Apple falling behind ...

[[)roi(]]

What happened to "2." ?

LOL!

2... Fill in your own example of a typical Apple vs Android argument...

Or how about I add this one:
Apple according to some Android techies in this thread is losing ground due to it's ecosystem, yet this is contrary to market share? for example: in the last quarter they increased iphone US market share by 7% vs Samsung increase of 0.7%. Strangely contradictory?

Hence my conclusion... pointless!

 

[cerebus]

2... Fill in your own example of a typical Apple vs Android argument...

Or how about I add this one:
Apple according to some Android techies in this thread is losing ground due to it's ecosystem, yet this is contrary to market share? for example: in the last quarter they increased iphone US market share by 7% vs Samsung increase of 0.7%. Strangely contradictory?

Hence my conclusion... pointless!

I kind of think that the big picture is already coming into view of how the market will look over the next 5 years (roughly; it's impossible to crystal-ball it). It will be Android and iOS with a lot of back-and-forthing over marketshare and revenue but roughly static; and PERHAPS WP catching up to say 10% of the global share.

 

[BeVonk!]

Hence my conclusion... pointless!

Don't agree.

One learns much from these arguments on here. Strengths, weakness, etc of each brand/products/ecosystem/etc. I started this thread with three articles. Are the comments made by the three authors pointless? Is our discussion around what was written pointless? Is it pointless to go through a struggle to get something right using advice given here? I enjoy interacting with others here despite the friction/heat. Nothing pointless here. Can just as well close the forum using your argument.

 

[AlphaJohn]

I kind of think that the big picture is already coming into view of how the market will look over the next 5 years (roughly; it's impossible to crystal-ball it). It will be Android and iOS with a lot of back-and-forthing over marketshare and revenue but roughly static; and PERHAPS WP catching up to say 10% of the global share.

Call me optimistic but I do believe that Windows Phone will pick up a lot more than just 10%.

For one it needs a lot less spec wise than Android to run so it might come in handy at the bottom range, Also it unique in the sense that its the only phone that comes with document editing as part of the base. Its got a blend from both iOS and Android worlds to fill the middle gap. Then there is the new UI that people would learn to recognize, the only thing I do think Microsoft did wrong was FORCE people onto ModernUI on the desktops.

 

[[)roi(]]

... And while I'm at it, let me pick up on the S4 and Samsung Ads in general:

My summary of the new Samsung S4 Ad

1. Take photos... Don't all phones do this?
2. Swipe to answer... A vital feature? Would you really replace your S3 for this?
3. NFC share... How often is this used, daily, weekly, monthly vs. Whatsapp, email, facebook, twitter ...
4. Non touch message review (camera) -- another vital feature?
5. Control TV via Infrared? Wow...., oh but wait, Samsung isn't the 1st phone to offer Infrared functionality (my palm OS phone had this?) ...and don't forget they provide something similar via an iOS App for their Samsung smart TVs?

Hence I find the comment a little out of place from a "techie"... Surely Samsung's target for this Ad is the community at large i.e. those who don't know any better.

The overall sentiment I believe they are trying to convey is that: Samsung phones are so much "cooler" than Apple's phones. I'm personally kinda skeptical when a supplier visibly tries so hard to slate it's competitors.

Consider that Apple did the same with it's Mac vs PC campaign (although occasionally amusing, it wasn't statistically shown to be a great success for Apple)

Samsung I believe have gained more in market share through device design than it can quantify in the billions it has spent on advertising.

For what other reason has Apple decided to not compete with advertising. It's certainly not for cash reasons.

 

[AlphaJohn]

... And while I'm at it, let me pick up on the S4 and Samsung Ads in general:

My summary of the new Samsung S4 Ad

1. Take photos... Don't all phones do this?
2. Swipe to answer... A vital feature? Would you really replace your S3 for this?
3. NFC share... How often is this used, daily, weekly, monthly vs. Whatsapp, email, facebook, twitter ...
4. Non touch message review (camera) -- another vital feature?
5. Control TV via Infrared? Wow...., oh but wait, Samsung isn't the 1st phone to offer Infrared functionality (my palm OS phone had this?) ...and don't forget they provide something similar via an iOS App for their Samsung smart TVs?

Hence I find the comment a little out of place from a "techie"... Surely Samsung's target for this Ad is the community at large i.e. those who don't know any better.

The overall sentiment I believe they are trying to convey is that: Samsung phones are so much "cooler" than Apple's phones. I'm personally kinda skeptical when a supplier visibly tries so hard to slate it's competitors.

Consider that Apple did the same with it's Mac vs PC campaign (although occasionally amusing, it wasn't statistically shown to be a great success for Apple)

Samsung I believe have gained more in market share through device design than it can quantify in the billions it has spent on advertising.

For what other reason has Apple decided to not compete with advertising. It's certainly not for cash reasons.

Been to the US lately?

