CRICKET SA vs England

WonderBob

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So the big tour of the 'old country' has started.

end of the 2nd day vs Somerset:

http://content-rsa.cricinfo.com/engvrsa/engine/match/320221.html

South Africans 515/3d & 56/1 (16.0 ov)
Somerset 249

Poor McKenzie got a 1st baller in the 1st innings :p, his form in County cricket so far this year has not been good though, think he only scored 130 odd runs since April for Durham, is on 37* in the 2nd innings though.

Good for Amla (172) and Kallis (160) though, especially on the strike rates. Kallis got injured on the first day, he got a bouncer on the elbow, nothing serious though, just some bruising.

The pitch is quite flat and Somerset's missing their 1st choice bolwlers, but still good to get runs and wickets in the warm ups.

What do you think our chances are this time around?

We have not won a serious in England since readmission (i think, will go double check).
 
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So the big tour of the 'old country' has started.

end of the 2nd day vs Somerset:

http://content-rsa.cricinfo.com/engvrsa/engine/match/320221.html

South Africans 515/3d & 56/1 (16.0 ov)
Somerset 249

Poor McKenzie got a 1st baller in the 1st innings :p, his form in Country cricket so far this year has not been good though, think he only scored 130 odd runs since April for Durham, is on 37* in the 2nd innings though.

Good for Amla (172) and Kallis (160) though, especially on the strike rates. Kallis got injured on the first day, he got a bouncer on the elbow, nothing serious though, just some bruising.

The pitch is quite flat and Somerset's missing their 1st choice bolwlers, but still good to get runs and wickets in the warm ups.

What do you think our chances are this time around?

We have not won a serious in England since readmission (i think, will go double check).

Nice story, thanks.

From what I can tell....

July - Sept 2003 5 tests, 1 draw, England won 2, South Africa won 2 - series drawn
June - Aug 1998 5 tests, 2 draw, England won 2, South Africa won 1 - England win
July - Aug 1994 3 tests, 1 draw, England won 1, South Africa won 1 - series drawn
 
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well, 2 drawn series and 1 loss, time to equalise then.

I reckon we have a very good chance to beat the Poms this time around.

Its interesting to read what the English media thinks, expecially about Greame Smith.

an article that Atherton wrote on Smith:

Graeme Smith predicts South Africa success
Mike Atherton, Chief Cricket Correspondent
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With a one-day international taking place at the Brit Oval, South Africa's arrival in England yesterday for a full tour was underwhelming. When the Test series starts in two weeks' time, though, post-Euro 2008 and pre-Olympic Games, such lack of fanfare will be a fading memory. And that, you suspect, is how Graeme Smith, their captain, likes it. He does not so much divide opinion as provoke it, valour having been the better part of discretion.

Take this from Shane Warne: “He [Smith] just keeps making these outrageous and ridiculous statements and doesn't back them up.” Or this from Michael Vaughan: “What astounded me was that he kept on calling me queer, which I found very odd and childish. He also kept calling Flintoff a big baby, which was courageous but also remarkably silly.” Or this, more prosaically, from Kevin Pietersen: “He's an absolute muppet.”

Nor do those three think much of Smith's captaincy. Warne again: “I don't think he understands how to captain a spinner.” Vaughan: “He looked as if he was playing to the cameras on the field ... sometimes he appeared to have one eye on the job and one eye on the big screen. It was as if he was saying, 'Look at me, I'm a power freak.' ” Pietersen: “I don't think he's too intelligent, actually.”

Well, Smith must be doing something right. No South African has been appointed to the captaincy at a younger age - he was 22 when he took the job in 2003 - none has captained them more often (57 times), or to more wins (27). And Vaughan would probably cast an envious eye over the depth of talent in Smith's squad (especially the quick bowlers), the apparent harmony in it (which has not always been the case) and South Africa's form, which has been outstanding in 2007-08. This year it has been England who have been doing the talking, South Africa the achieving.

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No surprise, then, that when I spoke to Smith he was in mellow mood. In the past he has called Pietersen, who was born and raised in South Africa, unpatriotic; now, at least until the cricket begins, England's genius is not even on Smith's radar. “I don't really have an attitude towards him,” he said. “Things have been said in the past and I'm very aware that the media will try to stoke things up again. But I don't feel the need to get involved, except that there are bound to be some words exchanged on the field. We don't really know each other and I suspect it's going to stay like that.”

Things change, though, as Smith's late-flowering friendship with Warne, after their recent stint together for Rajasthan Royals in the Indian Premier League, proves. Did Smith learn anything from the man widely regarded as the best captain Australia never had? “It was a great experience,” he said. “Tactically I didn't learn very much, but we talked and talked cricket and I watched him carefully. He's very good at bringing the best out of people by making them feel good about themselves and making them feel valued. Tactically he was a genius of a bowler, but his great strength in the IPL was his man-management.”

Is that something that Smith has got better at of late, because there were strong hints in books written by Pietersen and Vaughan that Smith struggled on England's previous tour to South Africa, in 2004-05, to harmonise with his senior players? “Listen, I've matured and mellowed a lot as a person,” he said. “In my early days as captain I was very abrasive because I felt the need, probably because of my age and lack of experience, to impose myself on every situation. Sometimes I forgot who I was for a while. Now I'm very comfortable with who I am and the team that I've got, so I'm in a very calm state of mind.”

