Damn, its not higher but its right up there. So LOL for 49 odd murders a day. If you can laugh at that there is surely something wrong with you. Probably supporting crime or benefitting from it.
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Question of the Day: Main reasons you wouldn't get an EV?
Is it really that bad in SA?
- Thread starter Whatzmyname
- Start date
Damn, its not higher but its right up there. So LOL for 49 odd murders a day. If you can laugh at that there is surely something wrong with you. Probably supporting crime or benefitting from it.
R13...
Honorary Master
You damn well know he's laughing at the misinformation or ignorance and not glad that the murder or crime is at some lower number. What's with people using obvious fallacies to support their prejudices
OrbitalDawn
Ulysses Everett McGill
Jola
Honorary Master
So 49 people a day is higher than "all the wars over the world"?
Probably is, with current wars. If you look at the Ukrainian war, casualties were relatively low, certainly less than 49 per day.
Bobbin
Honorary Master
I can tick many of those.
One close call a year or two ago - My mom and sister were tied and gagged while a gang of armed robbers tried to rob them, realizing there was fkall to steal (Unless a CRT TV was worth it). Then the thieves threatened with rape if my mom/sister didn't show the thieves where the imaginary safe was. Fortunately an alarm or sound went off during the ordeal and chased them away (Think it had something to do with electric fence). Mom had to struggle all night to untie herself. You can imagine me finding out about this the next day over the phone.
The statement that crime happens everywhere in the world somehow just doesn't feel right. There's something wrong with that logic and I can't put my finger on it. It's far more rampant in South Africa than most places and we're in a bit of a sick society. The divide doesn't help and we're certainly governed by people who don't care.
One thing everybody recognizes when they go to a first world country, the feeling of absolute freedom and the ability to walk to their destination without looking over their shoulder all the time. I have personally felt this and verified it with everyone I know who has travelled.
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So 49 people a day is higher than "all the wars over the world"?
People killed daily in SA is more than people killed daily in all the wars over the world. thought you'd be able to get the context right there. But yaaa...
Squatters. What was there before the squatters came to settle. Houses, shopping malls? No fields. They're not educated, chances are they don't contribute to the economy, and yet they have the same say as you. How does it feel , I' pretty sure you are educated, matric, degree or diploma. They have the same say as you... Its like making the gardener the CEO of your business.
biometrics
Honorary Master
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Which wars are going on at the moment?
OrbitalDawn
Ulysses Everett McGill
R13...
Honorary Master
More than this?
Source: BBC
Every minute, two people are killed in conflicts around the world.
War and conflict isn't the same thing. Its obvious that there is lots of conflict. Conflict can go into a war situation.
SoulTax
Executive Member
One of the reasons that I put up this simple list was to illustrate just how many people in South Africa, can tick these boxes a number of times. But then I have conversations with people in the UK, Telling them about only my list. My list reaches into the double digits quite comfortably. As I go through the list, the look of disbelief and horror on their faces is quite apparent.
Then at the end, when they say that sort of stuff hasn't happened to them or anyone they know, for their entire lives of living in the UK. AND that they and most people they know, go for walks through forests or over fields, multiple times per week. Spent between 5 and 45 years of their lives walking home from the pub most weeks, at night.... All these sorts of things that South Africans tend to simply avoid altogether, because you know that the odds go up dramatically, of you meeting a shady character, that may want to stab you for your cell phone.
If you cant tick anything on that list, then you are quite lucky.... for the time being. But the state of SA shows a trend, and that trend says that the list will find you at some point.
Its not is it going to happen, its when. Your risk in this country is big.
Yes, but crime is punished in the rest of the world. Criminals walk the street with us in SA.
That's why the statement doesn't feel right.
Neighbour was attacked by a man who's committed 19 - nineteen - murders!
I say again, this is a country of no consequences. I.e. murder, rape, destruction, vandalism to a large degree go unpunished.
The Voice
Honorary Master
As someone who now lives in the UK, I'll throw in my 2p.
I used to share some of the sentiments of people in this thread: hopeful, positive thoughts of the beautiful country I love. I lived in apartheid SA, and the new, free(er) SA. I lived in Cape Town until my early 20's, then moved to Gauteng for work, until I eventually left in my mid-30's. I think that's what eventually opened my eyes.
The WC is NOTHING like the rest of SA. So one can effectively take what most of the locals say with regards to crime, corruption, service delivery, etc, with a pinch of salt. The WC is the epitome of what a acceptably run SA would be like: for the most part, it works, and can still improve.
