Crime SA's biggest problem - FW de Klerk

Fighting for the freedom of a country and running a country takes 2 different kinds people. I would go as far as to say they are mutually exclusive. Any person who calls himself a freedom fighter/part of the struggle should not be allowed to be in an authoritative position.

If criminals rule the country, criminals will take over in all facets of the country.
 
boramk said:
I mean, he can't really say anything..... He was an apartheid leader, critisize the current government, he will be branded as a racist...
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Howcome De Klerk gets asked for his opinion?
He does not even live here anymore!

He is in the news on a constant basis.
Did he run out of money?

Is he trying to make a comeback?

Traitor!:sick:
 
I personally believe that many people do not fully comprehend the underlying realities of the political dispensation in South Africa and the near “set in concrete” outcome that awaits us. The political undercurrents in the rest of Africa are flowing here too. Yes, we might be on the eve of a breakthrough vote in Zimbabwe, but even that outcome will not mean a better resolve to the issues facing Zimbabwe today. I believe that Mugabe is a product of Zimbabwe, not the other way around. Where he came from, there are plenty waiting to be born even.

In short, there is this cascading and unstoppable chain of dominoes slowly falling, creating a vivid picture in its wake. The picture isn’t pretty, but in my view it isn’t unexpected. The electricity and infrastructure problems have been predicted by many sober thinkers decades ago. Simply take a template of any African country that gained independence and the picture will come to fruition here as well. In my view it is unavoidable. The timelines may differ but the outcome will be pretty much the same.

Now many folks are postulating that this is not such an easy thing to happen because there are far more whites here than anywhere else in Africa. I disagree with the statement. Yes, the residence of an extensive white population with a high prevalence of proper education and solid income distribution doesn’t have that big an impact on the outcome purely because it is exactly the tools the white community have that enables them to endeavour, develop, do business, do skilled labour and more that creates the political animosity that will in all likelihood lead to the problems I can foresee in South Africa few years down the line.
South Africa is dependent on the white community. It would not be the most successful African country had it not been for this presence. This is a fact. Yes, we have a lot of gold and a lot of other natural resources here, but the expertise to extract 99% of it came from the former European community. It would be a difficult argument to deny this country’s success on anything other than the existence of a large white community in South Africa. Does it earn the white community the right to special treatment? No. But it does earn them the right not to be messed with and to be left alone.

The unfortunate reality is that people will want what other people have. Especially if there is reason to believe they got it without working for it and by exploiting others.

The biggest tragedy of Apartheid was that it created the impression that white people in South Africa have what they have because they denied it to black people. It is a huge fallacy and one that I believe unfortunately cannot be overcome.

There is no indication that black South Africans would have the same level of development (meaning average education and wealth) as the white community had Apartheid not existed. There is certainly no example of this in the rest of Africa and certainly not in the United States of America or elsewhere.

Most of the super wealthy black people in South Africa got their wealth through political affiliation and connections. Most have been politicians themselves. I believe the figure to be close to 100% in fact. This is a problem.

There are some unspoken issues in this country that have become politically impolite but realistically pertinent to recognise.

The problem is, it won’t and for that reason alone this country doesn’t have what it takes to survive.
 
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antowan said:
I personally believe that many people do not fully comprehend the underlying realities of the political dispensation in South Africa and the near “set in concrete” outcome that awaits us. The political undercurrents in the rest of Africa are flowing here too. Yes, we might be on the eve of a breakthrough vote in Zimbabwe, but even that outcome will not mean a better resolve to the issues facing Zimbabwe today. I believe that Mugabe is a product of Zimbabwe, not the other way around. Where he came from, there are plenty waiting to be born even.

In short, there is this cascading and unstoppable chain of dominoes slowly falling, creating a vivid picture in its wake. The picture isn’t pretty, but in my view it isn’t unexpected. The electricity and infrastructure problems have been predicted by many sober thinkers decades ago. Simply take a template of any African country that gained independence and the picture will come to fruition here as well. In my view it is unavoidable. The timelines may differ but the outcome will be pretty much the same.

Now many folks are postulating that this is not such an easy thing to happen because there are far more whites here than anywhere else in Africa. I disagree with the statement. Yes, the residence of an extensive white population with a high prevalence of proper education and solid income distribution doesn’t have that big an impact on the outcome purely because it is exactly the tools the white community have that enables them to endeavour, develop, do business, do skilled labour and more that creates the political animosity that will in all likelihood lead to the problems I can foresee in South Africa few years down the line.
South Africa is dependent on the white community. It would not be the most successful African country had it not been for this presence. This is a fact. Yes, we have a lot of gold and a lot of other natural resources here, but the expertise to extract 99% of it came from the former European community. It would be a difficult argument to deny this country’s success on anything other than the existence of a large white community in South Africa. Does it earn the white community the right to special treatment? No. But it does earn them the right not to be messed with and to be left alone.

