Afrihost Uncapped ADSL Feedback

[kissingmybbgoodbye]

It's most likely more IP related, we'll need to get the IP you are being assigned and find out why the solution we put in place is not working. Please PM all the details (or email to [email protected]) with your username and I'll see what I can find out in the morning.

@afriman I emailed the details as requested, all though I got it working now by using an international proxy so I just tricked microsoft that i am in the US

P.S. The default answer from your support seems to be The issue has been resolved it must be an issue on your individual PC (which they told me a few times). Well clearly if I got it to working through an international proxy it is definitely not my pc. I don't like it when supports acts like i am stupid (I have over 24 years IT support behind my name so I guess I know a thing or two)

 

[Timber_MG]

I can understand that you are frustrated and from a client perspective, I don't blame you. But this is not a case of us saying "we've got enough money and clients, so take what you can get" - we are genuinely dedicated to getting everyone the excellent experience the network is capable of. I have several emails and comments from clients saying this has worked out excellent for them. And I only mention that to show that MTN is capable and we are willing and determined, and we are confident that we will get the results that we want and expect.

Afriman, responding with PR to real technical concerns does not make for a sincere response in the network performance over the last months. It is outright deception of your customer base.

State contention ratios at various points in your network or similar detail, but for QoS tweaking you'd expect high latency and perhaps some speed issues, but not 1/8th to 1/5th of the claimed speeds for very low usage customers like myself.

 

[AfriMan]

Afriman, responding with PR to real technical concerns does not make for a sincere response in the network performance over the last months. It is outright deception of your customer base.

State contention ratios at various points in your network or similar detail, but for QoS tweaking you'd expect high latency and perhaps some speed issues, but not 1/8th to 1/5th of the claimed speeds for very low usage customers like myself.

That is your opinion, which are entitled to. I don't describe our service in terms of contention ratios, because those statistics cannot really be substantiated, in my opinion. There are many variables including when a session was started, what protocols are being run, what is the backhaul limitation in that area from Telkom's infrastructure that determines who gets better service. To claim outright deception implies that you have facts which are being contradicted, and this is simply not the case. If I were throwing around phrases like "best effort service", I would understand your comments, but I am being as forthcoming and specific as I can be given the information that I have.

Use / Don't Use

 

[prodigyX]

@Afriman

I'm a 10mb uncapped client, and am naturally experiencing the slow speeds everyone is on about. Luckily I am one of the more patient ones, and am not throwing my toys out the cot too much yet. I understand that the new network will take time to be 100% optimized, and until then we'll just have to sit tight while you guys tweak.

Just something to think about though: If you guys were to, say, refund 10mb uncapped clients by 50% or so (or heck, ANY sort of financial gesture), I bet you'd get a LOT less public complaints and vloeking. The loss you'd sustain from one month's discount to uncapped users is SURELY better than damage you're taking from social media / the masses of people complaining (and having to have their comments deleted), and horror of horrors, jumping ship to another ISP, which is at the end of the day is costing you money anyway.

Option 1) "We're sorry you uncapped users are getting poor speeds, just hold on while we continue to tweak but still charge you full price" ----> Complaints and frustrations voiced all over facebook, twitter and mybroadband / users cancelling Afrihost accounts and moving to other ISPs

Option 2) "We're sorry you uncapped users are getting poor speeds. Here, let us give you guys X% off your invoice for Oct/Nov for being so patient" ---> FAR less public complaints, Afrihost's public image not so damaged, negligible amount of users jump ship

Use / Don't Use

 

[sand_man]

R496 axxess express mtn 10mb uncapped. I'm sorry but I don't get what the issue is. Whatever is broken needs to be fixed asap.

 

[kripstoe]

I'm not in favor if charging customers less. Better communication and quicker feedback to complaints. And plans + timelines going forward.

 

[AfriMan]

@Afriman

I'm a 10mb uncapped client, and am obviously experiencing the slow speeds everyone is on about. Luckily I am one of the more patient ones, and am not throwing my toys out the cot too much yet. I understand that the new network will take time to be 100% optimized, and until then we'll just have to sit tight while you guys tweak.

Just something to think about though: If you guys were to, say, refund 10mb uncapped clients by 50% or so (or heck, ANY sort of financial gesture), I bet you'd get a LOT less public complaints and vloeking. The loss you'd sustain from one month's discount to uncapped users is SURELY better than damage you're taking from social media the masses of people complaining (and having to have their comments deleted), and, horror of horrors, jumping ship to another ISP, which is at the end of the day is costing you money anyway.