Everywhere you look its Apple this and iPhone that. I do not think anyone can come close to match Apple's marketing account.

edit: seems I am mistaking http://appleinsider.com/articles/13...e-on-2012-phone-ads-increased-budget-fivefold
did not see this reflect on my recent trip to NY. Samsung must be doing it wrong?



Guess it has to do with the fact that Samsung only "now" started marketing the crap out of their phones while Apple been a big spender for a couple of years. In US the word Smartphone is synonymous with iPhone in people's minds so you do not say "Its a Smartphone", more like "Its similar to an iPhone"

 

[[)roi(]]

I kind of think that the big picture is already coming into view of how the market will look over the next 5 years (roughly; it's impossible to crystal-ball it). It will be Android and iOS with a lot of back-and-forthing over marketshare and revenue but roughly static; and PERHAPS WP catching up to say 10% of the global share.

You've hit the nail on the head (current market share reflects the stalemate)...

Stalwarts will typically remain firm, with some ebb and flow in the community at large. To undo this we'd need a catalytic event (something like the iPhone in 2007 and iPad in 2010)

At best adding motion detection, facial recognition, bigger/more processors, ... can only serve to maintain market share or stimulate the constant ebb and flow.

 

[[)roi(]]

Been to the US lately?

Everywhere you look its Apple this and iPhone that. I do not think anyone can come close to match Apple's marketing account.

edit: seems I am mistaking http://appleinsider.com/articles/13...e-on-2012-phone-ads-increased-budget-fivefold
did not see this reflect on my recent trip to NY. Samsung must be doing it wrong?

Yes, last week in fact...

To reiterate, my point is; this forum at times leans heavily towards either camp due to the saturation of techies; much of the arguments are pointless i.e. opinions are representative of a very minor group.

 

[[)roi(]]

Call me optimistic but I do believe that Windows Phone will pick up a lot more than just 10%.

For one it needs a lot less spec wise than Android to run so it might come in handy at the bottom range, Also it unique in the sense that its the only phone that comes with document editing as part of the base. Its got a blend from both iOS and Android worlds to fill the middle gap. Then there is the new UI that people would learn to recognize, the only thing I do think Microsoft did wrong was FORCE people onto ModernUI on the desktops.

Agreed...Yet in practice...It's difficult for most to stay neutral; these threads are often derailed by senseless (pointless) arguments over who thinks who is better.

Surely it should be enough to state the reasons you prefer the other, share experiences, provide tips and tricks, ... and then ultimately leave it up the reader to decide.

Funny how many of these innocent threads, tend to derail into an aggressive push of opinions, of who is perfect, most innovative, ...

And often aggressive to the point of trying to belittle those with whom their opinions differ.

It's that which I find pointless.

 

[BeVonk!]

Funny how many of these innocent threads, tend to derail into an aggressive push of opinions, of who is perfect, most innovative, ...

And often aggressive to the point of trying to belittle those with whom their opinions differ.

It's that which I find pointless.

True in many cases, but I don't really see that in this thread. I thought this thread was quite civilised. Or am I missing something?

To techies/geeks/whatever arguing about Apple vs Android is like others arguing about the Bulls vs the Sharks or Mercedes vs BMW, etc. Different strokes for different folks. No harm done. I've been called names, but I don't care about that ... it's just part of the whole thing. People get excited and worked up and say stupid things at times, but that in context is not something to make an issue of. Yes it may be pointless, but so is filling in a sudoko puzzle that will win you no prizes, or reading a story book, and move on to the next one when done. There is a lot to learn from most of these debates, despite the negative elements that may surface. Just how I see it.

 

[BeVonk!]

It is very useful and insightful when forumites go hunting for evidence on the web and come up with infographics and facts to defend/promote their arguments. I see it as more positive than negative.

 

[GreyBush]

True in many cases, but I don't really see that in this thread. I thought this thread was quite civilised. Or am I missing something?

To techies/geeks/whatever arguing about Apple vs Android is like others arguing about the Bulls vs the Sharks or Mercedes vs BMW, etc. Different strokes for different folks. No harm done. I've been called names, but I don't care about that ... it's just part of the whole thing. People get excited and worked up and say stupid things at times, but that in context is not something to make an issue of. Yes it may be pointless, but so is filling in a sudoko puzzle that will win you no prizes, or reading a story book, and move on to the next one when done. There is a lot to learn from most of these debates, despite the negative elements that may surface. Just how I see it.

Arguing about apple on a tech forum is like arguing about the sharks in a Pretoria sports pub.

 

[zippy]

BeVonk, stop whining. Nobody is forcing you to use Apple products. If it doesn't work for you use Android.

Btw, neither IOS or Android can make popcorn.

 

[BeVonk!]

BeVonk, stop whining. Nobody is forcing you to use Apple products. If it doesn't work for you use Android.

Btw, neither IOS or Android can make popcorn.

And nobody forced you to read my comments, but you did. If my comments don't work for you go read somewhere else. And when you do feel like typing something please feel free to actually contribute something worth reading instead of doing drive-by shootings.

 

[[)roi(]]

True in many cases, but I don't really see that in this thread. I thought this thread was quite civilised. Or am I missing something?

