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Question of the Day: Are you keeping your Prime subscription?
Jonny Two Shoes
Expert Member
And my prediction is coming true 
I remember I said in some other thread a while ago that by 2010 Microsoft OS will fall and be taken over by another OS in popularity. I was probably wrong though because I thought it would be Linux and not Apple.
I also said Coca-Cola would be taken over by a new drink during the WCup...lets see what happens
lol anyway back on topic..I really really hate the look and feel of Vista - I think many share the same opinion. Now they are making Win7 almost identical in looks?
I remember I said in some other thread a while ago that by 2010 Microsoft OS will fall and be taken over by another OS in popularity. I was probably wrong though because I thought it would be Linux and not Apple.
I also said Coca-Cola would be taken over by a new drink during the WCup...lets see what happens
lol anyway back on topic..I really really hate the look and feel of Vista - I think many share the same opinion. Now they are making Win7 almost identical in looks?
<moLe>
Expert Member
and in the shadows far far away..slowly but surely Linux is gaining in popularity, not necessarily because its more user friendly than mac, not even because its more power full..nay just because the majority of the world can't really afford mac. Many South American governments are crossing over towards "ubuntu'ish" environments. Cause it is proving to be a quite competent substitute to windows.
And it runs just fine on what in a windows environment would be considered out dated hardware. Vista is to big of an resource hog, not stable enough to valuate its price, and its interface to alien for allot of people migrating from XP. Ubuntu will continue to evolve...its inevitable.
And it runs just fine on what in a windows environment would be considered out dated hardware. Vista is to big of an resource hog, not stable enough to valuate its price, and its interface to alien for allot of people migrating from XP. Ubuntu will continue to evolve...its inevitable.
zamicro
Expert Member
- Joined
- Oct 22, 2007
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I did not know that we had MANY governments. I thought we have only one!
As this thread is doomed from a start I thought I would start the derailing...
The_Unbeliever
Honorary Master
oops...
thought we're discussing the Hobbit here...
Anyways, this is getting interesting...
We'll have to wait and see what happens whether Windows7 will deliver up to the promises made...
I consider myself a fairly big Linux supporter (not that big an OsX fan), having installed and recommended it to countless people. That being said I don't see windows being taken over or dissapearing for years to come.
Vista is actually not that bad an OS. We have hundreds of installations running in our environment. There have not been stability issues, and users have not been complaining about usability issues (for the most part).
Windows have a couple of things going for it in the long run:
1.) Driver support for windows is outstanding. After years, some drivers are still very unstable under linux, especially for some network drivers (wired, wireless). They can sometimes be sorted out with a lot of effort and advanced troubleshooting, normally beyond the capabilities of John Doe. On OsX this isn't an issue. I'm still having an uphill battle with my graphics and wireless drivers under ubuntu.
2.) Enterprise support. Companies that have spent millions on Microsoft infrastructure won't leave their investment easily.
3.) Gamer support. A huge chunk of PC games are now based on Direct3D, with opengl support a distant thought. I'm still waiting for the promised linux port of some games. Wine is not an ideal solution, as a lot of games still run with glitches. We need proper linux ports.
4.) Commercial applications support. Autocad, photoshop anyone?
I would like to see Linux becoming the dominant OS, but there's a long way to go.
Vista is actually not that bad an OS. We have hundreds of installations running in our environment. There have not been stability issues, and users have not been complaining about usability issues (for the most part).
Windows have a couple of things going for it in the long run:
1.) Driver support for windows is outstanding. After years, some drivers are still very unstable under linux, especially for some network drivers (wired, wireless). They can sometimes be sorted out with a lot of effort and advanced troubleshooting, normally beyond the capabilities of John Doe. On OsX this isn't an issue. I'm still having an uphill battle with my graphics and wireless drivers under ubuntu.
2.) Enterprise support. Companies that have spent millions on Microsoft infrastructure won't leave their investment easily.
3.) Gamer support. A huge chunk of PC games are now based on Direct3D, with opengl support a distant thought. I'm still waiting for the promised linux port of some games. Wine is not an ideal solution, as a lot of games still run with glitches. We need proper linux ports.
4.) Commercial applications support. Autocad, photoshop anyone?
I would like to see Linux becoming the dominant OS, but there's a long way to go.