Option 1) "We're sorry you uncapped users are getting poor speeds, just hold on while we continue to tweak but still charge you full price" ----> Complaints and frustrations voiced all over facebook, twitter and mybroadband / users cancelling Afrihost accounts and moving to other ISPs

Option 2) "We're sorry you uncapped users are getting poor speeds. Here, let us give you guys X% off your invoice for Oct/Nov for being so patient" ---> FAR less public complaints, Afrihost's public image not so damaged, negligible amount of users jump ship

Use / Don't Use

I understand where you're coming from, and unfortunately that is not within my authority to guarantee this. If the directors review the amount of complaints and severity thereof and decide to do so, I'll be the first to tell everyone and get this going.

On the subject of comments being deleted, this is my take. Our social media, and specifically our facebook page, is a marketing tool and base that we have painstakingly built through promotions and interactions. It's a device for our clients to talk to us, and for us to talk to them. It's not a forum for disgruntled clients to galvanise support or to harass those who follow us (as each wall post also appears in the news feed of those who follow us). Everyone has the right to start a thread here in MyBB, or post on HelloPeter, and we'll engage with you on that level. But to ask us to advertise your complaint for you seems a bit much, in my opinion. Having said that said, we do publish and respond to many direct complaints where client talk directly to us, and are asking for us to engage and assist them, and we are quite lenient even in this. But when people start to post expletives, how much better they feel another ISP is, personal insults to Gian or the team, or start directing their messages to all our users without actually trying or intending to engage, I fully support that those comments be removed, and if the persons persist, that they are banned from our page.

That's my personal opinion, I don't get to do any moderation here in MyBB. But again, the idea is to get your problem sorted out. Send me a PM, inbox the Facebook page, or Direct message on twitter, you'll get help and assistance very quickly. We've just setup some new support systems so that there is a faster turnaround time and more people dedicated to complaints. But if you're going to wall message (or even post here on MyBB) " Hey, everyone, Afrihost are a bunch *********s and let's all take them to court" - I'm just saying that's not the fastest route to getting helped and fixing the problem.

My opinion (No animals were harmed in the formation of this opinion)

 

[Timber_MG]

Afriman: You advertise a 10 meg service. You are deceiving the buying public by that simple fact based on the current performance for paying, non-abusive users. I am speaking of Afrihost as a brand and ISP, not you as their brand champion/whatever. I called for some more transparency. It's unfortunate that the DSL market doesn't provide that (a discussion that would touch on regulatory failure which is not the topic here)

If you throttle me, shape me based on an AUP or similar technical measure that is very fair (as long as it is also transparent), but I expect to see 10 meg speeds at least a fair portion of the time for browsing, downloads and intermittent activities, especially with the kind of usage that is well under what is considered fair. When significant time passes with speeds materially deficient (like 1-2 mbps on a 10 meg service) on numerous occasions then the service level fails materially and that is where promoting a 10 meg service is no longer acceptable with the levels of service you offer.

Regards

Martin

 

[AfriMan]

Afriman: You advertise a 10 meg service. You are deceiving the buying public by that simple fact based on the current performance for paying, non-abusive users. I am speaking of Afrihost as a brand and ISP, not you as their brand champion/whatever. I called for some more transparency. It's unfortunate that the DSL market doesn't provide that (a discussion that would touch on regulatory failure which is not the topic here)

If you throttle me, shape me based on an AUP or similar technical measure that is very fair (as long as it is also transparent), but I expect to see 10 meg speeds at least a fair portion of the time for browsing, downloads and intermittent activities, especially with the kind of usage that is well under what is considered fair. When significant time passes with speeds materially deficient (like 1-2 mbps on a 10 meg service) on numerous occasions then the service level fails materially and that is where promoting a 10 meg service is no longer acceptable with the levels of service you offer.

Regards

Martin

I understand what you're saying, but all our advertising says "up to XXMbps", specifically for the reason that speeds can never be guaranteed. We strive deliver as close to the speed tier label as possible, but 10Mbps itself could never be realistically achieved due to overheads on ADSL. Add Telkom infrastructure issues, technical issues locally and abroad, it would be foolish to make such claims or guarantees.

