CapeXit 2

[vigras rojara]

How does IC's passport look like ? Are designs out yet ?

 

[lexity]

How does IC's passport look like ? Are designs out yet ?

I don't gaf about passport designs.

p.s. Nor flag designs.

 

[Brian_G]

 

[vigras rojara]

 

[WollieVerstege]

Nah, really don't want to repeat history. I see even Wollie was given at least one list a couple of years ago, and puppy thing was also around then.


Except maybe... let's give them this 2-odd years old video...
(In it Phil mentions 81 secession attempts in the last 50 years - of course these guys will know better than a professional politician though)

Now that's it, leave me be. BYE

Nope liar Brian, I did not receive any list of countries created via secession except the official list ending with South Sudan.

Your claim is that subsequent to South Sudan there have been many more.

Looking for one of those countries.

 

[ToxicBunny]

The responsibility for a peaceful outcome, rests primarily in the hands of the motherland's government not the secessionists, since their only action i.e. withdrawing, is - by very definition - peaceful.

You can't withdraw, all the while inviting peaceful co-operation, AND simultaneously initiate aggression. That doesn't make logical sense, Spock.

It's very difficult to accuse someone of attacking you while they have their back to you and are walking away from you.

If you try to make that case, most people could be forgiven for thinking you're not quite right, upstairs.

Wall o bollocks.

Try again lexy, this time with a modicum of connection to reality.

 

[vigras rojara]

Nope liar Brian, I did not receive any list of countries created via secession except the official list ending with South Sudan.

Your claim is that subsequent to South Sudan there have been many more.

Looking for one of those countries.

Someone will probably be along shortly with a tale about a neighbour who subdivided his plot, thus proving that secession is not only normal but happening daily.

The neighbour was exercising his FoA rights to not associate with the remainder of his plot.

 

[lexity]

Nah, really don't want to repeat history. I see even Wollie was given at least one list a couple of years ago, and puppy thing was also around then.


Except maybe... let's give them this 2-odd years old video...
(In it Phil mentions 81 secession attempts in the last 50 years - of course these guys will know better than a professional politician though)

Now that's it, leave me be. BYE

Aah, yes.... I remember this interviewer, gradually becoming more and more unhinged as Phil patiently debunked his fairy-tale objections to the right of Capeans to break away peacefully.

Phil reminds me a little of Milton Friedman.... he was naive in the company he kept and unsuspecting of the knives they had for him... but my God could he put a strong case forward.

 

[Brian_G]

Your claim is that subsequent to South Sudan there have been many more.

Looking for one of those countries.

Come liar Wollie, show everyone where I said that.

All you're looking to do anyway is push the "not official" line about such later efforts anyway. Do your own dirty work mate. "Pro secession" indeed - show one post anywhere where you claimed that before...

We're done

 

[Grant]

A neighbor of mine subdivided his plot.

Turns out the kikuyu grass on the one side had become disenchanted by the way in which the lawn was cut
One side enjoyed the gentle luxurious trimming by a Flymo lawnmower that hovered serenely above the grass - gently trimming away.
The other side was subjected to the violence of a petrol driven Rolux lawnmower.
This caused the one side (roux) to revolt - in doing so, invited weeds, moles and giant earthworms to join the protest.

Neighbor was displeased and decided enough was enough and decided secession would be in order.
And with that the plot was subdivided allowing the neighbor to secede - leaving the unwieldily and uncooperative side to it’s own devices.

The relationship soured and the disruptive and uncooperative part of the lawn refused the neighbor entry, and thus denying him access to the road in front.
Neighbor found he had no authority to turn to in order to make application for a servitude to be put in place that would allow him access to the road.
A month later his house was struck by lighting. Local fire brigade refused to respond as neighbor was beyond their jurisdiction - and with that, the house burnt down.

Soon thereafter the neighbor was hospitalized - in Valkenburg hospital, where he remains a “guest of the state”.

 

[lexity]

A neighbor of mine subdivided his plot.

Turns out the kikuyu grass on the one side had become disenchanted by the way in which the lawn was cut
One side enjoyed the gentle luxurious trimming by a Flymo lawnmower that hovered serenely above the grass - gently trimming away.
The other side was subjected to the violence of a petrol driven Rolux lawnmower.
This caused the one side (roux) to revolt - in doing so, invited weeds, moles and giant earthworms to join the protest.

Neighbor was displeased and decided enough was enough and decided secession would be in order.
And with that the plot was subdivided allowing the neighbor to secede - leaving the unwieldily and uncooperative side to it’s own devices.

The relationship soured and the disruptive and uncooperative part of the lawn refused the neighbor entry, and thus denying him access to the road in front.
Neighbor found he had no authority to turn to in order to make application for a servitude to be put in place that would allow him access to the road.
A month later his house was struck by lighting. Local fire brigade refused to respond as neighbor was beyond their jurisdiction - and with that the house burnt down.

Soon thereafter the neighbor was hospitalized - in Valkenburg hospital, where he remains a “guest of the state”.

Thanks for sharing. But can I ask for a few more details....

