Join us, SAPS pleads with non-blacks

[Hoekachaka]

“We want an intelligent police service.
So in calling these groups, they (police)
must maintain the standard.”
I find this very insulting! What's wrong with black policeman? Does he imply blacks are not intelligent enough to maintain the standard or what?

 

[RyanPCMR]

Well, this was unexpected and weird to hear that they are basically saying that affirmative action has run it's course in SAPS. Wonder what sort of initiatives are they willing to offer to get non-black applicants interested in police service in SA. But Zuma said that affirmative action is here to stay. WTF?

 

[marine1]

Well, this was unexpected and weird to hear that they are basically saying that affirmative action has run it's course in SAPS. Wonder what sort of initiatives are they willing to offer to get non-black applicants interested in police service in SA. But Zuma said that affirmative action is here to stay. WTF?

I don't see then saying anything about it running it's course.
AA isn't going anywhere

 

[goofball]

It's not the saps but management and gvt.
They are the ones to blame for the mess

Unfortunately it makes no difference who's fault it is.

 

[grok]

Seems SAPS is the new Eskom. They broke it and haven't a clue how to fix it.

 

[Compton_effect]

Applicants must be able to meet a host of requirements including being able to speak two official languages and have a Grade 12 or equivalent qualification.

How's that a requirement? Name one person you know that can only speak one language?
English and 'Insert cultural language here' is the norm in SA. Heck - I can swear in 5.:twisted:

 

[Species8472]

Well, this was unexpected and weird to hear that they are basically saying that affirmative action has run it's course in SAPS. Wonder what sort of initiatives are they willing to offer to get non-black applicants interested in police service in SA. But Zuma said that affirmative action is here to stay. WTF?

No, what is happening is that non-black people know that they have no future in SAPS and as such they don't join it any more. Now on the entry level SAPS does not have enough token white and indian faces, so they are making this plea. Their own AA policy is working against them.

Do not think for one moment that any non-black that joins SAPS now will have any prospects of a promotion, they are just needed for the numbers to balance out.

 

[Y'all Qaeda]

I've been trying to join reservists for over two years now - last comms I had with the head reservist in my area, he told me try again next year - 2015 - as they might have lifted the moratorium or something to that end.

So, no. They don't want people.

 

[Bismuth]

I know a young guy (friend of the family) that passionately wanted to become a policeman his entire life. He applied and got accepted for the training. Even during his time as a recruit, still maintained his enthusiasm and desire to become one. As far as I understand, he completed his training, but then was told that his chances for promotion are basically zero, as a white male. Even those that do manage to get promoted, have to wait longer than their darker skinned counterparts.

As far as I know, he has quit the police, not sure what he is doing now, must find out actually.

B

 

[rza]

Well, this was unexpected and weird to hear that they are basically saying that affirmative action has run it's course in SAPS. Wonder what sort of initiatives are they willing to offer to get non-black applicants interested in police service in SA. But Zuma said that affirmative action is here to stay. WTF?

I don't understand why non-whites are not rejoicing over this. The EE act is clear that it wants to address previous inequalities, so it follows then that when the inequality has been addressed then all races will be treated the same. EE has a lifespan and it will never be perpetual, and it's good that SAPS has reached the lifespan.

 

[Sinbad]

I don't understand why non-whites are not rejoicing over this. The EE act is clear that it wants to address previous inequalities, so it follows then that when the inequality has been addressed then all races will be treated the same. EE has a lifespan and it will never be perpetual, and it's good that SAPS has reached the lifespan.

But SAPS will not acknowledge that they have reached the lifespan. They are still concerned about quotas - this plea is just to make the numbers look good. If they really thought they'd reached the end of AA, Renate Barnard would get her promotion.

 

[Pitbull]

I know a young guy (friend of the family) that passionately wanted to become a policeman his entire life. He applied and got accepted for the training. Even during his time as a recruit, still maintained his enthusiasm and desire to become one. As far as I understand, he completed his training, but then was told that his chances for promotion are basically zero, as a white male. Even those that do manage to get promoted, have to wait longer than their darker skinned counterparts.

As far as I know, he has quit the police, not sure what he is doing now, must find out actually.

B

Probably in Afghanistan as a security contractor. I know of 5 Ex Police officers doing that currently.