To techies/geeks/whatever arguing about Apple vs Android is like others arguing about the Bulls vs the Sharks or Mercedes vs BMW, etc. Different strokes for different folks. No harm done. I've been called names, but I don't care about that ... it's just part of the whole thing. People get excited and worked up and say stupid things at times, but that in context is not something to make an issue of. Yes it may be pointless, but so is filling in a sudoko puzzle that will win you no prizes, or reading a story book, and move on to the next one when done. There is a lot to learn from most of these debates, despite the negative elements that may surface. Just how I see it.

Was IMO a little more slanted to Android...

My synopsis; the market share clearly shows that there is not only 1 solution fitting within this new paradigm; so if Apple doesn't float your boat, then Android might be the solution, or what about Microsoft, etc...

For those that prefer to not have to compromise software functionality you still can't beat a desktop computer... Of course each solution does come with it's own set of compromises (weight, battery, performance, functionality, etc...); so do some research and pick the one you can live with.

Personally I find a combination of these tend to best suit my workflow... Integration between these still sucks, but it's getting better with each OS iteration.

 

[BruceA]

BeVonk!, I think your problem with file syncing on iOS comes from the fact that Apple has deigned iOS assuming everyone has access to Wi-Fi, as is the case for most people in the US. Ironically, I use many Google services, and rely on Google Drive for file access. While on-line it is easy to specify which files you want to have off-line access to, and for most people this would suffice.

In my opinion, the new era of mobile technology requires Wi-Fi and 3G/LTE access. Every time one of my friends asks me about whether I would recommend an iPad, my first reaction is "do you have Wi-Fi at home?", otherwise they must pay the extra for the cellular version, and expect a heavy data bill! These aren't issues in most First World countries, but if we South Africans want to play with First World toys we have to understand the limitations.

 

[AlphaJohn]

BeVonk!, I think your problem with file syncing on iOS comes from the fact that Apple has deigned iOS assuming everyone has access to Wi-Fi, as is the case for most people in the US. Ironically, I use many Google services, and rely on Google Drive for file access. While on-line it is easy to specify which files you want to have off-line access to, and for most people this would suffice.

In my opinion, the new era of mobile technology requires Wi-Fi and 3G/LTE access. Every time one of my friends asks me about whether I would recommend an iPad, my first reaction is "do you have Wi-Fi at home?", otherwise they must pay the extra for the cellular version, and expect a heavy data bill! These aren't issues in most First World countries, but if we South Africans want to play with First World toys we have to understand the limitations.

This is what boggle's my mind, and Apple is not the only one guilty of this, Microsoft and Google has it to.

People just assume 1st world countries have unmetered, unlimited always on Data. Not so, well not for the entire country. If you in a city yeah cool chances are that you will have access to 3G/LTE or some WiFi hotspot, and even then not all of them where uncapped. My Hotel WiFi connection for example in Michigan was metered and I lost signal in most parts of Chicago, and lets not even talk about the drive down to New York. Always on is a dream world that only people in big Cities enjoy in either 1st or Developing world. Developing world its just a little more scarce.

 

[greg0205]

Relevant... Not sure, and I'm pretty sure most will have seen it by now but this was posted in the Lumina thread. Pokes fun at our fighting but also, you'll notice that only two people in the room have Nokia phones so pretty accurate in that respect IMO.

[video=youtube;0-U4Yr9UNBo]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0-U4Yr9UNBo[/video]

 

[BruceA]

This is what boggle's my mind, and Apple is not the only one guilty of this, Microsoft and Google has it to.

People just assume 1st world countries have unmetered, unlimited always on Data. Not so, well not for the entire country. If you in a city yeah cool chances are that you will have access to 3G/LTE or some WiFi hotspot, and even then not all of them where uncapped. My Hotel WiFi connection for example in Michigan was metered and I lost signal in most parts of Chicago, and lets not even talk about the drive down to New York. Always on is a dream world that only people in big Cities enjoy in either 1st or Developing world. Developing world its just a little more scarce.

Regarding 3G/LTE, I agree, and that is why the original AT&T contract (unlimited data) for the iPhone was such a brilliant move by Apple. It allowed people to have access to all the new features without having to worry about data usage. However, as you point out, this is no longer the case, and we are now starting to see apps that offer the option to only sync over Wi-Fi, for example.

However, with cable access, most people in urban areas in the US have unlimited access to Wi-Fi at home, with speeds in the 5-15 Mbps range. Away from home access is not as great though, as you say.

 

[BruceA]

Relevant... Not sure, and I'm pretty sure most will have seen it by now but this was posted in the Lumina thread. Pokes fun at our fighting but also, you'll notice that only two people in the room have Nokia phones so pretty accurate in that respect IMO.

[video=youtube;0-U4Yr9UNBo]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0-U4Yr9UNBo[/video]

This ad is amusing, but the message is very odd. It seems like Nokia are saying that no-one has heard of the Lumina, which surely means that their own marketing is pretty bad...!?