Gay marriages bill approved

[noxibox]

"Quickly" crumpled!? Where did you get that from? Rome lasted 1200 or 2200 years (depending on your definition), and ancient Greece 1000. Which civilisations have come anywhere close to that?

It serves their purpose to pretend that the collapse of the Roman empire can be reduced to a simple cause. I remember hearing this repeatedly from teachers in religious indoctrination classes.

The truth is that those civilisations came apart slowly over a long time for a multitude of reasons.

 

[noxibox]

Can someone else explain why we must change the law for a minority?

And black people are a minority in the US so they really should have kept slavery. Thousands died fighting for a minority.

Anyway if it is such a minority why are some people panicking about a change in the law?

Is it one of the tenets of Christianity to oppress minorities?

 

[Highflyer_GP]

Since we're now living in a more accepting society, laws like this will become more widespread in more countries. Only a matter of time before religions follow suit and find a way of implementing it into their beliefs What will their followers of future generations then have to say? That because their religion now says that it's ok so now they're fine with it? Hmmm does the "earth orbitting the sun" or "witchcraft" issues ring a bell anyone?

 

[noxibox]

Yeah, why are white people allowed to own land and cars? They are the minority and these rights should be removed...

You know what white people are like. Do we really children having to grow up with two white parents? Probably best not to let them breed.

 

[Raithlin]

Do you wear Victorian clothes? Why not? It was normal to wear those clothes.

Do you keep slaves? It was once normal to keep slaves.


Reference?

I'm looking for the place I saw those stats. In the meantime...

www.marriagedebate.com/pdf/SSdivorcerisk.pdf

And for those of you that are questioning the conspiracy theory: http://www.family.org/cforum/feature/a0027070.cfm

 

[Raithlin]

And black people are a minority in the US so they really should have kept slavery. Thousands died fighting for a minority.

Anyway if it is such a minority why are some people panicking about a change in the law?

Is it one of the tenets of Christianity to oppress minorities?

No, I agree that slavery was bad. However, the slaves had not chosen it. That is a basic right. Same sex marriage - is that a basic right? We've already established that there is no proof either way that people are born gay...

Speaking of which, Google for Gay Marriage Statistics. Not many gay marraiges are happening in those countries/states that have legalised it. Then there are the divorce rates - you can Google for that too.

This is not an easy subject to research, by the way.

 

[Raithlin]

Because the rights of minorities get protected.

Welcome back.

Even if the minority is less than 1% (I'm talking gay households here - Google it)

"Quickly" crumpled!? Where did you get that from? Rome lasted 1200 or 2200 years (depending on your definition), and ancient Greece 1000. Which civilisations have come anywhere close to that?

They crumpled within 2-300 years of the decline in social values. I wasn't talking about the total reign of the empires. Oh, and none will ever come close to them.

Why is there a "right" or "wrong" attached to this? In what way does gay marriage harm anyone else?

See above post for agendas...

 

[Highflyer_GP]

No, I agree that slavery was bad. However, the slaves had not chosen it. That is a basic right. Same sex marriage - is that a basic right? We've already established that there is no proof either way that people are born gay

Well the constitution says that nobody shall be discriminated against. Denying gay people the right to marry is discrimination since they are entitled to the same rights as straight people. Let's forget about culture and religions for a second and talk about what is currently law. By giving preference to one group of people over the other means that you're discriminating against one group. Therefore gays should either be allowed to wed, or there should be a complete ban on marriage altogether so that nobody is discrimated against. Which would you prefer?

 

[Raithlin]

Well the constitution says that nobody shall be discriminated against. Denying gay people the right to marry is discrimination since they are entitled to the same rights as straight people. Let's forget about culture and religions for a second and talk about what is currently law. By giving preference to one group of people over the other means that you're discriminating against one group. Therefore gays should either be allowed to wed, or there should be a complete ban on marriage altogether so that nobody is discrimated against. Which would you prefer?

Very well put.

