MWEB - Message from CEO - Acceptable Use Policy

SabreWolfy said:
They're not going to say, obviously. The moment they do, everyone will use up to whatever limit they said. You're welcome to "sort of" bypass shaping at your own risk I guess.
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And why is that unfair?

Whose side are you on anyway?
 
Is it possible to keep the 4Mb line rental with MWEB and do 1GB thereby also having the email account? Porting the DSL line to TELKOM from MWEB will suck.... does anyone know if you still have use of your line while it is being ported???
 
Why do they refuse to clarify things and be specific?

We are paying customers and deserve to know what we can and cannot do with the product provided. Yet every question put to them wanting clarification gets totally ignored whether it be on here, Facebook etc.
 
*Thank goodness I faxed and emailed my cancellation letter the DAY BEFORE Mweb started sending out all the emails/phone calls etc*

Sigh another month with them oh well.

I remember a time when the members of this site would have been up in arms about this, now it is just a bunch of fanboi's.
 
PeterCH said:
LINE SPEED. Isn't this an UNCAPPED OFFERING? Aren't we paying extra for that line speed to TELKOM too?

Advertise it as UNCAPPED OFFERING AT 65KB/sec for only a maxium of 2-3 hours per day.
Click to expand...
Hey MWEB OPS
How much do I have to pay you to give PeterCH "THE CALL" about his VPN tunnelling?
 
I'm getting kinda tired of reading the same stuff over and over and over again...

The simple fact of the matter is...the CEO OF MWEB stated ON RECORD that there is NO SHAPING in off-peak hours...this much says it all about shaping...now I am willing to share my usage for the last two months and you will clearly see shaping in place, kicking in specific hours. The next thing on the product page it CLEARLY says use as much data as you like!!! The only thing I will agree on is that people used VPN's and other methods to max out their lines...I for one am using uTorrent and grabbit to get my downloads (what it is is not of any one's concern...I have the right to privacy so just leave it at that)...but then like now it is 12h54am and I'm checking my grabbit download speeds... (and this is all legal according to MWEB's T&C's) and I'm only getting about 120kb/s. This indicates that there are some serious throttling in place...

Now here's a question...people are going on about T&C's blah blah blah...my problem is what the CEO of the company says and what the information on the product page says and what the T&C's says are all different things...

The product page says use as much data as you like...the CEO said (on record) there's no shaping after hours...I for one am not using "so called" illegal ways of maxing my downloads...
I DEMAND THAT SOMEONE FROM MWEB GIVE ME A CALL ON MY CELLPHONE TO TELL ME WHAT THE HELL IS GOING ON!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Mr MWEB Ops...I PM'd you my account details yesterday...so you have my username and with that you can get my cell number...

All this bitching has been fun but I think we've all had enough...either you give us (the customers) what you advertise or you change your product.
 
SlowHands said:
I'm getting kinda tired of reading the same stuff over and over and over again...

The simple fact of the matter is...the CEO OF MWEB stated ON RECORD that there is NO SHAPING in off-peak hours...this much says it all about shaping...now I am willing to share my usage for the last two months and you will clearly see shaping in place, kicking in specific hours. The next thing on the product page it CLEARLY says use as much data as you like!!! The only thing I will agree on is that people used VPN's and other methods to max out their lines...I for one am using uTorrent and grabbit to get my downloads (what it is is not of any one's concern...I have the right to privacy so just leave it at that)...but then like now it is 12h54am and I'm checking my grabbit download speeds... (and this is all legal according to MWEB's T&C's) and I'm only getting about 120kb/s. This indicates that there are some serious throttling in place...

Now here's a question...people are going on about T&C's blah blah blah...my problem is what the CEO of the company says and what the information on the product page says and what the T&C's says are all different things...

The product page says use as much data as you like...the CEO said (on record) there's no shaping after hours...I for one am not using "so called" illegal ways of maxing my downloads...
I DEMAND THAT SOMEONE FROM MWEB GIVE ME A CALL ON MY CELLPHONE TO TELL ME WHAT THE HELL IS GOING ON!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Mr MWEB Ops...I PM'd you my account details yesterday...so you have my username and with that you can get my cell number...

