Gnarls
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Who was a former Dreyer student btw. Why is property no longer an investment pray tell.
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Question of the Day: Have you ever ordered a product online and received a fake knock-off?
Hannes Dreyer - Wealth Creator
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Who was a former Dreyer student btw. Why is property no longer an investment pray tell.
TheMightyQuin
Not amused...
These types of courses and especially software, is available for fee on the internet.
TheMightyQuin
Not amused...
So you paid twice for this information?
Gnarls
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And how would you know what to look for if you're financially illiterate? Also, what is the opportunity cost of doing all this research on your own? I'd rather just pay once and sit in a class and ask questions until I understand.
That's a bit disingenious considering you have no idea what my major was or why I wanted to study.
Hamster
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Because the property market is struggling and you get higher returns through other investments AT the moment.
They also recently showed that the average ROI on renting is about 3%
Stefanmuller
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I presume you are referring to s13sex properties? Well I know about it because I have clients that make use of such deductions.
Why I relate this guy's product with the "earn from home" schemes, is because essentially you pay for a product you only really know what its about once you have paid. And then you sit with this "program" or "literature" that is just a collection of theoretically good business/finance principles that may work or may not, or takes considerably longer and more resources and effort than what was "promised" when applied to yourself in real life. So they sell it as a fool proof guaranteed quick fix to riches when practically their is more to it in real life.
Take for example the sec13sex thing. I could sell it to you as a sure fire risk free way to own property by using SARS to finance it for you so that it does not cost you a cent. In fact, it will make you money from day 1. You can even buy yourself 5 or 10 (or in Hannes's case 48 or what have you) and make thousands of positive cash flow from the first month.
I have not told a single lie in the above paragraph, but I have also not told the whole truth. First of all, SARS will only start "subsidizing" once you own 5 properties. To own 5 properties you not only have to qualify for 1 bond, but 5 bonds, of which only the first will likely be a 100% bond. The rest you will have to put down a deposit, and that is if you qualify for the amounts you will have to loan. So it is clear that you either have to earn around R80k per month and have some savings lying around to cover your deposits, OR you have to start small with one property and accumulate the rest of the properties over time, as your salary increases or as your bond facility gets room to refinance a deposit on another unit. Point being, you at the very least still need to qualify for a bond on at least one property to get started. And take the risk of possibly having to cover 1 months rent in the event of a defaulting tenant or a few grand here and there for a burst geyser or other maintenance. Easy if you have money available to spend, but not for the guy who starts off now from scratch. It also does not work on just any property, you need to carefully select the property - not only does it have to be a new development, it also needs to be in the price range and area where the rental return is maximised so as to eliminate any shortfall or to turn the shortfall into a positive cash flow. Now if I told you that beforehand, it does not sound as "wow", so I only tell you the info in my first paragraph, and then tell you the rest after you pay me R5 000 for the rest of the info.
For most of the wealth creation seminar type of stuff, you need to have money first to make more money, or you need to start small and only make a return over a few years of building it up. It is easy if you have money to make more money - and this they don't tell you. And more often than not, the people who end up going to these programs are people who do not have a lot of money in the first place, and are looking for a quick way to get some wealth. Paying R8 000 or whatever for the course only to find out that you have to start from scratch and either need some money to invest, or that it will take a few years or hard work or have financial risk involved, that is a lot of money.
It may be that he did do all the things that he claims, but is it the full truth? And did he do it from scratch or after already being rich or having access to funds to use as security? Buying something for R5 000 000 and flipping it for R10 000 000 the next day does not mean it cost you nothing.
The stuff that he promises and brags about just leaves a bad taste - such as "bought 48 properties in 92 days" or turn "R1 000 into R10 000 000 in 5 years". How did he do it? How does he measure it? Am I guarenteed to also be able to do this? How much money do I need to invest? Has anyone else bought the program, followed it, and also bought 48 properties in 92 days? Maybe 20 properties? Maybe 10? Maybe 5? How much did they invest? Did anyone else make R10 000 000 following his program from just R1 000 within 5 years? Maybe R5 000 000? Maybe R1 000 000? R100 000? How many tried it and did not make R8 000 in 5 years?
Gnarls
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^Thanks for the logical reply Stefan. I'm not talking about s13sex properties - never hear of them - but as you mentioned it before going on the property course I had no idea that I could use SARS to help fund the shortfall on my property. I had started my education with the rich dad poor dad books but I had no idea how to apply this in a South African context and the property course helped me to see how it all fits together.
I understand this but it was made abundantly clear in the course that you're not here to learn the tricks of the trade but rather the trade. As I've said, the first thing I was taught was that you're always going to be learning. The second is to keep your risk low by always looking at the cashflow. I'm under no illusions that property investment is hard work but my issue is this, if I pay the money and do the course and find value from it, why the vitriol?
Also, Hannes course gave me a strategy to find decent properties by using sites like windeed and gave me practical skills in negotiation.
Please point me in the direction of this article? You qualify your statement with at the moment. Business cycles was another one of the concepts that I learned in that course. Also, I've seen people make good money on property. As an example, the colleague I refered to earlier bought a house on a massive erf. He spent some cash subdividing the property, sold the subdivision and paid the profit into the other property. It seems like you're looking at property from a very narrow perspective as there are a myriad of factors that could influence a properties cashflow.
