Idiots on bikes

[RustyPrincess]

Had a bike accident happen in front of me on the road between Hartebeesport and Randburg. The car in front of me was slowing down to turn right into a driveway, and as he was turning, a moron on a bike came flying up in the wrong lane, had to swerve to miss the now turning bakkie, the bakkie clipped him and bike and biker went flying. He stood up after the accident - so don't think he was too badly hurt, but its just another biker giving them a bad name.

And yesterday in Randburg, some tonsil was weaving badly through cars, and then proceeded to show off by doing wheelies. IDIOT! I was waiting for him to come short and fall.

 

[Mike Hoxbig]

fella...my point was that those things cannot actually be performed by a motorcyclist. for reasons of, well, for reason of reality. the follow-on point, to bring it out quite clearly, was that those things are far more dangerous, representing a complete cognitive break with the act of driving, and in the vast majority of road events. so the whining about motorcyclists is pretty selective in relation to where the traffic problems are being caused.

and no, i don't want your sympathy. i'd like you and your fellow road users to stop maiming my friends and i, because you're irritated with traffic, or because your new iPad didn't magically make you cool, or because you got trapped in a loveless marriage when you unexpectedly impregnated a colleague and have lived a life of surly resentment ever since.

no matter how miserable and underappreciated you feel, that can never carry more weight than the risk of taking someone else's life, or the risk of paralyzing them.

ti understand this, you need to appreciate that what's a fender bender for you, is a wheelchair for me. that's a disproportionate risk differential, and one that you, who carries the lower risk must operate under.

the fact you're comfortable calling strangers "c*nts* purely based on their transport indicates to me that you're not. but, hell. YMMV. you might be right. and approaching life the way you have on this thread might well be the correct way to do it. you try your approach an i'll try mine. and in the meantime, when i come across you and your like, i'll be speeding up to get away from your bad temper, rage and inability to parse normal road situations.

hope it helps.

d

Your attitude comes across as hostile, and that's precisely why people don't sympathise with bikers. They're always agro and in a hurry to get somewhere.

Please read through the entire thread and you'll see that people don't have a problem with bikers, they have a problem with bikers who act like knobs.

And if a biker rides in the emergency lane when he shouldn't be doing so then I will call him a c*nt. I can't make way for him and risk knocking a biker on the other side of me. Picking random lanes to split and riding in the emergency lane are valid complaints.

Don't ride like a knob and you won't have to worry about being paralysed.

 

[daelm]

I see the cavalry has arrived

i don't even know if it's worth it i'm talking to people who - by the evidence of their own mouths - are sitting in traffic fervently praying for someone to get seriously hurt.

eugenics has never seemed like a better idea than today. it's a pity there are so many moral flaws in the idea.

d

 

[Ancalagon]

most motorcyclists have a pretty good idea what they are. they're road users. i don't know if you've ever spent any serious time on a motorcycle, but it's pretty hard to be oblivious to road use when you're on one.

No, they dont. Why do they so often change lanes without looking or indicating? Why do so many drivers report issues with them?

so, given all that, the motorcyclist you're complaining about (above) is actually riding both completely legally and safely (assuming that they only filter when traffic slows, as you have described.) . and you're complaining about that.

No, its pretty clear he was speeding. Pretty much every biker I've ever seen speeds. At least, on the highway they do.

it seems to me that you just don't like it, probably because you think that you should be able to use that lane space yourself. the idea that a motorcyclist is entitled to occupy a lane, like any other road user, is not one that seems commonly understood in South Africa. i regularly see drivers trying to force their way into the same lane as a motorcyclist.




fella...my point was that those things cannot actually be performed by a motorcyclist. for reasons of, well, for reason of reality. the follow-on point, to bring it out quite clearly, was that those things are far more dangerous, representing a complete cognitive break with the act of driving, and in the vast majority of road events. so the whining about motorcyclists is pretty selective in relation to where the traffic problems are being caused.

and no, i don't want your sympathy. i'd like you and your fellow road users to stop maiming my friends and i, because you're irritated with traffic, or because your new iPad didn't magically make you cool, or because you got trapped in a loveless marriage when you unexpectedly impregnated a colleague and have lived a life of surly resentment ever since.

no matter how miserable and underappreciated you feel, that can never carry more weight than the risk of taking someone else's life, or the risk of paralyzing them.

ti understand this, you need to appreciate that what's a fender bender for you, is a wheelchair for me. that's a disproportionate risk differential, and one that you, who carries the lower risk must operate under.

the fact you're comfortable calling strangers "c*nts* purely based on their transport indicates to me that you're not. but, hell. YMMV. you might be right. and approaching life the way you have on this thread might well be the correct way to do it. you try your approach an i'll try mine. and in the meantime, when i come across you and your like, i'll be speeding up to get away from your bad temper, rage and inability to parse normal road situations.

hope it helps.

d

So wait, some people get together and share stories about how reckless bikers are, and automatically its because they are drivers and hence biased? Are you sure you dont work for the ANC? They are pretty good at denial too.

