Driving with headlights on

Archer said:
Ok smart people. If lights are the be all and end all of being seen why do I still not get seen with a freaking orange cover on my headlight, and 2 more spots to the side of it? It really doesnt get more out of the ordinary than that and yet the end result is the same. The root cause of the problem is not being addressed at all. You're just creating an environment where everyone will have lights, and everyone will then be just as "invisible" as they are now.
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Oh FFS - what is it with you Cape Town guys?

I hope that you realise that you are talking utter cr@p and you actually wrote that last sentence Tongue in Cheek! :rolleyes:

The pathetic arguments against lights are as pathetic as every other a s shat who tries to argue against a safety aspect built in to a car. The same crowd who think that safety belts are only for sissies, and who would much rather ride a motorbike without a helmet because it's your God given Right to be an idiot!

I've said it in this thread, and I'll say it again - as long as we have people who think that road safety in SA is for other people and not themselves, we will continue to have road deaths that are totally horrific!
 
Archer said:
The root cause of the problem is not being addressed at all. You're just creating an environment where everyone will have lights, and everyone will then be just as "invisible" as they are now.
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Until such an environment is created (and by your own logic) - it would be better to drive with lights on, thus taking advantage of the fact that it makes you more visible on roads where a lot of people aren't doing it.
 
So basically, you cant tell me why I'm still not seen regardless of riding around like a Christmas tree?

I'll say it again - getting everyone to put their lights on will in the short term reduce accidents, but in the long term we'll be back to where we are now (maybe worse since it'll make drivers even lazier). And imo, its laziness and inattentiveness that causes accidents. Not this BS about not being able to see stuff in broad daylight.
 
saor said:
Until such an environment is created, by your own logic - it would be better to drive with lights on, thus taking advantage of the fact that it makes you more visible on roads where a lot of people aren't doing it.
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And like I've said - it does sweet nothing, I'm still not seen. Did you not read the post in its entirety?
 
Archer said:
So basically, you cant tell me why I'm still not seen regardless of riding around like a Christmas tree?

I'll say it again - getting everyone to put their lights on will in the short term reduce accidents, but in the long term we'll be back to where we are now (maybe worse since it'll make drivers even lazier). And imo, its laziness and inattentiveness that causes accidents. Not this BS about not being able to see stuff in broad daylight.
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No. You're wrong. Everyone will be more visible.
It isn't about contrast with other drivers. It's about being more visible with lights on. Whether everyone does it or not, doesn't change the fact.
And just because you are more visible, doesn't mean you that people might still not see you.
 
Archer said:
Ok smart people. If lights are the be all and end all of being seen why do I still not get seen with a freaking orange cover on my headlight, and 2 more spots to the side of it? It really doesnt get more out of the ordinary than that and yet the end result is the same. The root cause of the problem is not being addressed at all. You're just creating an environment where everyone will have lights, and everyone will then be just as "invisible" as they are now.
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Wow ok...

visibility is not an on and off switch, its a percentage game
 
Archer said:
And like I've said - it does sweet nothing, I'm still not seen. Did you not read the post in its entirety?
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I did, but the statistically relevant decrease in accidents in large-scale implementations (http://www.arrivealive.co.za/pages.aspx?i=1819), is more relevant to my being willing to do it than is your own experience. I'll take my chances with those stats, even if it only decreases the odds of my being in an accident by a very small factor.

It's nothing for me to put my headlights on for the off-chance that it works as the stats seem to suggest it does.
 
And I'm NOT BEING SEEN despite everyone telling me more lights = being seen
 
Archer said:
Ok smart people. If lights are the be all and end all of being seen why do I still not get seen with a freaking orange cover on my headlight, and 2 more spots to the side of it? It really doesnt get more out of the ordinary than that and yet the end result is the same. The root cause of the problem is not being addressed at all. You're just creating an environment where everyone will have lights, and everyone will then be just as "invisible" as they are now.
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Because those are comatose drivers and would cause you issues even if you are in a car...
 
Nerfherder said:
Either that or he is the only person in the world with orange covers on his headlight
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+1 :p

Look, like I said earlier, I have nothing against DRLs. They are designed for day time use. But for normal headlights you say its attention grabbing, while for me its distracting. Sure, you could say thats just semantics but the difference is important. Are you ok with your odds that the comatose drivers magically seeing you are outweighed by the other set of comatose drivers who get distracted by headlights? At the end of the day DRLs have a different intensity and light spread than normal headlights (nevermind that most people deliberately point their headlights are far up as possible) and so yes, light can be used to make the road safer, but I disagree with the notion that headlights should be used for this (in an urban setting)
On the open road its a different story and I will gladly put my headlights on because it is often difficult to figure out if the car in the distance is coming or going.