I understand this but it was made abundantly clear in the course that you're not here to learn the tricks of the trade but rather the trade. As I've said, the first thing I was taught was that you're always going to be learning. The second is to keep your risk low by always looking at the cashflow. I'm under no illusions that property investment is hard work but my issue is this, if I pay the money and do the course and find value from it, why the vitriol?
Also, Hannes course gave me a strategy to find decent properties by using sites like windeed and gave me practical skills in negotiation.
Please point me in the direction of this article? You qualify your statement with at the moment. Business cycles was another one of the concepts that I learned in that course. Also, I've seen people make good money on property. As an example, the colleague I refered to earlier bought a house on a massive erf. He spent some cash subdividing the property, sold the subdivision and paid the profit into the other property. It seems like you're looking at property from a very narrow perspective as there are a myriad of factors that could influence a properties cashflow.
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Stefanmuller
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Sure - I am just saying I do not like what he claims, or rather the manner in which he makes his claims on his site. I am also not saying he is spewing rubbish in his courses. Like I illustrated with my example with the sec13sex scheme above, you can advertise something in a way that looks a lot more attractive than it actually is, without actually lying, but rather either not telling the full truth or selecting to only give certain bits of info. My gripe is his method of selling - sketching this picture of making R10 000 000 from nothing in no time, and buying 48 properties in less time it takes you to get your property registered and then selling you all this for R8k or whatever it is. But 5 years down the line you are not going to have R10 000 000. Not even R2 000 000. It is possible using his techniques, but highly highly unlikely. Hundreds of small tips that can help, but not a "foolproof method".
It is a bit like buying a book on magic. They explain how to do the tricks but it takes years of hard work to perfect. Or like buying a guitar book. It shows you exactly all the techniques that will allow you to play like Jimi Hendrix, but it will take hours and hours of practice, and some talent. If you are not a Jimmy Hendrix after 5 years, maybe you did not practice enough. Or me giving you a training program and diet for Usain Bolt. Doesn't mean you will break the 100m record in 5 years. A lot of it has to do about personality (like bargaining for example, and being assertive in making deals, or the amount of risk you are willing to take). So in short - I bet he has some valuable lessons - is it worth the bucks paid? I don't know. The only reason most bought it is because they hoped there is a quick recipe to make them quick money (cause that is what the add say). And you will only find out what the "program" is really about after you paid the money. So people take a chance and go for it. Profit.
Hamster
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Gnarls
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Interesting because:
http://www.bdlive.co.za/business/pr...ill-too-afraid-of-buy-to-let-as-an-investment
So who do we believe?
Hamster
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We are straying off topic, but we should belief the math. If you can buy a property cash with no or a minimal home loan things might be different. There is also the long term benefit of owning an asset that come into play but that has depreciating or changes landscapes that can counter it. A guy posted on the forum the other day that a flat he bought in Windsor ages ago he is now willing to give away for free as long as transfer costs are covered by the buyer - the area became that bad over the years.
To get back on topic - there is a chance this Hannes guy might be legit and helpful, but chances are he is not.
If he helped you realize a better future for yourself then it was worth it for you, mate.
EDIT: I must've been thoroughly high or drunk when I wrote this. "Belief" me.
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L
Leonidas
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Great guy. Awesome guy. Stand-up guy.
Do everything he asks of you to the letter, including giving him your backing details (including your username, pin code and security password and reference).
Do everything he asks of you to the letter, including giving him your backing details (including your username, pin code and security password and reference).
yebocan
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TheMightyQuin
Not amused...
"A fool and his money............................."
How much is the course?
Rather subscribe to a few decent podcasts and devote x amount of time each day toward achieving one of your goals.
I have read the other similar threads about Hannes Dreyer on this forum and there is something just not right here.
I cant put my finger on it.Perhaps he can tell us the number of properties he purchased and sold the last 5 years.
By the way i attended one of his meetings.He loves using the "F" word ,never mind his wife and ladies being present.
( Note, i dont sing in my church choir)
I cant put my finger on it.Perhaps he can tell us the number of properties he purchased and sold the last 5 years.
By the way i attended one of his meetings.He loves using the "F" word ,never mind his wife and ladies being present.
( Note, i dont sing in my church choir)
You ain't gonna be wealthy if you only swear in the presence of men.
Anyway - I'm curious about the cost of his course? Probably some ridiculous amount.
L
Leonidas
Guest
For someone to be rich, it per definition means that 10 or 100 people have to be poor.
Capitalism for all the hype and good testimonies doesn't and cannot give wealth to 100% of a society.
Some say that capitalism and technological development will one day easily provide in everybody's need.
Horse****, I say.
The little technical economic phenomenon called INFLATION and the mathematical hyperbole effect (allow me to give you a clearer example - medical insurance) will always remain one step ahead of the goal the purists and "capitalist idealists" seek.
Capitalism for all the hype and good testimonies doesn't and cannot give wealth to 100% of a society.
Some say that capitalism and technological development will one day easily provide in everybody's need.
Horse****, I say.
The little technical economic phenomenon called INFLATION and the mathematical hyperbole effect (allow me to give you a clearer example - medical insurance) will always remain one step ahead of the goal the purists and "capitalist idealists" seek.
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