All this bitching has been fun but I think we've all had enough...either you give us (the customers) what you advertise or you change your product.
Click to expand...

+1
 
SlowHands said:
I'm getting kinda tired of reading the same stuff over and over and over again...
Click to expand...

1) Never has it been stated that there is *no* shaping during off-peak hours. What was stated (many months ago by the way) is that performance should improve during off-peak hours and should "appear as if unshaped". I point out that it was said many months ago because clearly over time more load has been placed on the network (in some cases through certain unscrupulous users circumventing the shaping), meaning that the shaping now has a greater effect during off-peak hours than it originally used to. You'll notice this still happens, because off-peak hours perform significantly better than peak, albeit that they don't perform at "maximum speeds" anymore. Shaping doesn't magically "kick in" at certain times, the shaping rules in place at 3PM are the same as 3AM, however the scale at which shaping has an effect on your connection performance is based on varying network load (less load at 3AM than 3PM). Remember though, reduced load doesn't imply there is NO load, so, based on how performance has dipped over time, it's pretty clear that their ratio of contention has increased since they launched... as was to be expected.

2) Nothing has been said to indicate that people are being disconnected due to excessive usage (number of GB's), but rather due to other reasons such as circumvention of the shaping. However, I wouldn't be surprised if they do use GB's as some form of warning signal to begin an investigation into an account (since a user running at 400KB/s constantly will have more usage than one running at 50KB/s constantly). I doubt they have any problems with people downloading as much as they possibly can, as long as those people make use of the systems put in place to share out the bandwidth to everyone. It's when you start using GB's and GB's and cause other people's connections to suffer that they begin to take exception.

3) Statements of a CEO are not advertising and are therefore not binding as an "advertised product". CEO's are notorious when it comes to oversimplifying things during interviews and generally lack all the technical knowledge required to more accurately describe the product. That and obviously one would want to try and make the product sound as good as possible. The advertised product is that which is available upon purchase, with the full Terms and Conditions included.

4) Stop being a filthy pirate, you filthy pirate!
 
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Tharaxis:
Die in a fire.

What a CEO says via any public channels, is considered advertising. Sorry, fact.
Rudi did publicly say that they will not cut people off.
Rudi also publicly said that after-hours are unshaped.
If amount of GB has nothing to do with it, how come we haven't heard of any 384k users being cut off? Oh i Know! Because even at full line speed 24/7 they probably wont even get near 100GB.

I'm actually sooooo tempted to sign up for a 384 on my wife's name, and VPN the everliving sh** out of it for 3 months non-stop.
Just to see if they will cancel it.
 
MWEB Operations said:
Good evening ladies and gents

I see there has been quite a lot of debate regarding "the call". Please note that I limit my posts to clarifying specific issues from time to time if I feel that it can add some value. I'm also not going to discuss the specifics of individual customers who have been contacted regarding abuse, this is a matter between MWEB and the customer so please do not expect me to respond to questions about what customer X did, or didn’t do.

I would like to clarify a few points based on recent comments and re-emphasize some of my previous comments.

There is a lot of speculation going on about whether we are looking at a gigabyte limit, or some other such arbitrary rule to determine who is 'abusive'. Let me state again, we are looking at behaviour over an extended period of time and we are considering factors such as:

· repeated incidents of long periods of uninterrupted downloading at high speeds.
· the use of various techniques which allow vast amounts of traffic to be transferred at line, or near line speeds for extended periods of time.
This includes vpns and tunnelled http traffic from commercial seedbox services (thanks Venificus for describing the methods used by these services earlier).

Customers found to be making extensive use of ‘unshaping techniques’ will not be given a second chance.
These are the actions of an Internet savvy user who has gone to some lengths to optimize their downloading experience, not someone who stumbled on a faster way to download by pure chance.
These users are having a very real impact on the integrity of the network and service delivery to the vast majority of our customers is the first priority here.