And before someone links to that AA page again, those studies are in countries that barely see the sun. Of course adding light to what we call the middle of the night is going to improve road safety.
 
Fazda said:
Bollocks once again.

Amazing how you seem to think that your POV on this is the only logical one - this is a law in most FIRST World countries, where people actually consider road safety as being an important factor in their lives.

Lights are on TO BE SEEN - end of story - all you need is to drive a grey/silver car through mottled sunlight that you would get when trees are throwing shadows across the road, and see how quickly it disappears.

Sadly, it's people with attitudes like yours that will always screw up any attempt at road safety in SA.
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Haha... You'd get further banging your head against a wall :p

As you say, in most first-world countries it's illegal to drive with your headlights off.

It was a bit odd for me at first too but it makes sense from a safety perspective. It also means that come twilight people end up already having their lights on, so you don't end up with some chop driving around with his lights off in the dark because he didn't notice.

Also makes oncoming cars more visible when driving while facing the sun.

It's excellent.

I think most people against this kind of initiative are largely just people who are afraid of change or think it will somehow inconvenience them.

Since it's law out here, cars have their lights on by default. No inconvenience at all and driving on a road with other cars with their headlights on is perfectly normal and not irritating at all.
 
It doesn't bother me if others drive with their lights on. On occasion you do get the odd snot ball that will drive up your chuff during the day with his brights on (not flickering) which is just annoying and lets not forget the odd idiot here and there with rear fogs. But that's a topic for another thread.

The whole idea is to make you more visible on the road. It's law in places like Sweden, Norway and the UK(I stand to be corrected here) because during the winter months they don't have many hours of daylight and even during "daylight" its overcast and/or raining.
 
Archer said:
+1 :p

Look, like I said earlier, I have nothing against DRLs. They are designed for day time use. But for normal headlights you say its attention grabbing, while for me its distracting. Sure, you could say thats just semantics but the difference is important. Are you ok with your odds that the comatose drivers magically seeing you are outweighed by the other set of comatose drivers who get distracted by headlights? At the end of the day DRLs have a different intensity and light spread than normal headlights (nevermind that most people deliberately point their headlights are far up as possible) and so yes, light can be used to make the road safer, but I disagree with the notion that headlights should be used for this (in an urban setting)
On the open road its a different story and I will gladly put my headlights on because it is often difficult to figure out if the car in the distance is coming or going.
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On a well lit day I think a DRL is more noticeable than headlights as for the most part they are sharp white LED's or iridescent bulbs that imitate the same visual appearance as a headlight without lighting a path in front of them.

So in my mind this argument is invalid.

And on top of that, the shear fact that cars now come with DRL's is a perfect indicator that more light means more chance of being seen
 
Lycanthrope said:
Haha... You'd get further banging your head against a wall :p

As you say, in most first-world countries it's illegal to drive with your headlights off.

It was a bit odd for me at first too but it makes sense from a safety perspective. It also means that come twilight people end up already having their lights on, so you don't end up with some chop driving around with his lights off in the dark because he didn't notice.

Also makes oncoming cars more visible when driving while facing the sun.

It's excellent.

I think most people against this kind of initiative are largely just people who are afraid of change or think it will somehow inconvenience them.

Since it's law out here, cars have their lights on by default. No inconvenience at all and driving on a road with other cars with their headlights on is perfectly normal and not irritating at all.
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LOL - my frustration levels have reached a whole new high this afternoon! :p
 
M3mPh1z said:
On a well lit day I think a DRL is more noticeable than headlights as for the most part they are sharp white LED's or iridescent bulbs that imitate the same visual appearance as a headlight without lighting a path in front of them.

So in my mind this argument is invalid.

And on top of that, the shear fact that cars now come with DRL's is a perfect indicator that more light means more chance of being seen
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DRLs put out less light than headlights. BAM
Your entire argument of more light = more visible to other users is void.
And exactly why I'm ok with DRLs, but not with headlights.

Also, so the shear fact that more food comes out high in carbs means carbs must be good right? :rolleyes: Hint: business marketing machines rarely have your interests at heart.
 
Archer said:
DRLs put out less light than headlights. BAM
Your entire argument of more light = more visible to other users is void.
And exactly why I'm ok with DRLs, but not with headlights.

Also, so the shear fact that more food comes out high in carbs means carbs must be good right? :rolleyes: Hint: business marketing machines rarely have your interests at heart.
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A laser emits less light than a torch, which one do you think would be more distracting in your eye? Notice how I mentioned sharpness and white LED

And a safety feature cant be compared to a confectionery
 
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