Bring on the Shamatank!

w1z4rd

w1z4rd

Karmic Sangoma
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I seriously wish Blizzard would give Shamans a real tanking roll. Lets look at the OP druid. Great tanks, fantastic healer, mediocre dps. The shaman? Good healing, mediocre dps and non existent tanking. Not a really good hybrid class when compared to druids.

Lets face it, there are not enough tanks out there, and of those tanks there are even fewer good tanks. It would be so cool if Blizzard could make tanking with a shaman more viable. Its win win for everyone.

Yes I am jealous of druids and their easy mode healing.
 
they must add another spec for them then, then all the classes must get a new spec :P to much effort there are 4 tank classes, people is just to lazy to tank, they rather press 2 buttons the whole fight
 
hereticangel said:
they must add another spec for them then, then all the classes must get a new spec :P to much effort there are 4 tank classes, people is just to lazy to tank, they rather press 2 buttons the whole fight
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Dont they already have talent points for tanking. Stamina and threat generation? Just buff those in the enhancement tree. No need for a whole new spec.
 
They could make the enhancement tree like the feral tree. Possible to spec dps or tank in the one tree.

Edit: Blizzard have stated numerous times that they have no intention of doing that by the way. It was initially planned (vanilla) but later on they decided they have enough tanking classes. If they would do it however it would make my main choice so much easier. I love tanking, and I love my shaman. Wish they would just combine it and I would have the perfect class!
 
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It seems a bit strange how Blizzard made Hybrid classes good at everything...as opposed to lagging behind dedicated classes.

IMHO:
Warrior = tanking class
Priest/Shaman = healer class
Mage/Lock/Hunter/Rogue = pure DPS classes
Druid/Pally = Hybrid

What gets me is when multi-class players start out performing dedicated ones. I see this as being a bit unfair towards the dedicated ones. I.e. a mage/lock/hunter/rogue can spec 3 types of dps (even though lately 1 tree per class seems to be pointless for pve and pvp making it null and void). Having kitty dps and retadins overtake the dedicated DPS doesn't make sense - and I'm glad to see retadins have been nerfed somewhat.

As a rogue I'm a bit biased towards QQ'ing, but we discussed it in a 25man raid on ICC last night. The 2 rogues in the raid did the most dps on mostly static targets and then even the other classes mentioned this:

Unless you're well geared and in the top 5 on the DPS list, you're useless to a raid, for the following reasons:

You have little to no AoE - sure Fan of Knives works great for the first few seconds - or on a very large group of mobs...but it chows energy for breakfast and is not really effective.
You provide NO raid buffs. Sure tricks gives the tank 15% more damage, but he's not in it for damage anyway - and you're just doing it to save your own bacon anyway.
You're melee.
You wear leather and require the most healing - after tanks.

I have to admit that I'm inclined to agree. If I was a raid leader I'd only take 1 rogue along (even if it wasn't me) to disarm traps unless they're very well geared and guaranteed to be top 3-5.


Back on topic though, I agree with Wizard about a shammy tanking class. They can already equip shields so I don't see the issue. (Which is more than you can say for DK's.) Enhancement shammies aren't doing the DPS they used to, so it'll only be fair to let them be a tanking/healer hybrid. Just imagine über threat generating totems ... drawing adds to their location like catnip! Plus, I mean just look at spacecows - they just look like tanks! That's why I called my spacecow pally "Baksteen".

(Oh and I didn't forget about DK's in my original list because they can DIAF. Especially that lametard DK in our group who tanks with 2x 1handed swords - one of them being thunderfury "because it looks cool". What a douche.)
 
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It doesn't make any sense flavour wise. Shamans are supposed to be the wise men of the tribe. The witchdoctors, the village elders. Not the young warriors charging into battle on the front lines.
Just the way I see it. TBQH imo they shouldnt even be able to use shields and mail and 2handed weapons/diel wield. Enhancement as a spec for them doesn't make much sense to me, they should be limited to leather and staffs and put squarely in the healing/dps caster role, much like a priest.

p.s. if hybrids are outdpsing you, you fail. Relatively.
 
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Well, with the introduction of DK's everyone thought it would solve the lack of tanks.

Well they were wrong.

See, tanking has got nothing to do with the class and everything to do with the person behind the monitor. So adding yet another tanking class will not solve the lack of tanks. DPS have it the easiest and many don't want to make things harder than they already are. Funny thing is; we have a serious problem with slacker dps these days and ICC has made it more prominent than any raid in the past.
 
