Is it really that bad in SA?

Pitbull said:
That is why he doesn't drive no more. Not working for two years and losing your car in an accident will do that to you.
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Shame man.

It's hard to get back once things have gone wrong. Much harder than before and just as hard for new lads to climb up the ladder and build some life for themselves from scratch.
 
My 2 cents...

I recently moved to Paris, been loving every minute of it. But I guess having done that for 16 years already, in Dubai, is a bit different. I think it comes down to a few things:

1) Do you have a job waiting for you / will you do your own thing?
2) Where in Cape Town will you stay?
3) What will your income be like?

It seems tough in SA to get a job these days. Have friends and family with good degrees struggling to find jobs (lawyer, engineers...), so if you don't have something lined up, or willing to take the risk to do your own thing, it might be tough (even if you have saved some monies).

As it has been pointed out many times, some areas are good while some are worse (as in any country in the world). If you can afford to stay in a gated community things should be fine (unless your husband shoots you through the bathroom door or someone kills you with an axe... too soon?). That is just how things go, rich people experience the world a lot different compared to the middle and lower income population.

With all the problems is SA, if you earn enough, you can mitigate most of the problems, but yes, it takes a big fat bite out of your monthly income. You can find world class schools, hospitals, restaurants... what ever, SA, can compete with the rest of the world on an individual level.

BUT, don't fool yourself. Even though you might be able to have a standard of living putting you "out of harms way", it might not be the case for long. If things start to get worse and worse, I am sure even the Ruperts and Oppenheimers will start to feel unsave. Money helps a lot, but it has its limits.

So should you go back? I wouldn't, mainly because I won't be able to find a job. But if you have that sorted and can make R1mil (?? or what is the magic number these days) a year, I think you should be ok.
 
thestaggy said:
Tell me why we should have faith?
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I never had much faith since 1994 so I cannot tell you. I was referring to members that had more faith than me and I saw that "faith" changed over the years.
 
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Bobbin said:
Apparently we were first world, or very close. Which I think is sad.

Now I know that this was at the exclusion of black people thanks to Apartheid. So it's a poor justification I admit.

But what I'd like to understand is if it was necessary to bring South Africa down so much thereafter? Is there an easy answer?
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And now it's the other way around.
Back in high school I was lucky enough to be at a private school, now I am at a public university.
My experience so far: A strike that went on for months, moving my exams back around 4 months, which I wrote this Jan instead of October last year. Then we have the entire fiasco with public transport currently going on, trains delay, dunoon striking which is messing with Myciti. At my uni the lecturers/ground staff has started their own strike for a larger wage increase (they are being paid substandard compared to how much they'd earn in industry).

Zuma went and promised more money to the universities, proceeds to give most of it to the national student fund instead of the universities and then doesn't even pay all of it, etc.
Meanwhile the universities have to cover the shortfall while the rand depreciates, the students/staff etc. have damaged the campus and they have to pay to fix it, they have to hire extra security, all the lecturers/students have to make plans since they have to cover the same amount of work in less time, etc.
As a university student it's currently not a nice time to be studying.

Then the exclusion of whites compared to blacks. I wasn't even alive during Apartheid, I have absolutely nothing to do with it, my parents came here after it ended. Why am I still being disadvantaged because of it? At what point are we (the "whites" that I am classified as, previously "advantaged" etc., without me having ever been given an advantage) supposed to be done paying? I have colored/black friends (most racist remark ever, hey?) that are middle class who agree with me. It's the poor people who keep listening to the leaders who will keep harping the tune against the whites/privileged etc. that causes so much strife. At what point does it end?

/rant

@OP, if you have children, rather stay away.
 
Seriously said:
I never had much faith since 1994 so I cannot tell you. I was referring to members that had more faith than me and I saw that changed over the years.
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Ah, I see what you are saying.

I used to be positive, but now I just feel that we are circling the drain.
 
freddster said:
they weren't excluded for the job market were they, like us whites theses days?
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Johnatan56 said:
And now it's the other way around.
Back in high school I was lucky enough to be at a private school, now I am at a public university.
My experience so far: A strike that went on for months, moving my exams back around 4 months, which I wrote this Jan instead of October last year. Then we have the entire fiasco with public transport currently going on, trains delay, dunoon striking which is messing with Myciti. At my uni the lecturers/ground staff has started their own strike for a larger wage increase (they are being paid substandard compared to how much they'd earn in industry).

Zuma went and promised more money to the universities, proceeds to give most of it to the national student fund instead of the universities and then doesn't even pay all of it, etc.
Meanwhile the universities have to cover the shortfall while the rand depreciates, the students/staff etc. have damaged the campus and they have to pay to fix it, they have to hire extra security, all the lecturers/students have to make plans since they have to cover the same amount of work in less time, etc.
As a university student it's currently not a nice time to be studying.