Look, I know it makes no difference what I say, and that the constitution is fair. It is also obvious that we place a huge amount of emphasis on fairness. But just because it is fair, doesn't always make it right IMO. Is it fair that a murderer gets to live, even when he has taken another life? Not to me. Yet it is so. Is it fair that a human being can be aborted without haveing a choice? Not to me. Yet it is so. Is it fair that people have to live with the consequences of apartheid? Not to me. Yet it is so. Is it fair that the rest of the world has decent broadband when we do not? Not to me.

Anyhow, you get the picture. We could go on for ever debating this topic. I for one have had my say, and once again, I have nothing against gay people. It's the activists behind it all IMO that are simply using a minority to get what they want - as usual. With that, I beg your leave. I'm going on my weekend now - I've been married for 10 years, and my wife and I intend to enjoy it.

 

[.geek]

This is a huge step backwards.
More children will now suffer the negative effects of not growing up with a mom and a dad - a mom and dad is needed to build the bonding between men and women, to build a healthy masculine identity and to help children grow into sexually responsible adults.

Gay men's commitments ("marriage") for example don't last long. A study of gay men in the Netherlands published in the AIDS journal of 2003 found that the average length of committed relationships lasted about 2 years. In addition, gay men in "marriage" had an average of 8 sexual partners in a year.

So then, if gay marriage is ok, then society will no longer regard marriage as a sexually exclusive, faithful relationship.
We will have even more STD's, hearts broken, abortions, etc.

There goes the neighbourhood.

I agree with this.

 

[Highflyer_GP]

Look, I know it makes no difference what I say, and that the constitution is fair. It is also obvious that we place a huge amount of emphasis on fairness. But just because it is fair, doesn't always make it right IMO. Is it fair that a murderer gets to live, even when he has taken another life? Not to me. Yet it is so. Is it fair that a human being can be aborted without haveing a choice? Not to me. Yet it is so. Is it fair that people have to live with the consequences of apartheid? Not to me. Yet it is so. Is it fair that the rest of the world has decent broadband when we do not? Not to me.

Fair point.

However we also have to bear in mind that all those point adversely affect the rights of others. Gays being allowing to marry doesn't

 

[chiskop]

I've been married for 10 years, and my wife and I intend to enjoy it.

Good for you. Why then do you want to prevent others from enjoying that kind of happiness?

 

[noxibox]

And for those of you that are questioning the conspiracy theory:

No reason to question any longer then...Focus on the Family are certifiable.

a civil status that in practice is not much short of a marriage
Interesting that even Sweden does not actually have same-sex marriage. We'll have to wait until a country actually implements same-sex marriage rather than something that is presented as not really marriage.

 

[LabAnimal]

Homosexuality has ALWAYS been around. In the past when man-woman marriages were "respected" (or should we say when they were the ONLY way), homosexual people were forced to marry someone of the opposite sex anyway, and maybe have secret affairs which is a shameful and dishonest thing to do and which causes much unhappiness both on the part of the homosexual person and on the part of their husband/wife should they be exposed.

Either that or remain single for life. For thousands of years people have lived in DENIAL, that homosexuality is a part of the human condition. All that's happened now is that society has become a little more realistic, and gay and lesbian people have a better chance at living a happy normal lifestyle with the person they love.

What's worse for a child: having openly gay parents, or having to deal with the shock and family crisis that arises when one of your parents is unexpectedly "exposed" in an extra-marital affair (be it a gay or straight one)?

10 out of 10!!!!!

 

[LabAnimal]

I vote for a lesbian police force (umm...)

In fact, studies have shown that people can change their sexual orientation at will - successfully.

OH rubish. People change their sexual orientation to please the majority to fit in, just climbing back into the closet to live in denial!!!

It does not rule out the fact that some people are bisexual and being with the opposite sex or not doesnt matter to them either way.

As for being born that way - there is more and more evidence that it is indeed genetic - but as you say, not a proven fact just yet, but enough to prove you wrong IMO.

Me : yes, I'm gay - It makes no difference to me if i'm born this way inclined or not. I grew up in a wonderful loving home, no abuse, no undercover sexual agenda's "keeping it in the family" as some would say, I just found guys to be my preference - simple as that. Yes, there was pressure to fit in and have had a girlfriend etc... Yea, been there done that - and NO Thanks - not my plate of fish thanx. I'm just not built that way.