North of those pretty mountains, and things start getting ugly. It's like any other ex-colonial African sesspit. Corrupt, filthy and dangerous. In the last few months before I left I really started taking in my surroundings. It was then that I realised that the majority of people in SA who don't think that there's anything wrong are either a) very well off, living in gated communities where the real world can't touch them or b) living in the WC, or both. Regardless, it's a case of a frog in warm water for everyone anyway. Since 1994 the crap that's happening in this country has occurred at such a slow, steady rate that we've become used to it. We've adapted and adjusted to make it part of our daily lives. We know to keep our houses locked up tight. We know to not put our belongings on the seats in our cars. We're locked up securely from the time we leave our homes until we reach our equally secure destinations. We know to not walk around at night. It's just how we live. And we're ok with that, and everything else that's wrong, because it's "not that bad", and it "may get better - it's only been 20 years". A lot of my family are Rhodesian. They thought exactly the same thing.
I wasn't ok with living like that anymore, so I'm here in the UK now. Yes, there is unemployment - but it's only 5%. Yes, there is crime - the (actually active, functioning) policing system does something about it. Yes, it's pricey, but that's my own fault for living in London. I walk from the pavement to my front door - no security gates, or burglar bars anywhere. I make use of safe (mostly reliable) transport. I live in a multiracial, multicultural utopia of sorts. And I won't ever move back to SA, no matter how much I miss it.
I used to share some of the sentiments of people in this thread: hopeful, positive thoughts of the beautiful country I love. I lived in apartheid SA, and the new, free(er) SA. I lived in Cape Town until my early 20's, then moved to Gauteng for work, until I eventually left in my mid-30's. I think that's what eventually opened my eyes.
The WC is NOTHING like the rest of SA. So one can effectively take what most of the locals say with regards to crime, corruption, service delivery, etc, with a pinch of salt. The WC is the epitome of what a acceptably run SA would be like: for the most part, it works, and can still improve.
North of those pretty mountains, and things start getting ugly. It's like any other ex-colonial African sesspit. Corrupt, filthy and dangerous. In the last few months before I left I really started taking in my surroundings. It was then that I realised that the majority of people in SA who don't think that there's anything wrong are either a) very well off, living in gated communities where the real world can't touch them or b) living in the WC, or both. Regardless, it's a case of a frog in warm water for everyone anyway. Since 1994 the crap that's happening in this country has occurred at such a slow, steady rate that we've become used to it. We've adapted and adjusted to make it part of our daily lives. We know to keep our houses locked up tight. We know to not put our belongings on the seats in our cars. We're locked up securely from the time we leave our homes until we reach our equally secure destinations. We know to not walk around at night. It's just how we live. And we're ok with that, and everything else that's wrong, because it's "not that bad", and it "may get better - it's only been 20 years". A lot of my family are Rhodesian. They thought exactly the same thing.
I wasn't ok with living like that anymore, so I'm here in the UK now. Yes, there is unemployment - but it's only 5%. Yes, there is crime - the (actually active, functioning) policing system does something about it. Yes, it's pricey, but that's my own fault for living in London. I walk from the pavement to my front door - no security gates, or burglar bars anywhere. I make use of safe (mostly reliable) transport. I live in a multiracial, multicultural utopia of sorts. And I won't ever move back to SA, no matter how much I miss it.
scud
Expert Member
Wow!
The Voice
Honorary Master
I know I can't have any of the good without taking all the bad that comes with it, too. So my home will just be a holiday destination from now on.
OP also needs to realise and take into consideration that it's not the same country that they left 16 years ago. Weigh up the pros and cons, and make an educated decision. Leave sentiment at the door when you do.
TheChamp
Honorary Master
next time you walk the streets of wherever you are in the world look around you and see if you can tell if the man walking next to you is a criminal with 19 murders to his name, criminals walk the streets with us anywhere in the world even in the UK, as for punishment Radovan Krejcir is in jail in SA.
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HavocXphere
Honorary Master
Meh. Same for me actually. Seen enough countries now to know SA isn't a good fit for me personally.
Would totally consider retiring in SA though - if safety improves (very) dramatically.
I expect that given another 10 years abroad, retiring in SA will become unthinkable. After a few more years you will find that you start to develop a sentimental attachment to where you are now, and after subsequent visits to SA, you will see that not only has your attachment to SA waned, but that what you were attached to, is no longer there anyway.