Then the exclusion of whites compared to blacks. I wasn't even alive during Apartheid, I have absolutely nothing to do with it, my parents came here after it ended. Why am I still being disadvantaged because of it? At what point are we (the "whites" that I am classified as, previously "advantaged" etc., without me having ever been given an advantage) supposed to be done paying? I have colored/black friends (most racist remark ever, hey?) that are middle class who agree with me. It's the poor people who keep listening to the leaders who will keep harping the tune against the whites/privileged etc. that causes so much strife. At what point does it end?

/rant

@OP, if you have children, rather stay away.
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People like you are the other side of the coin that makes me want to leave. Utterly clueless.
 
Living in Europe for three months and then returning showed me that this country will always be third world, first world standards come naturally in that part of the world.

The_Assimilator said:
Go to Australia, go to Canada, go to the UK - anywhere but South Africa.
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What like Syria? :D

saturnz said:
I have a different experience, I haven't worked for two years and I have to a certain degree maintained my lifestyle.
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I hear you're living it up in "The Piazza" :D
 
Archer said:
Your justifications? I didn't even know you are out the country, your location is Jhb...
Semantics? You're the one using hyperbole... Maybe don't use it if it doesn't convey your true meaning? Just a thought.

But let us try again - you said you can't find basic services in SA period, and then challenged me to pick only one. I did. So now I wait, show us how the vast majority of people don't have access to clean running water?

What is hilarious is that I too am considering moving abroad. Difference is I know what I've got here whereas you (and plenty others) sound like someone who only thinks about what they didn't have, like water apparently :rolleyes:
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This is perhaps the more interesting question here, so let's probe it.

What about South Africa is so valuable, unique, or appealing that it outweighs the negatives?
 
OrbitalDawn said:
People like you are the other side of the coin that makes me want to leave. Utterly clueless.
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This seems to be a feeling that most young adults share these days (have seen numerous similar posts on MyBB and heard it from a bunch more)... why if you I wasn't part of apartheid must I suffer...

This surely isn't the thread to discuss it, but yes, I agree with you, there are people on both sides of the debate that have no clue (I know, I was on the one side once upon a time).
 
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StellenboschStudent said:
This seems to be a feeling that most young adults share these days (have seen numerous similar posts on MyBB and heard it from a bunch more)... why if you I wasn't part of apartheid must I suffer...

This surely isn't the thread to discuss not, but yes, I agree with you, there are people on both sides of the debate that have no clue (I know, I was on the one side once upon a time).
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Enlighten me.
 
OrbitalDawn said:
This is perhaps the more interesting question here, so let's probe it.

What about South Africa is so valuable, unique, or appealing that it outweighs the negatives?
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Sunshine, beaches, nature, been born here...there are mayy reasons

Unfortunately we cannot really enjoy that much anymore due to safety & security and expenses.
 
OrbitalDawn said:
People like you are the other side of the coin that makes me want to leave. Utterly clueless.
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because we wren't there during apartheid, or we were but as children who don't know sweet all about politics and now must still listen to you cry babies pissing about apartheid? Why didn't you build up SA before Jan and others came here? Its your fault that Jan came here to build SA up because you didn't do anything.
 
Aqua_lung said:
What like Syria? :D
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"anywhere but South Africa or another third world country." Happy now? :p

Seriously said:
Sunshine, beaches, nature, been born here...there are mayy reasons

Unfortunately we cannot really enjoy that much anymore due to safety & security and expenses.
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I don't give a f**k about any of those things, I'm not an outdoor person. I want fast and reliable internet access, reliable public transport so that I don't need to buy a car I don't really want or need (since I don't do much driving apart from getting to/from work and shops), reliable public health care I can count on, and cheap electronics. None of that is available here.
 
The_Assimilator said:
"anywhere but South Africa or another third world country." Happy now? :p



I don't give a f**k about any of those things, I'm not an outdoor person. I want fast and reliable internet access, reliable public transport so that I don't need to buy a car I don't really want or need (since I don't do much driving apart from getting to/from work and shops), reliable public health care I can count on, and cheap electronics. None of that is available here.
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I agree with you. Yet we could have had all that by now plus retained the good life if it was not for the tactless, clueless brainless ANC and their majority voters that support their crimes and stupidity.
 
OrbitalDawn said:
There are more than enough things to be dissatisfied about before you need to start dipping into the well of utter idiocy that is comparing whites' situation to apartheid.

You'll notice we'd been discussing it quite candidly before.
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I'm not discussing whites' situation to Apartheid. I am comparing how I am being marginalized against even though I had nothing to do with Apartheid or benefited from it (don't come here and say "your parents benefited from it, therefore you got better stuff etc., I am talking about me directly benefiting, like e.g. Universities. Is it fair that that guy who managed to afford private school etc. only has to get ~50-60% in maths compared to your 70% minimum to get in when he had all the same advantages? Why are we still dealing with BEE so far down the line, whites are outnumbered by wide margins, stop forcing it and let it just takes its course. (I am not against previously disadvantaged, e.g. guy comes from a far rural background/poor household etc. getting lower mark requirements if they actually had a system to catch them)).
 
The constant tension in this country is exhausting, life is already hard. The "privileged" of this country are those who are unable to see (or able to live in denial) the severity of the state we are in.
 
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