Beware Internet banking

This is why, whenever I do these type of deals with people, say, buying something from the classifieds section (I generally do a EFT) then I ask the person in question to VERIFY his details... It involves having to give me the banking details like, twice but then I can double check and if a problem, I msg the person again.

Irratating, but safer way to do things!
 
By law, if you incorrectly pay someone money - you could sue them for the money back. Depending on the amount, most people would rather pay you back then go through the hassle of going to court.

Edit: That's exactly what the article says. hehe. I should read before posting *hides*
 
That's not specific to internet banking, though. If you choose the wrong beneficiary on an ATM screen, it's the same thing... or if you get a digit wrong in an account number that you give to the teller at a branch.
 
When I worked as a legal advisor at a Bank I would deal with stuff like this every day.
and dealt with a few situations where some pretty sizable amounts were transferred into the wrong accounts. Like SIZEABLE!!!!

What makes matters worse is that if you DONT know who owns the account the money went into, the Bank cant tell you who owns the bank account in question. To do so, would be a breach of their confidentiality obligations to their client, technically speaking a Bank cant even tell someone whether you have an account with them, let alone disclose the name of the owner of a particular account number.

The only way to get that information is to either bring an application in terms fo the promotion of access to information act or to lodge a criminal complaint with the police, and they then get a warrant / subpoena... but how long will that take....
 
I'm busy with a fraud case at this moment in time. A sum of R2000 that I paid for goods that wasn't sent to me.

That was 3 months ago and the case is still pending.

Not a case of the wrong account number ... but a person trying to pull a fast one.

It's a sad state of affairs that getting your own money back is such a hassle. But when you owe money ... guess whose first on your case?
 
Natas said:
The only way to get that information is to either bring an application in terms fo the promotion of access to information act or to lodge a criminal complaint with the police, and they then get a warrant / subpoena... but how long will that take....
Click to expand...

So how would paying money into someone's account by mistake,
qualify for a criminal complaint?
 
About two years ago a very big company accidently deposited a bit more than a million into a friend's bank account. The bank called him and told him to come and sign so they can reverse the funds.
I guess it depends on the amount of business you do with the bank how hard/easy it'll be to get your money back.
 
PeterCH said:
So how would paying money into someone's account by mistake,
qualify for a criminal complaint?
Click to expand...

Basically if you deposit the money into the wrong account, sometimes you dont realise for quite some time. By which time the money would have been spent. In such cases, you don't really have a criminal complaint, because the person may not have known that the money was not for their benefit. In such a case, you have a claim for unjustified enrichment, which is a civil matter.

However, the theory at least is, if you find out before the money is spent, you can tell the bank to advise their client that the money was paid over in error and is not for their benefit. If they then spend the money that was not intended for them, then technically speaking they are committing an act of theft.

I am however not so sure about this. In law there is a principle called co-mingling, cant remember the latin terms. The principle however is that you have something like olive oil ( a real example), if I steal your olive oil and place it in a container which now contains only your olive oil, then you can identify your oil and have a claim for the return of THAT oil. However, if I take your oil and mix it with mine, your oil mixes with mine and becomes MINE! You then only have a damages claim to the value of the oil in question.

Same can be said for money. If I take your coins and throw it into my piggy bank with my coins, an we break it open, unless you can identify YOUR specific coins, your coins become mine and all you have is a claim for unjustified enrichment.

So, if by mistake you deposit money into my bank account with money already in it, then that money becomes MINE and you have a damages claim against me, irrespective of whether or not I know that the deposit was in error. So if the money technically becomes mine, how then can it be stealing? Yes you have a claim against me, but me spending money that has mixed with my own cant be stealing.

Arguably speaking if money is deposited into an empty bank account, then you will have a claim for those specific funds!?!?!
 
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Every time I do a payment a screen comes up asking me to confirm the details are correct. If you just click "make payment" without confirming first it's your own stupidity and deserve whatever happens.
 