This is not a process that is going to affect normal reasonable Internet users. The handful of people being affected by this know that they are pushing the envelope trying to continuously download as much as possible, as fast as possible. This isn’t what our shaped product was designed for and we quite simply cannot allow it be used in this way.

Kind Regards
MWEB Operations (Tech Manager)
Click to expand...

so by speculating that i client is doing this you base your judgements, i mean realy now, i want o download something i will go and do it at night when i get home and i will leave it running till its finished, Thats is what i'm paying for isnt it ? an UNCAPPED SERVICE not limiting the mount of data consumed. Mweb u guys must realy go sit and think things through about your so called business ethics then. IF asumption was the way to move forward and run a company then i hope that you dont suceed in the near future and fail.
 
Necuno said:
i still don't see a rock solid case.

you are ****ing with the t&c; hence the cut off at end of the month. it's not like sol matrix that terminated you because of just using too much though it could be confused as same thing.
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dude its not cutt of at the end of the month its immidiate, i'm now sitting with no acess at home till the new month when i get myself another ISP then.

so they are breaking their own T&C's then by closing the accounts.
 
Ok so this is their re[ply to me asking on Monday For a guidline for us to use to download on. Now they didnt even answer any of my 2 or 3 questions i asked, but just cancelled. (look at the part i made in bold)

""Please refer to our previous communication on this matter which remains relevant. With regards to your queries below as to the nature of the abuse, the matter which we are addressing is clearly stipulated in our terms and conditions, which is the bypassing of our shaping rules. Your account has been utilized over an extended period of time to transfer large amounts of data at line, or near line speeds using protocols flagged as Internet Privacy, which indicates the use of either VPN, or an SSL tunnel. As such we are no longer willing to offer this product to you.
Kind regards
Security & Abuse Team
Fax: + 27 021 5968915
[email protected]
[email protected]""

So i dont have privacy in getting what ever i require from the internet ? it can be personal infomration that i might be getting but hey they proberly gett of at seeing who downloads what tipe of p0rn from the net, just so they can go afterwards and get the same stuff
 
bierman said:
So i dont have privacy in getting what ever i require from the internet ? it can be personal infomration that i might be getting but hey they proberly gett of at seeing who downloads what tipe of p0rn from the net, just so they can go afterwards and get the same stuff
Click to expand...

I am sorry that you have the reading comprehension of a 12 year old. It is obvious that by "internet privacy" they are referring to you hiding your actions using an encrypted tunnel and thereby bypassing shaping mechanisms that have been put in place.

Please stop making a mountain out of a molehill.
 
You realise they don't need to look at *what* you're downloading (legally, they can't anyway) to know that it's probably not private (in the sense of personal) data.

They can see how much you're downloading. They can see where you're downloading it from. They can see how you're downloading. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out you're probably not going to be pulling 500GB of family photos off RS/AeroVPS/DS/Random Usenet Provider etc.

@PeterCH: You're a really rude individual. You specifically asked how you can keep access to your Mweb email accounts, and when someone gives you a perfectly valid answer you thank them by calling them an Mweb shill?
 
Tharaxis said:
1) Never has it been stated that there is *no* shaping during off-peak hours. What was stated (many months ago by the way) is that performance should improve during off-peak hours and should "appear as if unshaped". I point out that it was said many months ago because clearly over time more load has been placed on the network (in some cases through certain unscrupulous users circumventing the shaping), meaning that the shaping now has a greater effect during off-peak hours than it originally used to. You'll notice this still happens, because off-peak hours perform significantly better than peak, albeit that they don't perform at "maximum speeds" anymore. Shaping doesn't magically "kick in" at certain times, the shaping rules in place at 3PM are the same as 3AM, however the scale at which shaping has an effect on your connection performance is based on varying network load (less load at 3AM than 3PM). Remember though, reduced load doesn't imply there is NO load, so, based on how performance has dipped over time, it's pretty clear that their ratio of contention has increased since they launched... as was to be expected.