Gatecrasher
Executive Member
- Joined
- Jan 11, 2005
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I did not know that we had MANY governments. I thought we have only one!
As this thread is doomed from a start I thought I would start the derailing...
Why make your subtext smaller when you already have problems reading normal sized text?
South American
Giarc86
Expert Member
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lol lol
BravoDrie
Well-Known Member
Here we go...
I have had Vista on 4 Machines since it has been released. 2 laptops 2 pcs
Not one hassle, not one blue screen. One hassle was a 5year old tv turner card that didn't want to work in MCE. Hardly MS's problem.
Tried Ubuntu 8.03 (i think) a while back, boy what a hassle - and guys I dont consider typing commands in a terminal window a good O/S. Oh, and saw a Ubuntu computer freeze this morning at a supplier - so much for unbreakable linux.
Mac, yeah well, my calculator never breaks either cause its always has the same hardware configuration and I never open it up for upgrades.
The only legit claim about Vista is it bloated like hell, I mean really, I don't want the sidebar there by default, I don't want all those services running and don't need diagnostics service to run all the time, I don't want windows mail installed by default, I don't want.... get the picture.
I have had Vista on 4 Machines since it has been released. 2 laptops 2 pcs
Not one hassle, not one blue screen. One hassle was a 5year old tv turner card that didn't want to work in MCE. Hardly MS's problem.
Tried Ubuntu 8.03 (i think) a while back, boy what a hassle - and guys I dont consider typing commands in a terminal window a good O/S. Oh, and saw a Ubuntu computer freeze this morning at a supplier - so much for unbreakable linux.
Mac, yeah well, my calculator never breaks either cause its always has the same hardware configuration and I never open it up for upgrades.
The only legit claim about Vista is it bloated like hell, I mean really, I don't want the sidebar there by default, I don't want all those services running and don't need diagnostics service to run all the time, I don't want windows mail installed by default, I don't want.... get the picture.
rwenzori
Honorary Master
I *think* so - "Vista is k@k", right??
Wrong vista is not *** but i think MS could do a lot beter they should learn from blizzard. Only bring out a product when it is done.
tjunyat
Senior Member
Having moved to linux many years back, yet still being required to know a certain amount about Windows, the major issue with Vista for me was the user interface.
It's counter-intuitive from all previous versions (I feel the same way about Office 2007).
It's very painful and difficult, for even an experienced user (without googling all over the place) to find a way to turn off all the default crud, and make it look/feel like XP or a previous interface that everyone is used to.
The second largest issue is the bloatware factor and amount of resources required.
The fact that Apple is now streamlining their OS gives me hope that MS might catch on to the idea and do the same.
It's counter-intuitive from all previous versions (I feel the same way about Office 2007).
It's very painful and difficult, for even an experienced user (without googling all over the place) to find a way to turn off all the default crud, and make it look/feel like XP or a previous interface that everyone is used to.
The second largest issue is the bloatware factor and amount of resources required.
The fact that Apple is now streamlining their OS gives me hope that MS might catch on to the idea and do the same.
<moLe>
Expert Member
wow...you truly are my new hero
Ok maybe not my hero anymore...ubuntu though not perfect can do way more than your little vista. At this stage and point of the game I'm going to assume you are one of those guys that like pain and torture, who gets turned on by chicks with whips in their hands. NOBODY likes vista..(apart from u that is)..its rubbish. All four your computers are probably crawling at start up. whould have understood if u defended XP, not that I'm an XP fan, but after sp2 it was atleast almost useable..and now in your ignorance u are turning around and blaming Ubuntu for giving u the power of the terminal? surely u are a retard and a sod
Look buddy, once again u are proving just how minute your mind are..Mac sure as hell havent been using the same hardware configuration..
And guess what cause vista is ****, there really is nothing u can do about it. Unfortunately for someone of your inteligence (just my opinion based on your post) there is no alternative..live with it..enjoy using your computer at crawling speeds
BravoDrie
Well-Known Member
wow...you truly are my new hero
Ok maybe not my hero anymore...ubuntu though not perfect can do way more than your little vista. At this stage and point of the game I'm going to assume you are one of those guys that like pain and torture, who gets turned on by chicks with whips in their hands. NOBODY likes vista..(apart from u that is)..its rubbish. All four your computers are probably crawling at start up. whould have understood if u defended XP, not that I'm an XP fan, but after sp2 it was atleast almost useable..and now in your ignorance u are turning around and blaming Ubuntu for giving u the power of the terminal? surely u are a retard and a sod
Look buddy, once again u are proving just how minute your mind are..Mac sure as hell havent been using the same hardware configuration..
