Gautrain to open before SWC

[Sting]

I cannot wait for the route from ORTIA to either Bosman St or Hatfield to be complete, as it will mean I can skip the R21. Yes, I know the R21 is being upgraded but it has to do with the drivers using the road. To pay R100-200 to skip using the R21 is a pleasure!

I hope the feeder systems are in place or that the car rental companies open branches close to the end stations.

 

[Jagtiger]

I'm battling to find the 2010 Big Mac index showing local prices but I've found a 2008 one.

Big Mac UK £2.29
Big Mac SA R16.90

So the Gautrain trip is 5.9 Big Macs. The Heathrow Express cheapest ticket is 7.2 Big Macs. And SA has had higher inflation than the UK in the last two years so these old prices actually favour the UK.

http://www.theglobalguru.com/article.php?id=211&offer=guru001

I've already mentioned, that comparison by Big Mac or by simply comparing prices and transferring to other currency is not very accurate.
South African salary != UK salary.
Best way to determine is to measure how much it costs % of monthly salary in certain country.

 

[LancelotSA]

I've already mentioned, that comparison by Big Mac or by simply comparing prices and transferring to other currency is not very accurate.
South African salary != UK salary.
Best way to determine is to measure how much it costs % of monthly salary in certain country.

It is used by a lot of people who, I'm going to make an educated guess, are a far lot more qualified on the subject than you or I, as an indicator.

Salary is in fact not a clear indicator as even within this country you have large discrepancies in salaries paid between people in Durban and Johannesburg. Yet we all pay the same price for a Big Mac. And we'll all pay the same price if we catch this train. They don't adjust what you pay based on your salary.

 

[Pitbull]

I thought the Gautrain was built so people would use that instead of driving. But at R 100 one way I would gladly use my car instead thank you very much.

Another white elephant in the making....

 

[davemc]

Well done to the government who "encouraged" the contractors to finish earlier, instead of accepting the contractors initial offer of a massive price increase to finish earlier.
R100 is too steep, the competition, a minubus taxi, is R12-R22, I presume that that price is the gimmick price to make money out of the new tourist attraction, which is good.

 

[Pitbull]

Well done to the government who "encouraged" the contractors to finish earlier, instead of accepting the contractors initial offer of a massive price increase to finish earlier.
R100 is too steep, the competition, a minubus taxi, is R12-R22, I presume that that price is the gimmick price to make money out of the new tourist attraction, which is good.

+1 Listen if it's to make money off the tourists to cover some overheads I'm all for it. But unless it's at least R50 one way then I might as well drive my Bakkie which gives me almost 9KM's a litre. Thus it costs me R1 per KM meaning I can drive from Hatfield to Sandton for R 50 in a V6 bakkie for 1/2 the price it would be for taking the Guatrain

 

[SmartKit]

R100 is a bit steep. Hope that won't be the final price.

The median annual income of Black working adults aged 15-65 is R12,073. This train, much like the ANC's gravy train, it out of reach of the majority of this country.

 

[Ronjay]

There is just one problem with your theory Lancelotza, I don't live in Europe and don't give a toss what they pay for transport there. Why does everyone always point to Europe and how much they pay for things when someone complains, legitimately so, about high prices here in SA. This is as dishonest as an ANC politician giving a speech on service delivery. I most certainly don't want to pay R100 on a one way trip to Santon from the air port, tourists may find it cheap but I don't. This was supposed to be for public transport for SA'ns not tourists, that was what the politicians all said, but everyone knew they wher talking BS.

 

[JohnGalt]

What an intolerable bunch of whingers. The country is damned if it does and dammed is it doesn't. Before the world cup everyone is bitching because they don't fix roads and public transport. When they do everyone bitches too. That's right. Always make up your mind before anything is done that you're against it. Great way to ensure you always on the losing side.

 

[LancelotSA]

There is just one problem with your theory Lancelotza, I don't live in Europe and don't give a toss what they pay for transport there. Why does everyone always point to Europe and how much they pay for things when someone complains, legitimately so, about high prices here in SA. This is as dishonest as an ANC politician giving a speech on service delivery. I most certainly don't want to pay R100 on a one way trip to Santon from the air port, tourists may find it cheap but I don't. This was supposed to be for public transport for SA'ns not tourists, that was what the politicians all said, but everyone knew they wher talking BS.

...because this is an underground train system. What else would you compare it to? I also did not raise the issue of costs in the UK. Someone else did and I just provided the means to do a reasonable comparison.

As correctly stated by some this is the initial price. The same as it costs R50 to go up the arch at Moses Mabhida stadium. Why would I want to pay R50 to go up 30 floors in a lift? It is a tourists attraction. Once the novelty wears off, and some income has been made, I'm sure the prices will stabilise. The initial article does say : "For R100, World Cup visitors will be able to..."