The unfortunate reality is that people will want what other people have. Especially if there is reason to believe they got it without working for it and by exploiting others.

The biggest tragedy of Apartheid was that it created the impression that white people in South Africa have what they have because they denied it to black people. It is a huge fallacy and one that I believe unfortunately cannot be overcome.

There is no indication that black South Africans would have the same level of development (meaning average education and wealth) as the white community had Apartheid not existed. There is certainly no example of this in the rest of Africa and certainly not in the United States of America or elsewhere.

Most of the super wealthy black people in South Africa got their wealth through political affiliation and connections. Most have been politicians themselves. I believe the figure to be close to 100% in fact. This is a problem.

There are some unspoken issues in this country that have become politically impolite but realistically pertinent to recognise.

The problem is, it won’t and for that reason alone this country doesn’t have what it takes to survive.
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We will just have to take the country back,won't we?

There is no other option.

The end result would be a war.

The inevitable war was postponed by the Codesa talks.

It will happen.

There is no question about that.
 
hmm...

poverty is at 50% ... and unemployment is at 25% of the populous...

LOL .. statsSA should look closer at the stuff they churn out :D
 
antowan said:
The biggest tragedy of Apartheid was that it created the impression that white people in South Africa have what they have because they denied it to black people. It is a huge fallacy and one that I believe unfortunately cannot be overcome.

There is no indication that black South Africans would have the same level of development (meaning average education and wealth) as the white community had Apartheid not existed. There is certainly no example of this in the rest of Africa and certainly not in the United States of America or elsewhere.
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Best two chapters I have read in a long time. The rest is brilliant too.
Nicely put Antowan .. so rational, so clear, so easy .. but as you said this train of thought cannot be overcome, at least not in the short or even the medium term for that matter.

Simple Layman's Example to draw a comparison>

-Couple A Buys a house with trees.
-Couple B Buys a house with no trees.

Invariably this is what will happen .. Couple A cuts the Trees down to size or removes them altogether, while Couple B plants new Trees.

Human Nature, reinventing the wheel, new broom sweeps clean, a new start, 'n nuwe begin, we know better, history keeps repeating itself etc etc. Call it what you like, but human nature dictates that every Generation has it's own broom to sweep and here in Africa there is an abundance of such like people.
 
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antowan said:
I personally believe that many people do not fully comprehend the underlying realities of the political dispensation in South Africa and the near “set in concrete” outcome that awaits us. The political undercurrents in the rest of Africa are flowing here too. Yes, we might be on the eve of a breakthrough vote in Zimbabwe, but even that outcome will not mean a better resolve to the issues facing Zimbabwe today. I believe that Mugabe is a product of Zimbabwe, not the other way around. Where he came from, there are plenty waiting to be born even.

In short, there is this cascading and unstoppable chain of dominoes slowly falling, creating a vivid picture in its wake. The picture isn’t pretty, but in my view it isn’t unexpected. The electricity and infrastructure problems have been predicted by many sober thinkers decades ago. Simply take a template of any African country that gained independence and the picture will come to fruition here as well. In my view it is unavoidable. The timelines may differ but the outcome will be pretty much the same.

Now many folks are postulating that this is not such an easy thing to happen because there are far more whites here than anywhere else in Africa. I disagree with the statement. Yes, the residence of an extensive white population with a high prevalence of proper education and solid income distribution doesn’t have that big an impact on the outcome purely because it is exactly the tools the white community have that enables them to endeavour, develop, do business, do skilled labour and more that creates the political animosity that will in all likelihood lead to the problems I can foresee in South Africa few years down the line.
South Africa is dependent on the white community. It would not be the most successful African country had it not been for this presence. This is a fact. Yes, we have a lot of gold and a lot of other natural resources here, but the expertise to extract 99% of it came from the former European community. It would be a difficult argument to deny this country’s success on anything other than the existence of a large white community in South Africa. Does it earn the white community the right to special treatment? No. But it does earn them the right not to be messed with and to be left alone.

The unfortunate reality is that people will want what other people have. Especially if there is reason to believe they got it without working for it and by exploiting others.

The biggest tragedy of Apartheid was that it created the impression that white people in South Africa have what they have because they denied it to black people. It is a huge fallacy and one that I believe unfortunately cannot be overcome.

There is no indication that black South Africans would have the same level of development (meaning average education and wealth) as the white community had Apartheid not existed. There is certainly no example of this in the rest of Africa and certainly not in the United States of America or elsewhere.

Most of the super wealthy black people in South Africa got their wealth through political affiliation and connections. Most have been politicians themselves. I believe the figure to be close to 100% in fact. This is a problem.