He has not always had the team that he wanted. Indeed, it is hard to think of a more difficult job in cricket than captaining the South Africa team, with the conflicting burdens of the expectation of a still-fanatical sporting nation and, because of the need for transformation, political interference. Only last week Smith was removed from the selection panel by Cricket South Africa (CSA). Perversely this was perceived as a minor triumph for him because the CSA president's power of veto over selection, a cause of conflict in the recent past, was also removed.

He describes his relationship with Norman Arendse, the president of CSA, as “neutral” - which, given Smith's list of enemies, does not mark him out, but reflects the level of political interference in selection in the past. There are six “players of colour”, to use that horrible phrase, in this 15-man squad, one fewer than the regulations allowed until a recent softening of the hardline transformation position.

Smith's position on transformation is pragmatic. “It is a difficult issue because emotional statements are made all the time,” he said. “The key is not so much who we pick in the national team but the quality and strength of our feeder systems. If we pick players who are not up to it, then no one benefits. But if players of colour are playing on merit in strong feeder systems, then transformation will become complete. All of us want to see the country move on, but we want to see it handled in the right way.”

At the weekend, Mickey Arthur, the South Africa coach, said that this is the first time he has had exactly the squad that he wanted. Smith agrees. “Two or three years ago there was a lot of interference and I wasn't sure whether I wanted to go on or not,” he said. “But right now I'm very excited by the team I've got and the possibilities on offer. At the start I felt it was a team that I inherited, but now it is very much my team. We've got the best combination we've had for a long time. I feel rejuvenated.”

It is not difficult to see why. Dale Steyn, Morne Morkel, Makhaya Ntini and Andre Nel, backed up by Jacques Kallis and Monde Zondeki, make up probably the most potent fast-bowling unit available to any international captain. Warne thinks that Smith is clueless at handling spin; Smith may not bother trying to prove him wrong. Since readmission in 1991, South Africa have hardly been known for their subtlety and now, between them, Smith and Arthur have devised a strategy that demands three bowlers, at all times, capable of delivering the ball at somewhere near the 90mph mark. “I've no doubt that we'll bowl England out consistently, so in that sense the form of our top six will be the key for us,” Smith said.

And England? “They don't seem as confident or as settled as the last time we played them,” he said. “Obviously Flintoff is a key factor. If he plays - and I would have thought Vaughan will want five bowlers - then their batting suddenly looks vulnerable. If we can get early wickets, put the pressure on Pietersen and that middle order, I'd fancy our chances.”

Earlier, when we touched on transformation, I had asked him whether he could think of a more difficult job in sport than captaining the modern South Africa. His reply was that he did not much fancy captaining England at football. By the end of the summer, after Smith's bowlers have given England's batsmen the hop-around, Vaughan's job may not look so sweet either.

Graeme Smith was speaking to promote live coverage of England versus South Africa on Sky Sports
 
well, 2 drawn series and 1 loss, time to equalise then.

I reckon we have a very good chance to beat the Poms this time around.

Its interesting to read what the English media thinks, expecially about Greame Smith.

an article that Atherton wrote on Smith:

Nice one! After the start I thought it was going to be the usual British press stuff but I am happy to see they added the part where Smith and Warne are now "friends".

I for one have always liked Smith and even for those who never did he is definitely maturing. He was after all only 22 when he came on the scene.

I hope we see some quick pitches on tour, but I fear England will try to get the groundsman to negate the blistering pace we have at our disposal. Now I am getting excited! :)
 
It's going to be an incredible series one would imagine. One of the proudest moments for me as a South African was watching Makaya Ntini kiss the pitch at Lords after taking 10 wickets in a test in the 2003 series... From the streets of Mdingi in the Eastern Cape to Lords!!! Amazing...
 
It's going to be an incredible series one would imagine. One of the proudest moments for me as a South African was watching Makaya Ntini kiss the pitch at Lords after taking 10 wickets in a test in the 2003 series... From the streets of Mdingi in the Eastern Cape to Lords!!! Amazing...

I think we have the experience and confidence to beat England this time around.

Smith is not the same arrogant and inexperienced captain he was in 2003, can expect alot better from him this time around. Hopefully the batting as well, but I think that might be asking a bit much... maybe this time he'll get 3 double centuries :p and if Ntini can improve on his previous efforts, we'll take the series 4-0.

but seriously, its gonna be awesome!!
 
I think we will finally whip England this time around.

They have yet to feel the wrath of our new weapon.

Dale Steyn <insert very evil smiley here>
 
I think south african cricket is rather useless, our teams never compete during the world cup and thats really the biggest stage available... Chokers unfortunately.
 
Can't wait to see Pietersen try out his switch hitting reverse sweep against Steyn, Morkel etc. :D

England seem awfully confident, despite having just lost a series to a pretty ordinary NZ.
 
Can't wait to see Pietersen try out his switch hitting reverse sweep against Steyn, Morkel etc. :D

I think he'll leave that for the spinners. :) Has he ever reverse swept a fast bowler?
 