2) Nothing has been said to indicate that people are being disconnected due to excessive usage (number of GB's), but rather due to other reasons such as circumvention of the shaping. However, I wouldn't be surprised if they do use GB's as some form of warning signal to begin an investigation into an account (since a user running at 400KB/s constantly will have more usage than one running at 50KB/s constantly). I doubt they have any problems with people downloading as much as they possibly can, as long as those people make use of the systems put in place to share out the bandwidth to everyone. It's when you start using GB's and GB's and cause other people's connections to suffer that they begin to take exception.

3) Statements of a CEO are not advertising and are therefore not binding as an "advertised product". CEO's are notorious when it comes to oversimplifying things during interviews and generally lack all the technical knowledge required to more accurately describe the product. That and obviously one would want to try and make the product sound as good as possible. The advertised product is that which is available upon purchase, with the full Terms and Conditions included.

4) Stop being a filthy pirate, you filthy pirate!
Click to expand...

1 - The CEO of the company said there's no shaping after hours...and I'm sorry as a consumer I want to believe what the boss of a company says...because the day I (we) get pissed off we can hold him to that. As I was reading this I was keeping an eye on my DU Meter screen...I have a dual view setup so the active usage graph DU Meter gives me sits nice and big on my second screen...8am EXACTLY I saw a huge dip in my downloads, as if either the network cut me off, or they have a script running limiting speeds on certain ports in specific hours.

2 - No nothing has been said about usage, you're right. The guys that has admitted to using "other" means of bypassing whatever shaping protocols MWEB has in place, got caught simple as that. Although, I am pretty sure guys on the 512 and 384 also use these services...then why is MWEB only targeting the 4mb users? Is it maybe because they pull a lot more data? But then...what does it matter, since "it's not about how much they usage"...sigh I would love to know if someone "got the call" that was using these services and only downloaded 1Gb...

3 - I'm sorry, you're WRONG in so many ways...MWEB is listed company yes? As a "company" they have a responsibility to their customers but more importantly to their shareholders...the boss of a company can't just go and say whatever the hell he likes, obviously to sugarcoat the product, then couple of months later nobody has the right to quote him on what he said? The product description has remained the same since he went on record saying there's no shaping after hours, so give me what you (Rudi Jansen) said, or change your damn product's desctiption!!!

4 - lol yes I'm a pirate...prove it!

I believe in honest advertising...simple as that. I honestly don't get why so many people are defending MWEB on this
 
Last edited:
Tharaxis said:
1) Never has it been stated that there is *no* shaping during off-peak hours. What was stated (many months ago by the way) is that performance should improve during off-peak hours and should "appear as if unshaped". I point out that it was said many months ago because clearly over time more load has been placed on the network (in some cases through certain unscrupulous users circumventing the shaping), meaning that the shaping now has a greater effect during off-peak hours than it originally used to. You'll notice this still happens, because off-peak hours perform significantly better than peak, albeit that they don't perform at "maximum speeds" anymore. Shaping doesn't magically "kick in" at certain times, the shaping rules in place at 3PM are the same as 3AM, however the scale at which shaping has an effect on your connection performance is based on varying network load (less load at 3AM than 3PM). Remember though, reduced load doesn't imply there is NO load, so, based on how performance has dipped over time, it's pretty clear that their ratio of contention has increased since they launched... as was to be expected.

2) Nothing has been said to indicate that people are being disconnected due to excessive usage (number of GB's), but rather due to other reasons such as circumvention of the shaping. However, I wouldn't be surprised if they do use GB's as some form of warning signal to begin an investigation into an account (since a user running at 400KB/s constantly will have more usage than one running at 50KB/s constantly). I doubt they have any problems with people downloading as much as they possibly can, as long as those people make use of the systems put in place to share out the bandwidth to everyone. It's when you start using GB's and GB's and cause other people's connections to suffer that they begin to take exception.

3) Statements of a CEO are not advertising and are therefore not binding as an "advertised product". CEO's are notorious when it comes to oversimplifying things during interviews and generally lack all the technical knowledge required to more accurately describe the product. That and obviously one would want to try and make the product sound as good as possible. The advertised product is that which is available upon purchase, with the full Terms and Conditions included.

4) Stop being a filthy pirate, you filthy pirate!
Click to expand...

+1
 
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