.

OK, I am willing to listen to what you suggest is the better course of action - assuming you have the same resource constraints that we are working within. How would you solve this, or communicate this to our clients? I'm happy to look at what options you see in this case

 

[jeanres]

I hear what you are saying. Value was definitely promised in the form of increased network capacity, once we confirmed the amount of saving which would be passed onto us - but that is an additional capacity order which we placed this year.

I also think you're talking about Business accounts as a whole, but it's specifically users in the South (cape) where this is an issue. To my knowledge Business as a product is still performing well in areas where there is less demand on the available network resources.

At the moment, action is not within our purview. We've already committed the financial resources to the network upgrades we've promised, so that action is underway. Until Telkom lights up that capacity our hands are tied. It's not the ideal answer, but it the truth and the transparent answer.

So what's left? Assuring you that our values as a company mean that we're not lying, we're not running away from our commitment to our clients, and we're going to continue to communicate and interact with our clients through this problem until it gets resolved. I think it's very important at times like this to realise that we as a company share the same goals as our clients. Becuase to say that we're ripping off clients, stealing their money, ignoring their experiences and the like is to essentially say that our values are not aligned. That's not the case here

And yet again you are saying FU to your clients, we pay you, you give shocking service and not once did we get a "we are so sorry that we messed up" from you or any of the execs.

We are showing faith by fighting this and not just mass canceling. We have done our part.

We know that you guys are growing and need more capacity and staff, but why is this at the expense of your clients?

You say that you have your clients best interest in mind? Hell dude I am not seeing that, all I am seeing is you saying that you need capacity and then all will good.

It's like buying a car, that breaks down all the time, would you take a long trip in it? Not a moer, I don't want to be stuck in the Karoo at night because it broke down again. This is a common fault of Afrihost.

When you launched mobile data, the call center went belly up.

When you launched mystery bonuses and double bandwidth, your experience went belly up

I did not sign up for this, I signed up for a service that works, I am not getting that.

 

[jeanres]

I think the first issue is that you seem to be speaking on behalf of all Business clients, and that's not necessary the case. Some business clients are still reporting good speeds, even in the South.

OK, I am willing to listen to what you suggest is the better course of action - assuming you have the same resource constraints that we are working within. How would you solve this, or communicate this to our clients? I'm happy to look at what options you see in this case

Seeing as you are giving everyone double bandwidth and so on, why not give your business customers 50% discount? I would be happy with that

 

[AfriMan]

But Business Uncapped is an unshaped service, so additional network capacity is not an added benefit at all. It is an expectation that sufficient capacity already exists (or you should not be selling these accounts). So additional value was not promised to Business Uncapped clients at all. It was only offered to capped and regular uncapped clients only.

Additional network capacity is always a benefit. It may be less obvious than in other instances, but there is definitely a smoother experience when there is less contention, even between Capped and Business accounts.

I do see your point however, and this is definitely something I can take to management to review on their side.

 

[Looney]

You know what, you are right. I am speaking on behalf of every business customer. Whether they get the service they pay for or not, the principle still applies. Do yourself a favor and ask all your customers who have had terrible service if they want to be compensated. Then come back and tell me what the result was.

It is not my job to tell you how to do yours. I am the paying customer telling you what I (the paying customer) wants and expects.

 

[AfriMan]

Aside from other issues I've posted in this thread and in the meantime resolved without the help thereof;

Here's my issue, I pmed Afriman on
22-03-2014
11:21 PM

And have to this day not received a reply.

For the last 3 months I've been experiencing HORRIBLE p2p traffic and live streaming, spending hours with Afrihost and Telkom on the phone. Eventually I got to talk to a techie with half a brain which noticed shaping policies we're being enforced on my business line. Even though it did not show it client zone. No explanation as to how it happened. Shaping policies removed and line is back to full speed. Aside from the horrible latencies.

Payed 3 months worth business prices for home dsl. Awesome.


Another problem I have is a separate line a transferred to Afrihost from Telkom. I've done this 3 times with this specific line and every time Afrihost says they can't get the line as its being managed by another ISP. (It has only EVER been managed by Telkom). Telkom can now clearly see that the line is now being managed by a 3rd party ISP on their system. According to Afrihost its not them, however a few days ago I got hold a an Afrihost techie whom could see that the line IS indeed managed by Afrihost, he could even recreate my port and stabilize my line, however it doesn't show on my "client profile" as I understand nor my Clientzone.

Unfortunately I got cut off before we could discuss a solution to the problem any further, I call back and end up with a new person swearing on their grave that Afrihost does not manage the line, regardless of me explaining that it doesn't show on the default client profile, but does show on whatever database the other techie was referring to.

I'm tired of spending hours on hold trying to resolve issues. I've even resorted to the forum here without any feedback.

I'm sure Afrihost has many happy customers, I used to be one of them, but it seems that when things start to go wrong you're left dead in the water. This is my last month with AH, hoping to join an ISP with actual customer support.

Sorry to hear this is not going well. I must say that I've never received a PM from you - so dunno if you meant AfriGuy or another Afrihost account (there are some old ones for old Afrihost reps that have come and gone).

Please drop me a PM with details so I can get some action on this for you