I hate talking like this, because it smacks of the "best effort" phrase I like to avoid like the plague. But that's the honest truth, and it's been tested at the NCC, ISPA and ASA by several ISP's in the past. We try and deliver the best service we can, we don't intentionally do things behind closed doors and say the opposite in public. If we say we're not throttling you but bandwidth contention is higher than usual, that's exactly what we mean, and we always strive to deliver the best performance and value within the constraints.

If you feel this is marketing or PR talk, well you are engaging with a rep, that's what I do

 

[JayM]

I can understand that you are frustrated and from a client perspective, I don't blame you. But this is not a case of us saying "we've got enough money and clients, so take what you can get" - we are genuinely dedicated to getting everyone the excellent experience the network is capable of. I have several emails and comments from clients saying this has worked out excellent for them. And I only mention that to show that MTN is capable and we are willing and determined, and we are confident that we will get the results that we want and expect.

I apologise for coming across a bit harsh, but I've just migrated 20 lines and accounts to Afrihost, and now it's not working even for a simple VPN connection to the office.

I have done some testing on a capped account and it looks much better. Is there any chance we can change from uncapped to a capped package of a similar price until this is fixed?

 

[AfriMan]

I apologise for coming across a bit harsh, but I've just migrated 20 lines and accounts to Afrihost, and now it's not working even for a simple VPN connection to the office.

I have done some testing on a capped account and it looks much better. Is there any chance we can change from uncapped to a capped package of a similar price until this is fixed?

Please PM me and I'll see what I can arrange ASAP.

 

[shadowfox]

I understand what you're saying, but all our advertising says "up to XXMbps", specifically for the reason that speeds can never be guaranteed. We strive deliver as close to the speed tier label as possible, but 10Mbps itself could never be realistically achieved due to overheads on ADSL. Add Telkom infrastructure issues, technical issues locally and abroad, it would be foolish to make such claims or guarantees.

I hate talking like this, because it smacks of the "best effort" phrase I like to avoid like the plague. But that's the honest truth, and it's been tested at the NCC, ISPA and ASA by several ISP's in the past. We try and deliver the best service we can, we don't intentionally do things behind closed doors and say the opposite in public. If we say we're not throttling you but bandwidth contention is higher than usual, that's exactly what we mean, and we always strive to deliver the best performance and value within the constraints.

If you feel this is marketing or PR talk, well you are engaging with a rep, that's what I do

The irony is - I experienced none of these issues prior to the move to the MTN network. And now I'm sitting with many of the same issues that I've seen reported here since the move - streaming performance is below sub-par, I'm getting half my actual line-speed (I've never expected 100% performance, but I expect at least 75 - 80%).

There will be glitches with every move - but I moved from WebAfrica to Afrihost - line included - 2 months ago because of the good things I was hearing - I'm now starting to regret that decision. If this isn't solved by the end of November, I'm moving back.

 

[Grep]

As a techi myself I can understand the pain AF is going through. The only difference is that as others have pointed out, is, we told you so. We warned you guys against MTN because many of us have to deal with MTNNS. AF kept reassuring us that it will be better than expected, unfortunately it is as expected. Anyways, off with the rant.

 

[leto]

On the subject of comments being deleted, this is my take. Our social media, and specifically our facebook page, is a marketing tool and base that we have painstakingly built through promotions and interactions. It's a device for our clients to talk to us, and for us to talk to them. It's not a forum for disgruntled clients to galvanise support or to harass those who follow us (as each wall post also appears in the news feed of those who follow us). Everyone has the right to start a thread here in MyBB, or post on HelloPeter, and we'll engage with you on that level. But to ask us to advertise your complaint for you seems a bit much, in my opinion. Having said that said, we do publish and respond to many direct complaints where client talk directly to us, and are asking for us to engage and assist them, and we are quite lenient even in this. But when people start to post expletives, how much better they feel another ISP is, personal insults to Gian or the team, or start directing their messages to all our users without actually trying or intending to engage, I fully support that those comments be removed, and if the persons persist, that they are banned from our page.