And guess what cause vista is ****, there really is nothing u can do about it. Unfortunately for someone of your inteligence (just my opinion based on your post) there is no alternative..live with it..enjoy using your computer at crawling speeds
Whow buddy... bit frustrated with that driver you can't get going there buddy? Take deep breath a relax a bit, you'll get it right eventully.
Firstly those are my personal pcs, there's a lot more running at clients - perfectly, and they run fine and fast thank you very much for asking.
Oh and Ubuntu not perfect? Wow, and I did insist that Windows IS perfect. But I am very curious though, what exactly is it that Ubuntu can do what Windows cannot?
You really think that using Terminal is good, I am really ignorant, but you know what they say - it's bliss.
I must agree and apologise about the Mac insert, they have been upgrading their hardware and still is better at compatibility than Linux.
And since somebody with your superior intelligence - and my inferior intelligence, as you so profoundly illustrated - always write garbage like you did, it's little wonder that nobody wants to use your holy grail of computing, cause nobody will ever have the intelligence to use your software.
Have a nice day, buddy.
rwenzori
Honorary Master
Vista aren't k@k then????? I'm not be believing you. Vista are the worstest POS from MS since Windows 1.01!
<moLe>
Expert Member
No actually, unlike u in your windows environment, I didnt need to install one driver yet on ubuntu..yes on Gentoo I had need too, but thats self explanatory.
Clients, people let u touch they're PC's? after installing vista on some poor sods pc? No just a business tip, if u want return business I'll advise u to install XP on your clients PC's, and to tell them to wait,hope and pray that windows 7 delivers.
---Play *.wma files without Windows media refusing and nagging you that you don't have the rights.....
---convert midi files so that you can burn them to cd.... (well, in my experience I found a proggie that would do it in Windows but they wanted $30 and timidity was free)...
---scan a buddies' hard disk for viruses without worrying about catching them yourself.....
--- And as far as my kids are concerned, between the two operating systems, my kids can crash Windows in a heartbeat without even trying, but they have yet to even faze a linux install... which is what first got my attention when I started playing with it years ago :lolflag:
---Update software on multiple computers from a local cache (using apt-cacher) WITHOUT requiring all the BS of a Win2k3 licence and a MS SUS server
---Perform flashy effects on my 1.8Ghz laptop with 512Mb ram without killing it or even slowing it down (in fact, it feels faster using compiz
)---Allow recovery from a bad programming mistak e in c++ that causes a program to recursively call itself all the time *embarrased*... using the linux magic keys i can shutdown all the gui stuff using alt+sys rq+r & alt+sys rq+e, get back to command line, then a quick sudo /etc/init.d/dbus restart, sudo /etc/init.d/gdm restart to get back into the GUI
---Remote debugging for a friend via ssh+tunnelling... since linux is CLI based it means most problems can be diagnosed and repaired using ssh+shell... the equiavlent setup in windows using VNC or remote desktop doesn't function well when you need to work on a 128Kbps connection :S
---Proper thread seperation! So when one of my applications crash, I DON'T LOSE THE WHOLE OPERATING SYSTEM
---i can continue..should I ?
Hmm..once even in windows to get the most out out your operating system one uses comand prompt / terminal...no matter how advanced computers and user interfaces will get I doubt if anything whould ever rival the "text input method'
yes u should..you think I'm bad? U havent met the linux fan boys yet heheI must agree and apologise about the Mac insert, they have been upgrading their hardware and still is better at compatibility than Linux.
What can I say I have my days
Have a nice day, buddy.[/QUOTE]
Same to you
BravoDrie
Well-Known Member
No actually, unlike u in your windows environment, I didnt need to install one driver yet on ubuntu..yes on Gentoo I had need too, but thats self explanatory.
Clients, people let u touch they're PC's? after installing vista on some poor sods pc? No just a business tip, if u want return business I'll advise u to install XP on your clients PC's, and to tell them to wait,hope and pray that windows 7 delivers.
Been running for over a year, good returns.
---Play *.wma files without Windows media refusing and nagging you that you don't have the rights.....
Only if the file was encoded with DRM on.