 

[marine1]

I don't understand why non-whites are not rejoicing over this. The EE act is clear that it wants to address previous inequalities, so it follows then that when the inequality has been addressed then all races will be treated the same. EE has a lifespan and it will never be perpetual, and it's good that SAPS has reached the lifespan.

You can't seriously believe that.
AA and BEE are here to stay.
There is no proof whatsoever of it stopping anywhere

 

[Drifter]

And on the other side of the spectrum, we have Standard Bank, who turned away a INDIAN lady friend of mine for a job, because she was "too white".

 

[rza]

But SAPS will not acknowledge that they have reached the lifespan. They are still concerned about quotas - this plea is just to make the numbers look good. If they really thought they'd reached the end of AA, Renate Barnard would get her promotion.

I don't want to get into the Barnard case, but we note one important thing from that case. The court made it clear that the EE plan has to be rational and must aim to achieve a certain objective. It follows then that when that objective has been met then the EE plan will fall away. When non-white males (not white people) are no longer over represented in management levels of SAPS, then it follows that there won't be a need to impose the EE plan strictly otherwise that EE plan and it's implementation will fall foul of the Constitution. Has SAPS reached that point? If yes, then we are reaching a lifespan of a strict application of EE plan.

1. White males (who are the biggest sufferers of EE) should not present EE as racist since white females have benefitted more than any other groups of previously disadvantaged people, at least in the private sector.
2. EE is against discrimination of white males, and seeks to ensure that they are also represented in all levels of management. This is why SAPS has to go on a recruitment drive for non-African policemen otherwise they will fall foul of EE

 

[Sinbad]

I don't want to get into the Barnard case, but we note one important thing from that case. The court made it clear that the EE plan has to be rational and must aim to achieve a certain objective. It follows then that when that objective has been met then the EE plan will fall away. When non-white males (not white people) are no longer over represented in management levels of SAPS, then it follows that there won't be a need to impose the EE plan strictly otherwise that EE plan and it's implementation will fall foul of the Constitution. Has SAPS reached that point? If yes, then we are reaching a lifespan of a strict application of EE plan.

1. White males (who are the biggest sufferers of EE) should not present EE as racist since white females have benefitted more than any other groups of previously disadvantaged people, at least in the private sector.
2. EE is against discrimination of white males, and seeks to ensure that they are also represented in all levels of management. This is why SAPS has to go on a recruitment drive for non-African policemen otherwise they will fall foul of EE

The implementation of EE in management positions in the SAPS is driving away non-EE compliant junior staff. So the insistence on quotas higher up means you break your OTHER quota at the bottom...

 

[Drake2007]

... SAPS has to go on a recruitment drive for non-African policemen otherwise they will fall foul of EE

What would actually happen then? they get a slap on the wrist?

 

[rza]

You can't seriously believe that.
AA and BEE are here to stay.
There is no proof whatsoever of it stopping anywhere

The EE act as a law is not going anywhere, but the EE plans of organisations are not here to stay. The EE plan has to be rational, and once it loses rationality then it fall foul of the the EE act. You can't have a 100% african leadership in a government organisation and still have an EE plan that seeks to promote African people. When african people are overrepresented in any level then the EE plan should seek to introduce other races in that level. This I suspect is what SAPS is doing, and they are forced to do so as per the EE act. The EE act protect all races, it's just that white males will suffer for a while since they were overrepresented for too long.

 

[bokdrol]

What is a non-black?

 

[rza]

The implementation of EE in management positions in the SAPS is driving away non-EE compliant junior staff. So the insistence on quotas higher up means you break your OTHER quota at the bottom...

That's my worry because people fail to understand what the EE act stands for. The constitutional court made it clear that the purpose of EE act is not to promote incompetent black people (including white females) ahead of competent white males. So if you are a competent white male in the SAPS, then why are you leaving? (Bear in mind that Barnard was eventually promoted). People leave because they are fed nonsense stories that a white male will never be promoted, but that is not true. I work for government and white males get promoted. Unions like Solidarity are also to blame for playing politics and making it look like there is no future for white males in government. The EE plan has to be rational, and people who get promoted must qualify for positions and be competent, regardless of their race. So there are two tests that every EE appointment has to pass. It follows then that when there is no need for EE because all races are represented in managerial levels, then white males shouldn't be denied promotions. This puts a lifespan on all EE plans.