What I don't think you understand is, that some clients only go onto the facebook wall / hellopeter etc to complain after dealing directly with the support staff and getting absolutely no assistance or time-frame. My post was deleted for comparing my results with Afrihost to my results with mweb (which is an entirely fair comparison to make seeing as I have used both those networks, would you rather I fabricated results?). The onus is on afrihost to provide a better service than the competition, when you are failing to do so, the customer has every right to tell you. Furthermore, whoever is running your facebook page seems to be incapable of reading, as I have repeated stated that I have been in contact with the support staff and been told that they cannot assist, yet all I get as a response is to get in contact with the support staff. Surely you should expect comments of frustration when you treat customers that badly.

 

[AfriMan]

What I don't think you understand is, that some clients only go onto the facebook wall / hellopeter etc to complain after dealing directly with the support staff and getting absolutely no assistance or time-frame. My post was deleted for comparing my results with Afrihost to my results with mweb (which is an entirely fair comparison to make seeing as I have used both those networks, would you rather I fabricated results?). The onus is on afrihost to provide a better service than the competition, when you are failing to do so, the customer has every right to tell you. Furthermore, whoever is running your facebook page seems to be incapable of reading, as I have repeated stated that I have been in contact with the support staff and been told that they cannot assist, yet all I get as a response is to get in contact with the support staff. Surely you should expect comments of frustration when you treat customers that badly.

I'm not sure what you said in your comment, but there are some guidelines which I mentioned and saying another ISP gives better results just doesn't make sense to publish, as it open the door for all kinds of things. Some ISP's troll social media pages and post their results or offer trial accounts to clients making complaints, we just can't have that, especially when we have built our page up to the amount of followers through promotions and quality interactions. Even when it's the other way around and people say how much better we are than other ISP's, we remove the comment because we don't want to open that door (we do the same on our website BTW).

It sounds like your intentions we different, but as you can imagine, fielding queries and comments (and complaints) can be a tiring exercise, perhaps your post was misunderstood or misinterpreted. But again, if you want help or have an urgent query, send me a PM or inbox the Facebook page, you get a personal response and help ASAP. If the idea is to get help, that's the best way to do it. While 4 or 5 other unhappy clients (or ex-clients) may Like your post or even comment - the best and fastest way to resolve the problem is to engage with us, and our support staff are the channel to do so. I'm pretty sure the Facebook person was trying to be helpful and engage you as a client. He took time out on his Sunday afternoon to listen and hear that you are unhappy and do his best to help. Maybe look at it that way

 

[leto]

As I said in the facebook complaint, I am not going to chase after afrihost to ensure that I am satisfied. I have complained and spoken to the support staff directly (and as I said, the complaints only came after getting no assistance from the support staff) to no avail. The person running the facebook site made absolutely no effort to read or engage properly, as all I did was repeat myself for them to not understand. I know you are a rep, but repeatedly trying to spin it into a pro-afrihost light when they are very obviously in the wrong is rather demeaning to the customer and really bad PR (as it is so blatant).

 

[timmie23]

Seriously. 4Mbps yet I can't even stream the F1 race without it buffering every 10 seconds.
Absolutely pathetic. It's actually a joke. I don't know whether to laugh or cry.

 

[AfriMan]

As I said in the facebook complaint, I am not going to chase after afrihost to ensure that I am satisfied. I have complained and spoken to the support staff directly (and as I said, the complaints only came after getting no assistance from the support staff) to no avail. The person running the facebook site made absolutely no effort to read or engage properly, as all I did was repeat myself for them to not understand. I know you are a rep, but repeatedly trying to spin it into a pro-afrihost light when they are very obviously in the wrong is rather demeaning to the customer and really bad PR (as it is so blatant).

Communication goes two ways. Fact is someone was trying to help you.

 

[kissingmybbgoodbye]

Communication goes two ways. Fact is someone was trying to help you.

Just doesn't help if your support staff spins out the same answer all the time mainly trying to lay the blame on you as a customer and ignoring there is a problem

 

[leto]

No, that person was making no effort to help, as all they did was tell me to do what I had already expressed I had done. How is that remotely helpful? That is just blatant incompetence. I appreciate the fact that you work for afrihost, but really, this is an absolutely shocking way to deal with customers. If you cannot see that, this conversation is a waste time. At least the support staff was honest enough to say that there was nothing they could do, those handling the PR are being blatantly dishonest or are absolutely ignorant about the issues (but of course you are going to twist this into something pro-afrihost). Be honest, do you think it is acceptable for those handling PR to respond to the customers complaint without actually reading it properly? Please tell me how that helps anyone?