---convert midi files so that you can burn them to cd.... (well, in my experience I found a proggie that would do it in Windows but they wanted $30 and timidity was free)...
Not Windows problem, talk to software vendors. Besides midi... really?
---scan a buddies' hard disk for viruses without worrying about catching them yourself.....
You are able to do this with certain software, not OS issue.
--- And as far as my kids are concerned, between the two operating systems, my kids can crash Windows in a heartbeat without even trying, but they have yet to even faze a linux install... which is what first got my attention when I started playing with it years ago :lolflag:
Keep your kids away from computers, is just don't give them admin right, then again you could always use system restore.
---Update software on multiple computers from a local cache (using apt-cacher) WITHOUT requiring all the BS of a Win2k3 licence and a MS SUS server
Actually, you can.
---Perform flashy effects on my 1.8Ghz laptop with 512Mb ram without killing it or even slowing it down (in fact, it feels faster using compiz
Well, this relates to Windows being bloated, which is not in dispute.
---Allow recovery from a bad programming mistak e in c++ that causes a program to recursively call itself all the time *embarrased*... using the linux magic keys i can shutdown all the gui stuff using alt+sys rq+r & alt+sys rq+e, get back to command line, then a quick sudo /etc/init.d/dbus restart, sudo /etc/init.d/gdm restart to get back into the GUI
When is the last time you actually used windows? Ctrl+Shift+Escape, kill process.
---Remote debugging for a friend via ssh+tunnelling... since linux is CLI based it means most problems can be diagnosed and repaired using ssh+shell... the equiavlent setup in windows using VNC or remote desktop doesn't function well when you need to work on a 128Kbps connection :S
Don't have experiance with remote debugging. But as far as I know VS does have remote debugging capabilities but how far that goes I dunno.
---Proper thread seperation! So when one of my applications crash, I DON'T LOSE THE WHOLE OPERATING SYSTEM
Errmmm, Apps (third parties, nothing to do with windows) crash all the time, never lost the whole OS?
---i can continue..should I ?
Please so
Hmm..once even in windows to get the most out out your operating system one uses comand prompt / terminal...no matter how advanced computers and user interfaces will get I doubt if anything whould ever rival the "text input method'
yes u should..you think I'm bad? U havent met the linux fan boys yet hehe
What can I say I have my days
Have a nice day, buddy.
Same to you
[/QUOTE]UglyKidJoe
Well-Known Member
@BravoDrie
Dude, I wouldn't bother getting sucked into a debate with <moLe>. Though he claims to be of superior intelligence to anyone else in the world except Linus Torvalds, that alone should tell you he is anything but. He can get really nasty if you haven't sworn an oath to defend Linux to the death.
The general spirit here is one of mutual interest in ITC, as well as differences, but also a respect for fellow members. That's the way it should be.
So don't be put off this forum, you'll find most people here are really cool and very knowledgeable about the ITC situation in SA.
Welcome and enjoy
Dude, I wouldn't bother getting sucked into a debate with <moLe>. Though he claims to be of superior intelligence to anyone else in the world except Linus Torvalds, that alone should tell you he is anything but. He can get really nasty if you haven't sworn an oath to defend Linux to the death.
The general spirit here is one of mutual interest in ITC, as well as differences, but also a respect for fellow members. That's the way it should be.
So don't be put off this forum, you'll find most people here are really cool and very knowledgeable about the ITC situation in SA.
Welcome and enjoy
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All I can say it that Linux rocks, but they need to sort out driver issues, and get commercial software companies on board. With Linux you may not need to install any drivers, but the quality of the driver is never guaranteed. Until I can run my laptop without hassle, it will be Vista for me (which works very well for me). Oh, and I don't want to reboot to windows every time I want to play a game.
All my servers are Linux, as it is still the bomb when it comes to management, automation and reliability. But then again, drivers aren't normally an issue on the server.
OSX is dead to me. I fail to see why I need to buy overpriced hardware just to get their OS. Hacked OSX on ordinary pc's don't work out as the hardware support is non existent.
All my servers are Linux, as it is still the bomb when it comes to management, automation and reliability. But then again, drivers aren't normally an issue on the server.
OSX is dead to me. I fail to see why I need to buy overpriced hardware just to get their OS. Hacked OSX on ordinary pc's don't work out as the hardware support is non existent.