I do not agree to conform to what society deems normal, and will not live a lie to please others. ...and here is the only choice: not to lie and cover up my true feelings. I could not live with myself if was seeing some guy on the side wile mrs was tending to the kids, and lying to the family etc - All the same if it was a completely hetro setup and i was messing with another woman - its just wrong. Your wife/husband/kids does not deserved to be F**d around like that.

As for Marrage - No - i actually don't believe that Gay people should stupe that low to conform to the ideals from which the anti gay society is fighting so hard to keep us away from!! BUT, its nice to have the freedome to choose to go that route.

As for the MR & MRS title - Mr & Mr is just fine - I'm no flapping queen, however my otherhalf is, but that's him - and he's quite happy with the MR title as i am. As I am, I long to be with a Man, not a Woman or Woman Wannabe! - a man in a frock scares me to no end - just not right - but, out of all fairness and respect to the transexual bunch "Sweetie, choose another frock, it aint your colour!"

Children - for me - Nothanks, my cats are my children, and handful enough. IT doesnt mean Gay couples should not have the right to adopt. Gay people just as much str8 people go thru a screening process to find out if they are suiteable parants etc. and even if a boy or a girl is placed with same sexed couples doesnt mean they will choose to act or be the same - absolute rubish!. But again, the choice granted to everybody suiteable to adopt is a gift to a child for a future that could not have been, no matter how "skew" or "stable" some might label it.

The whole plot thing to get rid of marrages... ... ... Can i have a drag of what you're smoking... common. Someone is clearly bored. Even if so, doesnt mean you have to subscribe to that trash.

So at the end of all this, I don't give a shyte who knows what a flapper i may or may not be. Myself and the rest of the Pink "Family" only want exceptance. And to those who don't, keep off my lawn, you're not welcome in my world until you deal with your insecurities, and admit your own denial.

So ₣ag to you too

P.S. No, the average gay relationship is not 2 years, its 2 weeks - LOL - Mine... : close to 14 years and going strong

 

[Highflyer_GP]

LOL good one LA, found the "admit your own denial" part amusing

 

[LabAnimal]

oh another thing i find amusing : How some homophobes things that gay people are out to try convert them - i mean really! - you might be DAMN good looking, and get us all rattled and happy - but the truth of it all, I for one respect that fact that you're str8, and have a weakness for chasing skirts! and what most homophobes don't even realise is that its a compliment when you're getting the lookover - enjoy it, oldage isnt far off and i doubt you'd be getting those looks. As for your girlfriend - excellent gossup conversation makers - you should be proud!.

 

[Highflyer_GP]

Hehe problem is girls being the cat-like creatures that they are, are bound to find something to get jealous about. If I dared telling my girlfriend that a guy was checking me out, she'd laugh and then a few days later bring it up again and probably tell me something ridiculous like "if you noticed him looking at you, that means you were looking at him too. Is there something you're not telling me? Am I no longer good enough for you? Was I that bad that you turned gay on me? Blah blah blah" Gotta love it though, I love it when she rants, very funny stuff!

Anyway back on topic I agree with you about everything relating to acceptance. Btw was only kidding about the title thing earlier, I know that a title is defined firstly by one's gender and then by qualification

 

[LabAnimal]

Hehe problem is girls being the cat-like creatures that they are, are bound to find something to get jealous about. If I dared telling my girlfriend that a guy was checking me out, she'd laugh and then a few days later bring it up again and probably tell me something ridiculous like "if you noticed him looking at you, that means you were looking at him too. Is there something you're not telling me? Am I no longer good enough for you? Was I that bad that you turned gay on me? Blah blah blah" Gotta love it though, I love it when she rants, very funny stuff!

Anyway back on topic I agree with you about everything relating to acceptance. Btw was only kidding about the title thing earlier, I know that a title is defined firstly by one's gender and then by qualification

LOL - you know - I don't have that problem! when i'm being looked at or looking, my other half joins me and we compare notes : ) - Just love it

 

[VQuest]

Great news for same sex couples who also deserve equal rights. Well done.

Tolerance does not cost a thing. If more people showed tolerance to people who were different from them, this world would be a much safer and better place for all.