Lets face it - bikers are more reckless than drivers. Which is safer to you - riding or driving? Which gives you more of a thrill - riding or driving?

Its just bikers are, they are reckless, and somehow expect to be treated better because they are vulnerable. You took the risk of riding on a bike, not me, my suggestion to you is to WATCH OUT FOR CARS. Now, I'm not going to tell you that drivers are saints. A number of us are in fact c*nts, just like you bikers. The difference is, I'm willing to accept that sometimes I drive like a c*nt, whereas you never accept responsibility for being a biker and somehow its always the drivers fault. Next, I drive a 2 ton merc - if I hit a bike, the biker is hurting, not me. That doesnt give me the right to drive like an *********, my point is, if you want to take the risk of riding around on a bike, then you need to be responsible for your own safety.

 

[seanyp00h]

Cant we rather start a "I hate Taxi's" thread?

Then we can b1tch and moan for a reason.

 

[Wyzak]

I wish I had the money to start a counter campaign showing a guy on a bike, saying "Just Think!"

 

[ID_10_T]

It goes both ways - respect

 

[daelm]

Your attitude comes across as hostile, and that's precisely why people don't sympathise with bikers.

wait - let me get this straight. you're calling people ****s and wishing ill on all and sundry, but if I call you on that, I'M the hostile one? really? and because i called you on your rhetoric, that's apparently why all people everywhere don't sympathise with all bikers, everywhere? really? that's awesome!

Don't ride like a knob and you won't have to worry about being paralysed.

sadly, no. i'm dependent on YOU not riding like "knob", because while you sit inside your vehicle, i sit outside mine. the immediate consequence of that is that your range of punishable stupidity is far greater than mine. which is fine when you're in accidents by yourself. it's not, when you hit me because you failed to pay attention. i can be the best rider in the world, and still be killed by someone with your attitude. because i'm on the OUTSIDE of the vehicle.

in fact, a good friend of mine was killed exactly like that, ironically, coming back from rider training. a car turned across his line of travel, trying to find their way to the turn on the other side of the highway, and whoops - on one hand an insurance claim, and on the other a death. while i appreciate that an insurance claim is really inconvenient and take time out of your schedule, it probably is less so than dying.

because you can have an accident and have a good chance of getting away with it, and because i have a much lower chance of getting away from it with everything intact, some bright sparks decided to create an awareness campaign. it's that campaign that has been so roundly mocked and derided on this thread, by people adamant that they're concerned with road safety.

hope it helps.

 

[Jab]

This may not be popular opinion or legal at this time, but I think it would be safer for bikers to be able to use the emergency lane (the left one mostly) rather then lane splitting. Granted there may be more debris in the emergency lane but I wouldn't think it much more. The problem for me as a car driver is that it is difficult noticing a bike especially when their is a great speed difference between the cars and the bike. Using the emergency lane would also not fill up the the lane for emergency vehicles like cars would.

 

[rsifan]

I always give some space to the bikers, but I was really pissed off a couple of weeks ago when a biker on the M1 bumped my side mirror and then showed me the finger as he went past, like I had moved towards him!!

 

[seanyp00h]

I always give some space to the bikers, but I was really pissed off a couple of weeks ago when a biker on the M1 bumped my side mirror and then showed me the finger as he went past, like I had moved towards him!!

Aren't bikes not allowed on the M1?

 

[Mike Hoxbig]

wait - let me get this straight. you're calling people ****s and wishing ill on all and sundry, but if I call you on that, I'M the hostile one? really? and because i called you on your rhetoric, that's apparently why all people everywhere don't sympathise with all bikers, everywhere? really? that's awesome!




sadly, no. i'm dependent on YOU not riding like "knob", because while you sit inside your vehicle, i sit outside mine. the immediate consequence of that is that your range of punishable stupidity is far greater than mine. which is fine when you're in accidents by yourself. it's not, when you hit me because you failed to pay attention. i can be the best rider in the world, and still be killed by someone with your attitude. because i'm on the OUTSIDE of the vehicle.

in fact, a good friend of mine was killed exactly like that, ironically, coming back from rider training. a car turned across his line of travel, trying to find their way to the turn on the other side of the highway, and whoops - on one hand an insurance claim, and on the other a death. while i appreciate that an insurance claim is really inconvenient and take time out of your schedule, it probably is less so than dying.

because you can have an accident and have a good chance of getting away with it, and because i have a much lower chance of getting away from it with everything intact, some bright sparks decided to create an awareness campaign. it's that campaign that has been so roundly mocked and derided on this thread, by people adamant that they're concerned with road safety.

hope it helps.

Blah blah blah. Your post is so full of crap and lies that I'm not going to bother dissecting it. I never force you onto a bike so don't take your personal issues out on me.