There are some unspoken issues in this country that have become politically impolite but realistically pertinent to recognise.

The problem is, it won’t and for that reason alone this country doesn’t have what it takes to survive.
Click to expand...

that was beautiful:o
 
antowan said:
I personally believe that many people do not fully comprehend the underlying realities of the political dispensation in South Africa and the near “set in concrete” outcome that awaits us. The political undercurrents in the rest of Africa are flowing here too. Yes, we might be on the eve of a breakthrough vote in Zimbabwe, but even that outcome will not mean a better resolve to the issues facing Zimbabwe today. I believe that Mugabe is a product of Zimbabwe, not the other way around. Where he came from, there are plenty waiting to be born even.

In short, there is this cascading and unstoppable chain of dominoes slowly falling, creating a vivid picture in its wake. The picture isn’t pretty, but in my view it isn’t unexpected. The electricity and infrastructure problems have been predicted by many sober thinkers decades ago. Simply take a template of any African country that gained independence and the picture will come to fruition here as well. In my view it is unavoidable. The timelines may differ but the outcome will be pretty much the same.

Now many folks are postulating that this is not such an easy thing to happen because there are far more whites here than anywhere else in Africa. I disagree with the statement. Yes, the residence of an extensive white population with a high prevalence of proper education and solid income distribution doesn’t have that big an impact on the outcome purely because it is exactly the tools the white community have that enables them to endeavour, develop, do business, do skilled labour and more that creates the political animosity that will in all likelihood lead to the problems I can foresee in South Africa few years down the line.
South Africa is dependent on the white community. It would not be the most successful African country had it not been for this presence. This is a fact. Yes, we have a lot of gold and a lot of other natural resources here, but the expertise to extract 99% of it came from the former European community. It would be a difficult argument to deny this country’s success on anything other than the existence of a large white community in South Africa. Does it earn the white community the right to special treatment? No. But it does earn them the right not to be messed with and to be left alone.

The unfortunate reality is that people will want what other people have. Especially if there is reason to believe they got it without working for it and by exploiting others.

The biggest tragedy of Apartheid was that it created the impression that white people in South Africa have what they have because they denied it to black people. It is a huge fallacy and one that I believe unfortunately cannot be overcome.

There is no indication that black South Africans would have the same level of development (meaning average education and wealth) as the white community had Apartheid not existed. There is certainly no example of this in the rest of Africa and certainly not in the United States of America or elsewhere.

Most of the super wealthy black people in South Africa got their wealth through political affiliation and connections. Most have been politicians themselves. I believe the figure to be close to 100% in fact. This is a problem.

There are some unspoken issues in this country that have become politically impolite but realistically pertinent to recognise.

The problem is, it won’t and for that reason alone this country doesn’t have what it takes to survive.
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You get at least 12 out of 10 for that post. The sad thing is that the current people in power can not see that things are falling apart.
 
That's the joy of Africa.

The "leaders" are incapable of leading anything.
They don't think beyond tomorrow, so when ultimately the crap hits the fan, they are completely taken by surprise.

Right now their way of thinking is approximately where Europe was in the 15th century. The church and state in that epoch concentrated all their efforts in grabbing power, without any thought as to the well being of the citizens that fed them and their war machines.

The difference is that Europe slowly moved away from this type of thinking - Africa shows no sign of this evolution (at least not yet).
 
zambussi said:
That's the joy of Africa.

The "leaders" are incapable of leading anything.
They don't think beyond tomorrow, so when ultimately the crap hits the fan, they are completely taken by surprise.

Right now their way of thinking is approximately where Europe was in the 15th century. The church and state in that epoch concentrated all their efforts in grabbing power, without any thought as to the well being of the citizens that fed them and their war machines.

The difference is that Europe slowly moved away from this type of thinking - Africa shows no sign of this evolution (at least not yet).
Click to expand...
The African Renaissance.

1500 onwards for Europe - 2000 onwards for Africa.

Take the History of The United Kingdom of Britain. Slowly but surely over the last few centuries the History of the British Isles has moved away from The King or Queen ruling the country to a Parliamentary Government where the Prime Minister and The Cabinet run the Country - like it should be. This way of Government lends proper control over the day to day running of the country and prevents a Mugabe Type Dictatorship and Tribal ways of thinking.
 
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BTTB said:
The African Renaissance.

1500 onwards for Europe - 2000 onwards for Africa.

Take the History of The United Kingdom of Britain. Slowly but surely over the last few centuries the History of the British Isles has moved away from The King or Queen ruling the country to a Parliamentary Government where the Prime Minister and The Cabinet run the Country - like it should be. This way of Government lends proper control over the day to day running of the country and prevents a Mugabe Type Dictatorship and Tribal ways of thinking.
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100% right.
 
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