1) Did your neighbour own the plot?
2) Did he own it outright? Or was ownership subject to uninvited-3rd-party terms and conditions?
3) Before he subdivided it, was he letting part of it out?
4) When he subdivided it, did he sell the portion that he was leasing out?

My theory which is not without support in the literature on individual property rights, has so far held up, which is that such a break-down in human affairs/failure to avoid/resolve conflict stems from poorly defined ownership rights to property/resources.

This again comes down to defining borders..... in this case of physical land resources requiring access provision, in contracts during a sale or lease.

 

[lexity]

Wall o bollocks.

Try again lexy, this time with a modicum of connection to reality.

I think where you get left behind is that some of us operate in a world that consists not only of 'ises' but also of 'shoulds'.

It's called a moral code. That's where you don't only speak descriptively, but prescriptively, too.

It sounds like your train leaves the rails every time you encounter someone advocating for something.

Somehow if it doesn't already exist, that means it can't and won't exist, in the future.

Do you have any goals, in life? Do you ever entertain a thought about the future that differs from the current state of affairs?

 

[lexity]

Come liar Wollie, show everyone where I said that.

All you're looking to do anyway is push the "not official" line about such later efforts anyway. Do your own dirty work mate. "Pro secession" indeed - show one post anywhere where you claimed that before...

We're done

Perhaps Wollie is referring to the claim of the averaging out of secessions since 1945.

Doesn't like that.

If you don't see a London bus for 50 minutes and then 5 arrive all at once, you shouldn't say the buses arrive on average once every 10 minutes.

I can only speculate, since he's tucked away in his safe-space from me.

 

[Brian_G]

Perhaps Wollie is referring to the claim of the averaging out of secessions since 1945.

Doesn't like that.

If you don't see a London bus for 50 minutes and then 5 arrive all at once, you shouldn't say the buses arrive on average once every 10 minutes.

I can only speculate, since he's tucked away in his safe-space from me.

That sounds credible, but I think it's then actually liked - the "safe official" route which tends to downplay secessions is still paramount despite some general world body abuses of late, and never mind individual countries' circumstances.
That's fine, except that those who need such securities are usually first to be abusive to other approaches.

There is no wide comfortable route out of the SA dilemma. This one could be more so if enough people were willing to say "enough" to the endlessly escalating abuse.

I'm moving to the background

 

[Brian_G]

Can't blame people for clinging to security concepts, Lex, this mortal state we all find ourselves in is quite threatening - I'm certainly not always brave. Things will have to get worse before they can get better.

Don't wait, you're getting too old, go buy a farm with some other determined adventurers. It's practically all you can really do anyway.

 

[WollieVerstege]

Come liar Wollie, show everyone where I said that.

All you're looking to do anyway is push the "not official" line about such later efforts anyway. Do your own dirty work mate. "Pro secession" indeed - show one post anywhere where you claimed that before...

We're done

Yup, just as I thought. Happened last time to. When pushed into a corner you run away.

Everyone here is familiar with your claim that secession happens every 6 months. Your credibility is shot.

And if the secession is not "official", what is the point of discussing it, ROFL.

 

[Brian_G]

Yup, just as I thought. Happened last time to. When pushed into a corner you run away.

Everyone here is familiar with your claim that secession happens every 6 months. Your credibility is shot.

And if the secession is not "official", what is the point of discussing it, ROFL.

Again with the lies - where did I ever say every 6 months??

Talk about lack of credibility... grow a spine mate

 

[Brian_G]

Hmmm... I said yesterday, once every couple of years or so - turns out it's an average of every 2.7 years with officially recognised results.

And serious efforts go on weekly






I wonder how much more the "unofficial success rate" is than this official 37%.... total maybe reaching toward 50%?
And how many unofficial countries are there actually?

You guys need to realise, this is completely normal in politics. Later...

 

[Brian_G]

 

[Grant]

Thanks for sharing. But can I ask for a few more details....

you surely may

1) Did your neighbour own the plot?

indeed

2) Did he own it outright? Or was ownership subject to uninvited-3rd-party terms and conditions?

although registered to his name, the plot was subject to a finance agreement.
ownership / purchase, required a certain amount of financing - for that purpose he invited various financial institutions to present their offerings. of those he selected the one that best suited his needs at the time.

3) Before he subdivided it, was he letting part of it out?

no.
no part of the property was subject to any lease / rental agreement with any 3rd party

4) When he subdivided it, did he sell the portion that he was leasing out?

he was not leasing any portion to any 3rd party

My theory which is not without support in the literature on individual property rights, has so far held up, which is that such a break-down in human affairs/failure to avoid/resolve conflict stems from poorly defined ownership rights to property/resources.

i'm not entirely certain nature (in this instance the kikuyu grass), could be held to contractural agreements.

This again comes down to defining borders..... in this case of physical land resources requiring access provision, in contracts during a sale or lease.

i doubt the neighbor ever reasonably foresaw a need to enter into an agreement with himself to register a servitude / passage over his own land.
were that to be the case, he would have been registered as both dominant & subservient servitude holder simultaneously - which in itself requires a merger of the properties.

a quagmire indeed - one henceforth that shall be known as "the great kikuyu uprising of 2021".