 

[SmartKit]

What an intolerable bunch of whingers. The country is damned if it does and dammed is it doesn't. Before the world cup everyone is bitching because they don't fix roads and public transport. When they do everyone bitches too. That's right. Always make up your mind before anything is done that you're against it. Great way to ensure you always on the losing side.

Do pray tell how the average man in the street can afford to use this train? Or is this merely for the elite, a common theme in the ANC-led country. At R200 for a round trip this is NOT "public transport" (at least not for Joe Public).

 

[SmartKit]

...because this is an underground train system. What else would you compare it to? I also did not raise the issue of costs in the UK. Someone else did and I just provided the means to do a reasonable comparison.

As correctly stated by some this is the initial price. The same as it costs R50 to go up the arch at Moses Mabhida stadium. Why would I want to pay R50 to go up 30 floors in a lift? It is a tourists attraction. Once the novelty wears off, and some income has been made, I'm sure the prices will stabilise. The initial article does say : "For R100, World Cup visitors will be able to..."

Lance, being that this is public transport I would assume we could compare it to current public transport costs?

- A bus ticket is no where near this price, and a taxi most definitely isn't.
- For R300 I could go from OR Thambo to King Shaka, this train increases my traveling costs by 30%.

However, I hope you're right and this price is for the novelty/World Cup.

 

[JohnGalt]

double post.

 

[LancelotSA]

....

R12, R20, R80 A TICKET?

There is a lot to be said of the carrot-and-stick approach when it comes to public transport, explains Van der Merwe.

The carrot is that the Gautrain will offer a luxury option, as well as speed and safety.

“This makes it a viable option to travel between home and work.”

The stick part is the congestion on Gauteng’s roads.

“You don’t have to ask anyone who travels between Tshwane and Johannesburg about the delays they experience every day – nobody can calculate the duration of a trip anymore,” says Van der Merwe. “However, you can count on the fact that the Gautrain will take 38 minutes.”

However, there is another potentially bigger knopkierie on the table, he notes.

“The Gauteng freeways will be tolled from 2010. I don’t think the public has internalised this yet.

“Yes, there will be extra capacity on the highways, but all these new lanes will be high-occupancy vehicle lanes. Single car users will not be allowed to use them.”

Van der Merwe says the 50c to 60c toll payable for each kilometre from October next year means toll charges between Johannesburg and Tshwane for a daily commuter will run at around R1 000 a month.

“That is going to make an impact on the perceived cost of motoring.”

The Gauteng government has provided Bombela with a pricing envelop noting that Gautrain ticket prices should be more expensive than existing public transport – “which is subsidised, so it won’t be difficult” – but lower than the perceived cost of motoring, explains Van der Merwe.

Toll fees increase the perceived cost of motoring substantially, he adds.

A Gautrain pricing regime drawn up a few years ago determined that it would cost R12 to travel between Sandton and Rhodesfield stations, around R20 between Johannesburg and Tshwane, and R80 between OR Tambo International Airport and Sandton stations.

“There will be monthly, six-monthly and yearly loyalty cards, so we’re talking roughly R800 a month. I, myself, live in Pretoria and commute to Johannesburg every day, and it costs me R2 500 a month on diesel. Taking the Gautrain would be a bargain for me. It will be a solid economic proposition.”

The reason the airport link will be more expensive is that it will be a nonstop service, offering more spacious carriages to accommodate luggage.

“R80 is still cheap. The Heathrow (airport) express in London costs R225.

“If you land at OR Tambo today, and you take the taxi or the bus to Sandton, depending on the time of day, it can cost between R300 and R400,” says Van der Merwe.

However, the current Gautrain price regime was determined when the fuel price was still R4/l, and not the current, roughly, R7/l.

Will it really be this low when the Gautrain starts operating next year?

“We still have to finalise the prices – but we think it will remain around the order of R800 a month if you’re a regular user.”

Parking and Gautrain bus fares will be included in the pricing.

Van der Merwe adds that several Sandton companies have already requested buying tickets in bulk for their employees as part of an incentive scheme.

http://www.engineeringnews.co.za/ar...-answered-by-management-agency-ceo-2009-03-06

 

[JohnGalt]

Do pray tell how the average man in the street can afford to use this train? Or is this merely for the elite, a common theme in the ANC-led country. At R200 for a round trip this is NOT "public transport" (at least not for Joe Public).