I think south african cricket is rather useless, our teams never compete during the world cup and thats really the biggest stage available... Chokers unfortunately.

Rather useless?

We're not talking about the world cup here dude.

Can't wait to see Pietersen try out his switch hitting reverse sweep against Steyn, Morkel etc. :D

England seem awfully confident, despite having just lost a series to a pretty ordinary NZ.

Good ol' Pietie boy, I'd also love to see him try that reverse sweep against Steyn. (and maybe top edge it into his face at 150km/h :D)
 
I think he'll leave that for the spinners. :) Has he ever reverse swept a fast bowler?

Depends whether you consider Styris a fast bowler. :D
Good ol' Pietie boy, I'd also love to see him try that reverse sweep against Steyn. (and maybe top edge it into his face at 150km/h :D)

Ah, what a pleasant thought to start the day. :D
 
Saw the trailer for the movie "Hansie". I swear the trailer alone brought a lump to my throat and a tear to my eye...
 
I think south african cricket is rather useless, our teams never compete during the world cup and thats really the biggest stage available... Chokers unfortunately.

No offense, but I think your statement is pretty useless. I reckon we competed in the last world cup, got to the semis, fell flat in the semi final though, but who gives a crap about world cups.

Can not compare Test and ODI cricket anyways. So much more to cricket than World Cups. Give me a test series against Eng or Aus anyday over the drawn out and mostly boring World Cup tournament.
 
I think south african cricket is rather useless, our teams never compete during the world cup and thats really the biggest stage available... Chokers unfortunately.

Ok first thing, every team that played in the WC competed:rolleyes:

No offense, but I think your statement is pretty useless. I reckon we competed in the last world cup, got to the semis, fell flat in the semi final though, but who gives a crap about world cups.
Can not compare Test and ODI cricket anyways. So much more to cricket than World Cups. Give me a test series against Eng or Aus anyday over the drawn out and mostly boring World Cup tournament.

One of the most true statements imo.

Test cricket is a very diffrent game to ODIs.

Can't wait to see if Steyn can get the type of swing he got last year.
I really hope his good/great form continues.
 
Cant believe I missed this thread.

Nice story, thanks.

From what I can tell....

July - Sept 2003 5 tests, 1 draw, England won 2, South Africa won 2 - series drawn
June - Aug 1998 5 tests, 2 draw, England won 2, South Africa won 1 - England win
July - Aug 1994 3 tests, 1 draw, England won 1, South Africa won 1 - series drawn
We shoulda won all 3 of those series.

1994 - We won the first test.
Devon Malcom whipped us in the last test with 9/57 I think.:o

1998 - Umpires cost us that one.:mad:

2003 - Choke again.

It's going to be an incredible series one would imagine. One of the proudest moments for me as a South African was watching Makaya Ntini kiss the pitch at Lords after taking 10 wickets in a test in the 2003 series... From the streets of Mdingi in the Eastern Cape to Lords!!! Amazing...
That was great:)
Saw the trailer for the movie "Hansie". I swear the trailer alone brought a lump to my throat and a tear to my eye...
I'm a Hansie fan.
No offense, but I think your statement is pretty useless. I reckon we competed in the last world cup, got to the semis, fell flat in the semi final though, but who gives a crap about world cups.

Can not compare Test and ODI cricket anyways. So much more to cricket than World Cups. Give me a test series against Eng or Aus anyday over the drawn out and mostly boring World Cup tournament.
Can't argue with the choke theory, but we are a good side.

Hope we kick their butts this time.
Would also like to see Pieterson score a few tons against us.
 
Exciting stuff. If been enjoying how this series has quietly come upon us. Been years sicne i fealt so good about our team. Smith really has come along way in terms of his handling of the media.

I look forward to the pleasure of watching some good cicket for a change. I'm starting to get rugby'd out if you know what i mean.

I've always enjoyed the difference between the rugby and cricket seasons. It's always a case of a good change.

Time to look forward to long bouts of calm pleasure. ;-)

Been a fanatical rugby and cricket switcher for longer than i can remember now.

I know i have failed to mention the epic up and coming tri nations, thats a story for another day.

GO BOKKE!!
GO SMITHY!!
 
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I'm a Hansie fan.
MAN, have you read his book?!!! Cried like a baby reading it... I don't agree with how his "crimes" were handled but that's another debate for another thread... It's probably been thoroughly debated on this forum in any event...
 
MAN, have you read his book?!!! Cried like a baby reading it... I don't agree with how his "crimes" were handled but that's another debate for another thread... It's probably been thoroughly debated on this forum in any event...

Didn't read his book.
He's still the only person who confessed (although he had to, I guess), Warne, Waugh, etc got off lightly.
 
Didn't read his book.
He's still the only person who confessed (although he had to, I guess), Warne, Waugh, etc got off lightly.
Yeah when you look at how some of our politicans and fellow citiziens behave and the punishment they get it makes one sick that Hansie was alienated and punished to the extent he was for effectively selling information about the team selection and pitch conditions, match strategies etc... I really believe he was hung out to dry by everyone other than his family...
 
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