 

[daelm]

No, they dont. Why do they so often change lanes without looking or indicating? Why do so many drivers report issues with them?

No, its pretty clear he was speeding.

um, actually, Pilgrim's complaint was that the rider was traveling to slow for him. just saying. but go ahead.

So wait, some people get together and share stories about how reckless bikers are, and automatically its because they are drivers and hence biased? Are you sure you dont work for the ANC? They are pretty good at denial too.

(ignores ad-hominem-attack-using-racial-insinuation-by-associating-commenter-with-ruling-party-and-hoping-that's-seen-as-bad)

The difference is, I'm willing to accept that sometimes I drive like a c*nt, whereas you never accept responsibility for being a biker and somehow its always the drivers fault. Next, I drive a 2 ton merc - if I hit a bike, the biker is hurting, not me. That doesnt give me the right to drive like an *********, my point is, if you want to take the risk of riding around on a bike, then you need to be responsible for your own safety.

actually, that's completely wrong. the entire basis for the imposition of traffic laws is the assumed joint responsibility of all road users for the safety of others. it's something to do with the fact that you're responsible for the predictable results of actions you take, and with the fact that roads are a communal space and road use a communal good. everyone is responsible for their own safety AND the safety of the people whom their decisions can affect. that's not even some arcane legal theory, it's the basis of all civil society.

anyway.


d

 

[daelm]

Blah blah blah. Your post is so full of crap and lies that I'm not going to bother dissecting it. I never force you onto a bike so don't take your personal issues out on me.

oh LOOK!!! it's reason! i LOVE this - I want to be able to win all arguments like this - " you is jus' crap and stuff and so i is taking my clever ideas away".

that's ****ing AWESOME!

 

[rsifan]

Aren't bikes not allowed on the M1?

Why not? I see a lot of bikes and some scooters too on the M1 moving through traffic every morning. This is on the M1 from Woodmead to central JHB.

 

[daelm]

Cant we rather start a "I hate Taxi's" thread?

Then we can b1tch and moan for a reason.

go for it - i'd pay cash to add to that thread


d

 

[Ancalagon]

um, actually, Pilgrim's complaint was that the rider was traveling to slow for him. just saying. but go ahead.

The OPs was about someone speeding. Nice that you chose to ignore it.

(ignores ad-hominem-attack-using-racial-insinuation-by-associating-commenter-with-ruling-party-and-hoping-that's-seen-as-bad)

Ah, but you still dont provide anything to back up your claim that all those with complaints about bikers are wrong? According to you, no biker is ever at fault. Denial.

actually, that's completely wrong. the entire basis for the imposition of traffic laws is the assumed joint responsibility of all road users for the safety of others. it's something to do with the fact that you're responsible for the predictable results of actions you take, and with the fact that roads are a communal space and road use a communal good. everyone is responsible for their own safety AND the safety of the people whom their decisions can affect. that's not even some arcane legal theory, it's the basis of all civil society.

anyway.


d

And I'm not saying I dont take responsibility for other road users. I'm saying if I was riding a bike, I wouldnt ride recklessly because I know if I get hit while on a bike I'm more likely to die than if I get hit in my car. But you bikers dont like that, you like to ride recklessly. So dont complain to us when you were weaving in and out of traffic and got run over. Basically, if you are going to ride recklessly, then take responsibility for your actions.

But taking responsibility for your actions is apparently not something bikers do. I mean, according to you, no biker is ever at fault.

 

[Mike Hoxbig]

This may not be popular opinion or legal at this time, but I think it would be safer for bikers to be able to use the emergency lane (the left one mostly) rather then lane splitting. Granted there may be more debris in the emergency lane but I wouldn't think it much more. The problem for me as a car driver is that it is difficult noticing a bike especially when their is a great speed difference between the cars and the bike. Using the emergency lane would also not fill up the the lane for emergency vehicles like cars would.

Perhaps it's best if bikers reach a consensus on which lane to use, and then stick to it, so that motorists can safely make way for them.

It's unfair for them to use random lanes, expecting motorists to keep dodging left and right to avoid them, and then blaming motorists for posing a danger to them.

 

[krepunk]

This may not be popular opinion or legal at this time, but I think it would be safer for bikers to be able to use the emergency lane (the left one mostly) rather then lane splitting. Granted there may be more debris in the emergency lane but I wouldn't think it much more. The problem for me as a car driver is that it is difficult noticing a bike especially when their is a great speed difference between the cars and the bike. Using the emergency lane would also not fill up the the lane for emergency vehicles like cars would.

But then which lane would the taxi's use?

 

[rainynight65]

Slightly off-topic:

When it comes to indicating, noone in this country can make up their minds. People routinely change lanes without indicating, or start to indicate after they've already started changing lanes. But even more people just ignore an indicator. I can sit behind a truck for ages, indicating that I want to change lanes, and noone will give a flying rat's furry bottom.

And at the speed some bikers come flying past you, they probably won't even notice the indicator...