I don't know on what they modeled their pricing. But clearly if it's not feasible to charge R200 they will drop the prices to what works. It's the readiness to take issue and throw hissy fits with absolutely anything aimed at progress in this country I find so self defeating and boring. It's the way losers think and it's a self fulfilling prophecy. It sucks being in a country with people with a loser mentality. It actively makes a person feel demotivated to try anything positive as people will be so ready to tell you how everything is futile. It seems people are paradoxically only happy here when everyone is miserable.

 

[dlk001]

Do pray tell how the average man in the street can afford to use this train? Or is this merely for the elite, a common theme in the ANC-led country. At R200 for a round trip this is NOT "public transport" (at least not for Joe Public).

The average man in the street cannot afford to fly and would never need a Gautrain to the airport to start with. This train is not meant for average man on the street.

 

[Ronjay]

I don't know on what they modeled their pricing. But clearly if it's not feasible to charge R200 they will drop the prices to what works. It's the readiness to take issue and throw hissy fits with absolutely anything aimed at progress in this country I find so self defeating and boring. It's the way losers think and it's a self fulfilling prophecy. It sucks being in a country with people with a loser mentality. It actively makes a person feel demotivated to try anything positive as people will be so ready to tell you how everything is futile. It seems people are paradoxically only happy here when everyone is miserable.

I am all for progress. I mean we are at the bottom of the ladder now, so it would be difficult for SA not to progress despite ANC efforts to F us up further, but I do see the Guatrain as becoming a white elephant I'm afraid. I'm not winging either. I would love to be proven wrong and the Gautrain succeeding but I can't see ayone paying so much for transport to their jobs, as a once in a blue moon touristy type jaunt maybe, but for work transport purposes, nah'ah. I'm not just complaining for the sake of complaining, if the price was cheape, I would love to have a better option to Santon then I have now. But I am not going to pay such a price for it. As for the promised mark down, I doubt it will be more then 10% and that would still be expensive. Again, Government approved the construction because it is supposed to be a project to aid in public transport for SA'ns but it looks like they where lying, Big surprise there.

 

[Diesal]

I have an Idea, if you really want to ride on a train, use a Metro rail train it is about (from me experience of tickets prices here in the Cape) R93 cheaper?

 

[blunomore]

1. Prices will remain the same after the SWC. According to the Gautrain spokesperson, prices are not adjusted for the SWC.

2. It does seem steep, but if you consider that you save traveling time and you can do work (read, work on your computer, etc etc) whilst traveling, it makes sense to pay the extra amount.

3. Also remember that, if you take the train to OR Tambo, you need not waste money and time on parking. The train terminus is right INSIDE the airport building, so you literally get out and proceed to check-in.

 

[JohnGalt]

I am all for progress. I mean we are at the bottom of the ladder now, so it would be difficult for SA not to progress despite ANC efforts to F us up further, but I do see the Guatrain as becoming a white elephant I'm afraid. I'm not winging either. I would love to be proven wrong and the Gautrain succeeding but I can't see ayone paying so much for transport to their jobs, as a once in a blue moon touristy type jaunt maybe, but for work transport purposes, nah'ah. I'm not just complaining for the sake of complaining, if the price was cheape, I would love to have a better option to Santon then I have now. But I am not going to pay such a price for it. As for the promised mark down, I doubt it will be more then 10% and that would still be expensive. Again, Government approved the construction because it is supposed to be a project to aid in public transport for SA'ns but it looks like they where lying, Big surprise there.

People need to disjoint associating government with everything. Even the world cup. The stadiums etc we were all assured would not be built on time etc because the A.N.C were inept are all there standing proudly and the A.N.C is soaking up the credit. Reality was I have met many of the people responsible for the planning and organising of these projects. Mostly Johnny white man. So even if they had failed the critique (of the A.N.C) would have been unfounded.

What people fail to appreciate is that we have a government voted in on a communist mandate, yet we remain 16 years later a vibrant capatalistic economy and society with neo free market practices. Government makes certain decisions but the implementation is almost always outsourced. Anyway the point is that hate the a.N.C to your hearts content. But stop associating anything positive with this country as a personal loss for you because the A.N.C seems less inept. If you get upset everytime something doesn't go wrong and secretly rejoice when it does then think about where that's going to lead you ? You're a South African and your fate is closely tied to that of this country. Unless of course you've left and you're an expat in which case why not keep your irrelevant opionions about my country to yourself ?

Back on topic. I think it's perfectly reasonable to assume to that if the price is not getting bums on board, they simple lower it. Wallah. No where's the drama ? Where's the cause for such needless pessimism ? Such an easily rectified scenario. But rather than thinking rationality and lookinf for solutions to easily fixed problems people throw their hands in the air as their first reaction screaming "The sky is falling". It's lame. South African's are becoming annoyingly lame.