My mother, reimbursing me for a laptop I bought her, mistakenly transferred the money into an old beneficiary account that had my name, but was actually linked to a discontinued Telkom account that was closed 6 years ago. The money, R17k, just seemed to disappear into the ether. Telkom couldn't trace it. After a lot of tears and sweat, it was only with the assistance of Nedbank and Telkom that the funds were eventually tracked down and refunded, over month after the original transfer.

The morale: Delete those old/obsolete beneficiaries.
 
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I once got paid a salary twice from a large auditing firm for Vac work I had done. One of the ladies from the team phoned me to tell me the mistake even though I realised it was and didn't spend the money. The next day, the bank reversed the payment without every contacting me. I never did actually agree to reverse the funds, although I would've had they asked.
 
Natas said:
However, the theory at least is, if you find out before the money is spent, you can tell the bank to advise their client that the money was paid over in error and is not for their benefit. If they then spend the money that was not intended for them, then technically speaking they are committing an act of theft.
Click to expand...

Do the advise their clients?
 
Strange. :confused: A few years back I had an account at IcanOnline (now Nedbank I think). One month someone made two deposits of R2000 in the account. I thought fuk this and spent it. Then come the end of the month, my balance was -R4000, indicating that they had taken the money back. :o
 
A few years ago Telkom was supposed to pay a contractor 14 Million - they paid it into the wrong account. Its was something to do with the account name, just a letter or two that was missing or swapped around or something like that. Anyway the guy skipped town, they only recovered less that half of the total amount.
 
Slootvreter said:
Strange. :confused: A few years back I had an account at IcanOnline (now Nedbank I think). One month someone made two deposits of R2000 in the account. I thought fuk this and spent it. Then come the end of the month, my balance was -R4000, indicating that they had taken the money back. :o
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The only way that that could have happened is if there was a cheque involved. A bank will never take money out of your account without your permission, definitely not R2000. The problem for the bank is that there are risks, they have no idea whats going on in your account. An example would be, you have home insurance and you put money into an account for the debit order to go off. But just before it does go off, the bank takes money out of your account without your permission, and you debit order bounces. Now you have no insurance, and thats the day you house decides to burn down. The bank then faces a damages claim for potentially millions cause they had to stick their fingers in your account for R2000.00
 
PythonFSi said:
A few years ago Telkom was supposed to pay a contractor 14 Million - they paid it into the wrong account. Its was something to do with the account name, just a letter or two that was missing or swapped around or something like that. Anyway the guy skipped town, they only recovered less that half of the total amount.
Click to expand...

unbelievable, how did that happen ?
 
why are the banks completely without accountability in these cases? they can so easily prevent this sort of error. it adds to their bottom line through 'service fees' so I can see why they don't.

since the bank is providing the service I expect them to make my life easier. when you go to deposit cash the teller will (or should) inform you if the beneficiary name doesn't match what you've got on the form. so why not have this simple check extended to internet banking transfers?

yet again the insitution completely absolves itself and sits back when their procedures/services fail!
 
PythonFSi said:
A few years ago Telkom was supposed to pay a contractor 14 Million - they paid it into the wrong account. Its was something to do with the account name, just a letter or two that was missing or swapped around or something like that. Anyway the guy skipped town, they only recovered less that half of the total amount.
Click to expand...

This sounds familiar to a new phishing scam being used. They ( the crooks ) claim to be from Telkom and informed you that a big cheque has erroneously been paid into your account. You check, and you see the deposit of Rlotsofmoney is indeed there. They then request that you return the money to them, via eft. A few day later, their so-called incorrect payment bounces, as the cheque is fraudulant.
 
Natas said:
I am however not so sure about this. In law there is a principle called co-mingling, cant remember the latin terms.
Click to expand...

There is indeed such a principle - we did it last year ... but I just cannot seem to remember the Latin term for it :o
 
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