Lack of tanks has two reasons.
1:Game design failure between 5, 10 and 25man raiding. 25man raiding doesnt need enough tanks. 3 at most, more often than not just 2 are required. But 10's needs 2, and 5s' need 1. You end up in a guild with a bunch of guys who WANT to tank, but never get the opportunity to do so in a 25man raid because the spots are carved in stone. The problem is thus, at 25man content DEMAND for tanks is lower than all the otehr content. Solution is simple. Make 4 tanks per 25man raid required.
2:Lack of respect for the role. Used to be a time where tanking was respected. Nowdays if you fail to hold aggro for a second, it's your fault as opposed to the dps who pulled aggro. This is a result of imbalance between the tanks and the memetic reprogramming of the populace as to what a tank is thanks to endless repeated heroic runs.

Why spend all that time and effort gearing up for tanking if you're not going to get raid spots, and are just going to be yelled at in heroics? No, most of the appeal to play a tank eroded the second it became about aoe facerolling, picking the exact right class and being treated like a second class citizen. I can still be treated like a second class but at least do something less stressful and more enjoyable by dps'ing.

You're absolutely right that adding another tank class won't fix it. We sit with 4 tank classes currently, the same amount of healer classes, yet theres alwaysa tank shortage. Less so with healing. Is healing a better job? Not really. But we need more of them in a raid.

Supply and demand.
 
Skurm said:
Why spend all that time and effort gearing up for tanking if you're not going to get raid spots, and are just going to be yelled at in heroics? No, most of the appeal to play a tank eroded the second it became about aoe facerolling, picking the exact right class and being treated like a second class citizen. I can still be treated like a second class but at least do something less stressful and more enjoyable by dps'ing.
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I agree. I remember when Shockwave went live just before WoTLK was released. Went back to Karazhan just to "shock" all that trash before that rogue boss(forget his name). Myself and OT tried to pull the whole hall. Had a blast that night. Even with SSC gear, I still enjoyed tanking Nightbane because I had to work at holding aggro on the mobs with my warrior. In SSC, I prefered the OT role because it was challenging tanking adds spawing in the middle of boss fights. After the new talents, I realised then how boring it was going to be.

2 weeks later I told the GM I was switching my main to my warlock for WotLK.
 
Moroes.

Man, there was nothing like Moroes when we started raiding in WotLK. He was an epic cockblock.

And something died in me the first day in Wrath when the tank said 'don't cc i'll just pick them all up'.

Bleh.
 
Very interesting take on it, Skurm and I'm inclined to agree with you.

Long gone are the days of CC'ing mobs with Saps, sheeping, traps and DPS kiting bosses (ala Gruul's Lair fel hounds etc.) during the encounters.

I still remember in as recently as Kara days (before tricks) where you couldn't just go all out - and you actually had to watch your threat on OMEN to make sure you don't pull aggro. This stopped people from facerolling the DPS list without 2 braincells. As much as I enjoy a good gear check fight (Patchwerk, Saurfang) with enrage timers, I enjoy encounters where pure DPS has little effect and actual strategy played the crucial role. For example the malygos etc.
 
Voicy said:
Back on topic though, I agree with Wizard about a shammy tanking class. They can already equip shields so I don't see the issue. (Which is more than you can say for DK's.) Enhancement shammies aren't doing the DPS they used to, so it'll only be fair to let them be a tanking/healer hybrid. Just imagine über threat generating totems ... drawing adds to their location like catnip! Plus, I mean just look at spacecows - they just look like tanks! That's why I called my spacecow pally "Baksteen".
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Yeah, super aggro totems and perhaps the ability to create a cross between an earth shield and a lightning shield?
 
I dont mind shamans tanking. As long as they give warriors feign death as well :D
 
They can already equip shields so I don't see the issue.
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It's a holdover from the old days before paladins became available horde side, and horde needed an 'off off off tank'. Today it simply serves as an armor buff, much like priest's holy fire or treeforms passive armor. Think of it like a holy paladin, they use shields but you won't really expect them to tank anything ever.

Nah, 5 tank classes are more than enough. Blizzard can focus on fixing them before introducing a 5th.
 
I agree with Skurm on this. There is enough tanking classes at the moment. Perhaps all of those DK's and Paladins should start tanking a bit and not stay on dps the whole time.
 
I want to tank with my Mage! I pull threat anyway... Melee battle mage, with arcane shield. Why do mages only have DPS spec :(

And I want to be able to tank a instance with my hunter pet again, or even in raids! And while at it give the hunter some more healing skills as well!
 
w1z4rd said:
I seriously wish Blizzard would give Shamans a real tanking roll. Lets look at the OP druid. Great tanks, fantastic healer, mediocre dps. The shaman? Good healing, mediocre dps and non existent tanking. Not a really good hybrid class when compared to druids.

Lets face it, there are not enough tanks out there, and of those tanks there are even fewer good tanks. It would be so cool if Blizzard could make tanking with a shaman more viable. Its win win for everyone.

Yes I am jealous of druids and their easy mode healing.
Click to expand...


Druid mediocre dps? lol.. yes thats why the feral druid in my guild does close to 11K dps.. mediocre indeed.
 
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